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Tips to help stop being a pansy.

Original Post
Don Ferris III · · Boulder, CO · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 186

So my girlfriend, lovely as she may be, is a bit of a scaredy-cat. And I don't mean she's afraid of heights or won't push herself on lead to send that mega-proj, but she won't climb till she falls on top rope.

She's been climbing for 6 years and can send .11d (on tr) but as soon as she can no longer pull a move staticly, she backs down and gives up. She loves climbing and is totally happy top-roping for the rest of her life but she gets so pissed when she can't make it. I think she'd bump up a few grades if she would just go for it.

Any tips on helping her climb till she falls?

highaltitudeflatulentexpulsion · · Colorado · Joined Oct 2012 · Points: 35

Withhold sex?

Trad Princess · · Not That Into Climbing · Joined Jan 2012 · Points: 1,175

Wait.

Is this a diversion-spray, that your girl climbs 11d?

Blissab · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2009 · Points: 5

Please be careful when encouraging other people to excell or "push-it", even on TR. You don't want to press someone into something beyond their comfort level and risk an injury or a bad experience.

Your skill set is different than everyone else's

Provide positive thoughtful encouragement...but ultimately, be grateful that you have a girlfriend, wife or partner that is just happy to climb and enjoy the lifestyle.

I would guess that you could be a good climbing example on a route, while moving smoothly and gracefully and without "big moves". This could provide a sense of comfort to your girlfriend and allow her to judge whether or not to "go for it".

If my math is correct, "bump up a few grades from 11d" = 13d...my gosh, what more do you want?

She will know when she is ready to up the game.

Good luck!

Optimistic · · New Paltz · Joined Aug 2007 · Points: 450
Don Ferris wrote:So my girlfriend, lovely as she may be, is a bit of a scaredy-cat. And I don't mean she's afraid of heights or won't push herself on lead to send that mega-proj, but she won't climb till she falls on top rope. She's been climbing for 6 years and can send .11d (on tr) but as soon as she can no longer pull a move staticly, she backs down and gives up. She loves climbing and is totally happy top-roping for the rest of her life but she gets so pissed when she can't make it. I think she'd bump up a few grades if she would just go for it. Any tips on helping her climb till she falls?
You could check out the "Falling" chapter in Arno Ilgner's book "Espresso Lessons." Deals with this question in detail.

I would say that you're probably going to get a number of responses that say "just fall" or variations on that theme. Ilgner disagrees with this and says that there's a whole mindset (which he describes) to be developed, otherwise you're just playing tricks on yourself for short-term gain. I couldn't say yet, I'm still reading the book and haven't gone out and tried his technique.

Also, potentially you may not be the person to help her work through this. The boyfriend/girlfriend (and man/woman and maybe stronger climber/weaker climber) dynamics may add some layers to the situation that could make it harder for her to relax.

Lastly, she can't both be "totally happy" and "so pissed". If she's totally happy, maybe no change is needed?
saltlick · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 475

the answer, of course, is bouldering.

Monty · · Golden, CO · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 3,520

Suspend two large nuts from the back of her Subaru.

Aleks Zebastian · · Boulder, CO · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 175

Tell her she must think on Sven Lavransen and feel of her forearms becoming refreshed at crux!

J.C. Penny · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 15

Interest her in leading and let her do it on her own terms. If she is a static climber let her be a static climber. You cannot dictate for somebody to change their style just because you think they should. She will derive much pleasure from leading so it will take the center of attention from you and put it on her. The leader that she will be will be needing a lot of patience from you. Support her in every way.

Don Ferris III · · Boulder, CO · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 186

I've tried withholding sex but I gave in.

Blissab, I do provide encouragement and I wouldn't try to push her if she did care if she failed. I'm just trying to work with what she's comfortable with. I do like the comment about Being a good example. Also, I know you know I meant letter grades.

Optimistic, you bring up good points. I might not be the best person but we are each other's main climbing partners so I'll try to help. Also, as I mentioned above, she is totally happy top-roping as in she has no real desire to lead. She does however have an issue with failing that puts her in an instant bad mood. As a result she climbs easy for her most of the time.

Saltlick, funny she does really enjoy bouldering. Unfortunately, I am as far away from a boulderer as it gets. She must like the same things I do...kidding.

Climbing friend aleks, as the Sven thinking technique works so well for me I also advised her to do this. She told me to feel refreshed before climax. Has yet to work.

Leify Guy · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2013 · Points: 367

even if climbing statically is her style, it's something that she's going to have to get over if she wants to improve, while doing certain moves statically is a good practice, in other situations it's a huge waste of energy to try to pull up, lock off, and rainbow swing your arm to that high next hold... it basically comes down to her desire to progress, if she truly wants to progress she will have to make the decision to do things outside of her comfort zone and intentionally do moves dynamically... I'd recommend having her practice by climbing something a full number grade under her red point level (so like 10c/d) and have her determine to do as many dynamic movements as she possibly can.

