Techweenie 

FA: Unsure if Bruce Holthouse?. I was just hanging out with Bruce today at the Taos Cow looking out across the Pueblo and trying to pry some local climbing history out of him. Modest man. He never named the climbs and didn't record dates and detail. He doesn't recall who was on the first ascent with him on many of these lines because they were all done ground up, over several days, hand-drilling on lead, with any partner who was available. Good style. They'd get a 1/4 bolt or two done one day, lower off, then high-point it again on another day and repeat. The sort of talent that was around in Northern New Mexico at that time left a proud legacy. Bruce, Peter Prandoni, Doug Bridgers, Mike Roybal, Ed Jaramillo, Cayce Weber, et al. Some one should do the definitive "Riding Giants" movie for the Taos Mountain film festival. Or at least, add the names I left out (of ignorance) here. Cheers. Mike

Mike,

Bruce put up Techweenie drilling from stances? Amazing, I would have thought those routes were put up later than the 70s using sky hooks ala Bachar for bolting on lead. Any info on whether they were putting that stuff up while yoyoing?

Techweenie is the best route at TP for sure.

I have to verify this next week.

I am handicapped by the fact he claims he didn't name the FA's and is going on recollection for I am sure he hasn't read a recent guide (although I am certain Jay gave him a copy and DJ probably as well). I asked him about the routes on the mosaic wall (The steep wall left of Dirty Dihedral). Specifically, the steep routes up to the tree in the middle of the wall. He said he did a 11+/12- to the tree ground up bolting on lead with 1/4"ers which we guessed were rebolted in the 90's. I was assuming we were talking about "Techweenie".

Let me confirm. I typed the FA in at the cow when we were sitting together, but we could have this wrong. Now, I am getting just a mere inkling of the sort of concern Roper must have felt documenting the hx of the Big Ditch.
Let's wait and see,
Mike

Thanks for the info Mike. The route to the tree would not be Techweenie but the less enjoyable line to its right called Tech-No Star. I look forward to finding out if it was done using hooks versus stances. My interest is mostly to find out what the early folks were doing, not to slag on them for one style choice versus another.

This is really interesting detail, Mike. It's great you had the opportunity to sit down with Bruce and talk to him about these routes. The history of climbing at TP, and Northern NM in general, is not something I know a lot about so I find it fascinating to hear the details of these first ascents. Having been a bit spooked and stressed on a few of the routes at TP even knowing where the routes go and what to expect, it's amazing to think of Bruce and others just plain going for it into the unknown and placing bolts on lead. Incredible!

Just came along these posts. Neat to get some historical perspective on TP as I have spent many enjoyable days there.

In particular, I have climbed Techweenie several times (not recently) and am in even greater admiration of Bruce for establishing this route ground up!

I would rate Techweenie as 11c. One of the better routes at TP.

I don't want to start WW III here, but, Tech No-Star is a Doug Couleur / Lee Sheftel route, put up on lead by Couleur, maybe on sight. Tech Weenie is a Sheftel/Couleur route, put up on lead by Sheftel (I think we previewed this on TR). Techtonics is a Todd Bibler route, I don't know the style. To Bolt on Lead or Not to Bolt is a Couleur/Sheftel route, put up on sight on lead by Couleur, using small friends and stoppers wherever possible. All bolts were put in using hooks, although possibly from stances on one on TBOL.

These and other routes we did at TP were in the context of the controversy over bolting that was going on at the time. TP was a carry over of the White Rock bolt wars, although nothing at TP was chopped, at least not then. For example, Bolts to Nowhere was an attempt at ground up on sight. When we couldn't do it, instead of rap bolting, we left it for someone that could do it. By the way, the route immediately to the right of Bolts to Nowhere is In Step. I haven't been to TP in several years, so there may be stuff there that I am not aware of. Jay's guide seems to be missing a couple of things.

None of this is to take anything away from Bruce, who I haven't seen in years. My first climbing at TP was all on 1/4 inch bolts drilled by hand, a lot by Bruce, and they were bold routes then and now. Similarly, imagine all the routes on Torreon, Sandias, without the 3/8 inch bolts that are there now....

Thanks for the update on the FA information Doug. It is important to acknowledge the variety of ways routes at TP went in, be they ground-up with hooks or stances...or the dreaded rap-bolt. Nice job putting the Mosaic Wall routes up in an appropriate style, they would have been run-out nightmares if they were done with stance bolting if it would even be possible on some sections. With all due respect to those who think otherwise, not all the good routes went in at TP bolting at stances on lead and I don't think it somehow qualifies as the only good TP style.

There is nothing quite so satisfying as the ground-up onsight ascent; the adventure just keeps unfolding.

Doug, what 3/8" bolts are you referring to in the Sandias, new ones that sprouted on old routes or bolts in general on new routes?

Doug,
Thanks for correcting my error. No war worth fighting regardless. It is nice to give credit where it is due. Bruce would hardly take credit for his own routes if it weren't for me wanting to know the history. Any confusion would be mine. I know that Jay left the FA's out of his edition because it was difficult to track down. The value of this site is obvious for this type of documentation.
Do you know which route I might be talking about on that wall?
Salud y paz,
Mike

I climbed with Bruce today at TP. He led Clean Green Dream as a 30th anniversary celebration... He still feels that the route needs an upgrade. We also reviewed the line up the black streak on Mosaic Wall to the lone tree. He is pretty certain he did it ground up drilling from stances and or hooks. 4 or 5 1/4" inch bolts that look as though they are 3/8" now. Who knows.

Mike: If the line being discussed is #29 in Jay's book, called Tech No-Star, I put the 3/8 inch bolts in on lead, hanging on hooks, belayed by Lee Sheftel. There were no 1/4 inch bolts there. The tree had old slings. I recall someone telling me that Todd Skinner may have top roped the line, from the slings. Also, I named the route Ocho Diamentes ....

Doug, Great history with you and Lee...even Todd Skinner at TP? I hope you understand I am just trying to add bits of the story to the mystery surrounding some of these routes. It remains unclear which route Bruce did. Please add your and Lee's route to the database. Why Ocho Diamentes?

While I have your attention, did you and/or Lee ever climb routes over at the Bat Cave/Vista Verde area up river from Pilar? There are a number of 2 and 3 rawl bolt anchors with silicone under SMC hangers that the rest of us don't know the history of. Matt Samet thought Lee may have placed them and perhaps led a few of the cracks out there. Similar anchors down by some John Dunn climbs. Any thoughts?

Wow, this is an amazing and very interesting history to read after having just done Techweenie with no idea except Jay's guide and that it was the most interesting and coolest line on that section of the wall. I guessed that it was bolted ground up because of how well placed the bolts are, and the leftern zig it takes to a perfectly placed bolt. I thought it looked runout, but in fact I found it perfectly bolted for my lead taste. Excellent to catch up a bit on the ethic of development out there and partake just a little bit of this fun area. Thank you all for the hard work on it!

Awesome route. Found an offset brass nut pretty helpful to mediate the semi-runout after the second bolt.