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setting up a cordelette question
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By Kilroywashere!
From Harrisonburg, Virginia
Sep 29, 2010
Kilroy

alright so any instance where i've gotten to use a cordelette, its always been on a ledge large enough that i can pretty much stand on(seneca)
so my question is, whats the best way to clip into a cordelette so i can easily belay, if i clip into the master point im always way to close to the master point to comfortably belay...so whats the deal with that


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By Derek W
Sep 29, 2010
First summit of First Flatiron

Clip into the masterpoint and just let some more slack into your tie in so you aren't sucked up so tight. Also, rig your anchor higher, that will help too.


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By Scott McMahon
From Boulder, CO
Sep 29, 2010
Bocan

yep, just clove into it so you can adjust. I find I usally clip into the shelf and leave the masterpoint open for my second or whatever else.


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By Bawls E. Climber
Sep 29, 2010

Scott McMahon wrote:
yep, just clove into it so you can adjust. I find I usally clip into the shelf and leave the masterpoint open for my second or whatever else.


+1


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By Jeff G.
From Fort Collins
Sep 29, 2010
Nearing the end of Thank God Ledge.

I see many people use a clove as their only attachment to the anchor. Cloves can slip especially if not cinched down tight. A back up is a good idea or just tie into the anchor with a figure 8. Just an observation. You should, of course, do what you are comfortable with.


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By Scott McMahon
From Boulder, CO
Sep 29, 2010
Bocan

Jeff G. wrote:
I see many people use a clove as their only attachment to the anchor. Cloves can slip especially if not cinched down tight. A back up is a good idea or just tie into the anchor with a figure 8. Just an observation. You should, of course, do what you are comfortable with.


Good point, exactly why you HAVE to make sure that clove is set before you get comfy!! In my heart I agree with the backup, but then what's the point? You lose the adjustablity of the clove and you're better off just either using the rope eight or a PAS / runner. Backing up the clove just makes it a moot point unfortunately.


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By Derek W
Sep 29, 2010
First summit of First Flatiron

Maybe I don't have enough experience, but I've never seen a clove slip an inch under body weight. Plus, I never just throw a clove on and flop back against it over the edge, that's a bad idea no matter what. So I tie it, set it and lean back s.l.o.w.l.y.

What about this for a compromise? Tie in with a clove hitch and then throw in 5 feet of slack and tie in with a fig 8 back to yourself. That way if the clove fails you just go down to the fig 8? Cumbersome but then you have a backup and still room to adjust. I don't know, just throwing it out there.


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By Mike Minson
From Boulder, CO
Sep 29, 2010
Mike placing the number 6 on Rye Flake

Set your belay device to plaquette mode. Clip it into the master point. Use a longer tie in to the master point. You can also set a directional and clip into that as well if hanging can't be avoided.


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By JPVallone
Sep 29, 2010

Clove hitch is great, just set it, it's ajustability is the perk. It's right in front of your face too so you have eyes on and can monitor it.

For your set up , good advice here was to put the anchor up higher, but you can clip into the shelf of the cordelette for better belay management and then belay off of the master point. Seperates everything very nicely.

The shelf is one strand from each leg of the cordelette above the knot for the master point.

Make sure you are inside the loop of each leg, it is the same as being in the master point.

:-)


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By climbamt
Sep 29, 2010

The clove hitch is fine to attach yourself to the anchor and has numerous advantages to some of the newer PAS and daisy chains. here is a link to some testing done by the PCGA on cloves.

www.climbingguidesinstitute.org/site/images/pdf/observations>>>

-Gary


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By JPVallone
Sep 29, 2010

I would gladly prefer my rope directly to a clove in an anchor system over any daisy chain, or similar PAS system.

Daisy chains are for aid climbing folks.

Go to BD's website and find out for yourself, Daisy chains are misused everyday, everywhere.


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By Kilroywashere!
From Harrisonburg, Virginia
Oct 6, 2010
Kilroy

thanks all, i guess i'll go work anchors one day soon and play around with different clip in points, i like the idea of clipping into the shelf and keeping the master point open to the second, as well as free of more clutter..i always clip in with a sling and locker, never did like the idea of a daisy chain...


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By Rick Blair
From Denver
Oct 6, 2010
This is a novel auto blocking belay device.  I think it works quite well, depending on rope thickness and sheath quality, it belays very smooth.  Great to lower with.  You gotta love over engineering.  $3 at a gear swap!

Jeff G. wrote:
Cloves can slip especially if not cinched down tight.

Jeff,

I saw a test from one of the climbing companies ( I think ) on clove hitch slippage. The conclusion was that it is bomber, especially with dynamic rope. I think with dynamic there was almost no slippage, even with a poorly dressed clove. I will see if I can find it to post.


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By Aaron M
From Westminster, CO
Oct 6, 2010
Me

Rick Blair wrote:
Jeff, I saw a test from one of the climbing companies ( I think ) on clove hitch slippage. The conclusion was that it is bomber, especially with dynamic rope. I think with dynamic there was almost no slippage, even with a poorly dressed clove. I will see if I can find it to post.


I think that was a Trango test. They kept breaking biners before the clove hitch felled.


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By claramie
From Boulder, CO
Oct 6, 2010
Should I be trying this hard on a warmup? <br /> <br />photo by Rob Kepley

Wehling wrote:
What about this for a compromise? Tie in with a clove hitch and then throw in 5 feet of slack and tie in with a fig 8 back to yourself. That way if the clove fails you just go down to the fig 8? Cumbersome but then you have a backup and still room to adjust. I don't know, just throwing it out there.


Or just clove in, pull up extra slack and clip the backup to the most bomber piece in the anchor. Then if the first clove fails, you take a little fall onto the best piece... and you wouldn't have more bulk at your tie-in. This is basically how you fix a line for jugging or hauling a pig.


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By Scott McMahon
From Boulder, CO
Oct 6, 2010
Bocan

Clayton Laramie wrote:
Or just clove in, pull up extra slack and clip the backup to the most bomber piece in the anchor. Then if the first clove fails, you take a little fall onto the best piece... and you wouldn't have more bulk at your tie-in. This is basically how you fix a line for jugging or hauling a pig.


I actually like that idea alot. Then in a multi-pitch situation you can break down the anchor without having to re-clip to that piece. Once the leader comes off you can start dismantaling the anchor.


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