Mark E Dixon · · Possunt, nec posse videntur · Joined Nov 2007 · Points: 974
Optimistic wrote: You could check out the "Falling" chapter in Arno Ilgner's book "Espresso Lessons." Deals with this question in detail.
Arno is coming to Colorado in February. If she is interested in changing her attitude, maybe take one of his seminars. Even if she still doesn't want to fall afterwards, I'll bet she'll learn something worthwhile.

warriorsway.com/colorado_20…
J.C. Penny · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 15
Don Ferris wrote:I've tried withholding sex but I gave in. Blissab, I do provide encouragement and I wouldn't try to push her if she did care if she failed. I'm just trying to work with what she's comfortable with. I do like the comment about Being a good example. Also, I know you know I meant letter grades. Optimistic, you bring up good points. I might not be the best person but we are each other's main climbing partners so I'll try to help. Also, as I mentioned above, she is totally happy top-roping as in she has no real desire to lead. She does however have an issue with failing that puts her in an instant bad mood. As a result she climbs easy for her most of the time. Saltlick, funny she does really enjoy bouldering. Unfortunately, I am as far away from a boulderer as it gets. She must like the same things I do...kidding. Climbing friend aleks, as the Sven thinking technique works so well for me I also advised her to do this. She told me to feel refreshed before climax. Has yet to work.
She does not know what she is missing that's why she is "happy toproping". She knows there is more to it that's why she is moody. She will be happier when she starts leading.

On a personal note: I top roped for 10 years when I first started climbing. Forced to lead at first I don't understand why I did not start earlier on. I assume it was because putting up and babysitting a new leader is quite a task. I went through partners like peanuts for the first year of my leading. Retired old timers were the most patient and best teachers.
FrankPS · · Atascadero, CA · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 276
Blissab wrote:Please be careful when encouraging other people to excell or "push-it", even on TR. You don't want to press someone into something beyond their comfort level and risk an injury or a bad experience. Your skill set is different than everyone else's Provide positive thoughtful encouragement...but ultimately, be grateful that you have a girlfriend, wife or partner that is just happy to climb and enjoy the lifestyle. I would guess that you could be a good climbing example on a route, while moving smoothly and gracefully and without "big moves". This could provide a sense of comfort to your girlfriend and allow her to judge whether or not to "go for it". If my math is correct, "bump up a few grades from 11d" = 13d...my gosh, what more do you want? She will know when she is ready to up the game. Good luck!
I think this is great advice. Her desire to try harder needs to come from within (grasshopper). If she wants to stop without trying hard enough to fall on toprope, that should be her call. I like to remind myself, sometimes, and some of my partners, "Hey, you're on a toprope and can't get hurt, so try the move." But I'll only say it once.

And it would be counterproductive to chide/criticize her for not trying harder.
SM Ryan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2008 · Points: 1,090

So she is only TRing or leading or both? If she is leading, does she get a soft catch?
Getting hard catches sucks and definitely makes you not want to go for it.

Does she want this? And if she does, why is she not talking to others on how to overcome whatever issue you think she has.

Don Ferris III · · Boulder, CO · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 186

If she would tr, fall and be completely ok with it. I never would have thought to find a remedy. The problem comes in when she gets pissed that she was unable to send. She's a great climber (very flowy and graceful not to mention strong as hell) but she wants to do better for her.

For those of you who lack reading comprehension, she only top ropes now and is fine with it. No real desire to lead. She's a hell of an athlete and a yogi so I figured she would want to lead and hone her mind and body thing. We had an agreement that when she onsighted an 11b on tr that she would give leading a try again. I was encouraging and she was open to it and excited. She lead a handful of times before she decided she would rather top rope. It's up to her and I support her in that.

P.s. The thread title was my attempt at humor/click-bait and from the amount of useful comments in such a quick period, I have no regrets. Thanks all.

P.p.s. I was going to title it "help me push my non crusher pussy girlfriend into becoming the awesome mega-proj sending girlfriend I've always wanted," but I thought THAT might be offensive.

Bill Shubert · · Lexington, MA · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 55

First let me say I'm in a similar place to your girlfriend, except my problem is lead. On TR I can try pretty much anything with no problem, but put my on lead and I'm too terrified to try anything remotely hard. When I've tried to force myself to do lead climbs, I find that rock climbing changes from fun to something I dread. So, while I want to do better on lead, I don't want it badly enough to take the fun out of climbing. So I do easy leads in the gym, clip drop to make falling less scary, and I'm hoping that in time I'll get more comfortable with it, but I don't push it.

My advice: Leave it up to her. Help her or give advice only when she asks for it. She likes climbing, and it would be a shame to change that because the two of you are hoping she'll climb harder.

SM Ryan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2008 · Points: 1,090

So she's a "yogi" and gets pissed as hell when she falls? Not much of a yogi if you ask me.

Also, until she leads she will always be considered a pansy (pussy) by some (I am a female, so I figure I can say this).

.

Don Ferris III · · Boulder, CO · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 186

Low blow SMR, low blow. But, while you're down there...

FrankPS · · Atascadero, CA · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 276
SMR wrote:So she's a "yogi" and gets pissed as hell when she falls? Not much of a yogi if you ask me. Also, until she leads she will always be considered a pansy (pussy) by some (I am a female, so I figure I can say this). .
Ignorant and insulting comments.
J.C. Penny · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2015 · Points: 15
Don Ferris wrote:If she would tr, fall and be completely ok with it. I never would have thought to find a remedy. The problem comes in when she gets pissed that she was unable to send. She's a great climber (very flowy and graceful not to mention strong as hell) but she wants to do better for her. For those of you who lack reading comprehension, she only top ropes now and is fine with it. No real desire to lead. She's a hell of an athlete and a yogi so I figured she would want to lead and hone her mind and body thing. We had an agreement that when she onsighted an 11b on tr that she would give leading a try again. I was encouraging and she was open to it and excited. She lead a handful of times before she decided she would rather top rope. It's up to her and I support her in that. P.s. The thread title was my attempt at humor/click-bait and from the amount of useful comments in such a quick period, I have no regrets. Thanks all. P.p.s. I was going to title it "help me push my non crusher pussy girlfriend into becoming the awesome mega-proj sending girlfriend I've always wanted," but I thought THAT might be offensive.
Dick!
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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