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By kirra
Mar 15, 2013
Arizona Mining Reform has just created a simple way to contact your Representatives and help Save Oak Flat Climbing.
Sincere thanks to everyone for any & all efforts -Climb On!

Please Contact your Representative NOW to stop the Oak Flat Land Exchange

On February 14, Valentine’s Day, Representatives Gosar (R-4th) and Kirkpatrick (D-1st) introduced the newest version of the Oak Flat land exchange. This new version, HR 687, is virtually identical to last year’s version of the land exchange (HR 1904). This is the 12 version of the land exchange that Rio Tinto has convinced Arizona members of Congress to introduce on their behalf, and is every bit as bad as HR 1904, which was the worst of the lot.

There are many reasons that this bill is a bad idea and should never have been reintroduced. Now that is has, we must stop this bill just like we have stopped the previous 11.

Please use the form below to contact your Representative and tell him or her to not support HR 687, the Oak Flat land exchange.

The HR 687 Oak Flat Land Exchange bill:

• Is the only bill that would turn over a Native American sacred site on public land to foreign mining companies and is opposed by every Indian Tribe in the United States.

• Would be the largest loss of public lands recreational climbing opportunities in history and is opposed by the Access Fund and other organizations that care about maintaining recreational opportunities on public land.

• Bypasses the normal process of permitting mines on public lands, avoids the NEPA process, and would destroy wildlife habitat and clean water resources.

• Benefits only two huge foreign mining companies at the expense of Arizona’s clean water, recreation, and economy.

Please take action Today.

To Send your message -See this link and input your Zip code

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Link to: Contact Phone Numbers - House Reps by State & Committee

Bill referred to Subcommittee on Energy & Mineral Resources -Feb 21st

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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By Ben Beard
From Superior, AZ
Mar 15, 2013
roo, my only son, the stare that takes down a herd of 'stock
You must have missed this meeting. No one person spoke on behalf of the company and no spokesman said anything about laying anyone off, just more misinformation from the anti miners. A majority of the actual residents spoke for the mine, and a majority of the visitors from Tucson, Phoenix, and elsewhere spoke against.
Of course mining isn't the only solution to Superior's problems. For the youth of Superior who don't want to become waiters at a local restaurant, I guess the current economic plan for them is to get a car and go start applying for work in Florence. What has climbing done for town of Superior? I dare you to ask any kid in town what a hanger is, a nut tool, or when (or what) Tufa Fest is.

You could always tune into 105.3fm and listen to the town meetings on Sunday evenings, in case you missed your flight.


kirra wrote:
It's official -Superior does not want this Mine in their backyard. Perhaps they can now be open to other ideas for business revenue. Mining is only 1 solution -it's not the only one. Town of Superior passes formal Resolution opposing Oak Flat Land Exchange On March 13, 2013, the town council of Superior, Arizona passed a unanimous resolution opposing HR 687, the latest version of the Oak Flat land exchange. The resolution passed following a town council meeting a week ago in which the town council took comments on their decision to oppose the land exchange and end a Mutual Benefits Agreement with Rio Tinto. At that meeting, the majority of comments supported the town decision. Superior Town Council meeting During the council meeting Rio Tinto threatened to lay off it's workers if the town passed the resolution. This is similar to a threat Rio Tinto made last November to lay off most of their workers is the previous version of the land exchange, HR 1904, was not approved by Congress. There is no word yet whether Rio Tinto will follow through with their threat now that the resolution has been passed. Copy of Resolution No.451

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By kirra
Mar 16, 2013
Ben Beard wrote:
..."What has climbing done for town of Superior?

They pick up your trash -thanks for the radio tip

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By kirra
Mar 16, 2013
The current bill H.B.687 is the same one that passed as H.R.1904 in the last session of Congress.

How did your Representative Vote?

FINAL VOTE RESULTS H.R 1904 Oct. 26,2011 4:59 PM

Republican... Ayes 228.....No 8.....Didn't vote 5
Democratic..............7.......178.............7

Listing of Votes by Representative

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By Ben Beard
From Superior, AZ
Mar 16, 2013
roo, my only son, the stare that takes down a herd of 'stock
kirra wrote:
They pick up your trash -thanks for the radio tip


The town of Superior may need that service here soon. From what I heard, the town couldn't pay their trash collection bill and was threatened by the waste company over it recently. Pretty telling about the condition of the town and the town council when we can't pay our bills, but they'll send people to DC to speak out against RCM.

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By kirra
Mar 18, 2013
Lobbying Dollar$ $pent- Rio Tinto Group -

2012 = $1.1 Million
2010-2011 = $1.9 Mill
2009 = $1.5 Mill
2008 = $1.5 Mill

We're most likely looking at similar money trees for 2013 -some familiar friends, some not..

Listing of Lobbyists H.R.1904: S.E.Arzona Land Giveaway Act of 2011

Your Voice & your Vote are the most pricele$$ assets "We the people" have to give. Tell your Representatives & Senators this week how you feel about loosing Oak Flat forever because no 1 can tell your story 4U

Happy St.Patty's Day to my Irish friends: Is fhearr fheuchainn na bhith san duil -

"It is better to try than to hope"


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By kirra
Mar 20, 2013
Many people have left for D.C. and the Hearing is TOMORROW - today is the last day your info should be on some desk in the House of Reps.

I know Geir must already have his Calls & Letters in but just in case he's late like a few of us, this may help --->> Bill H.R.687 will be heard by:

Subcommittee on Energy and Mineral Resources

---------quick phone & fax numbers -------------


Repubs ---

CHAIRMAN
Doug Lamborn
– Colorado, 5th District
ph: 202-225-4422 | fx: (202) 226-2638

Louie Gohmert - Texas, 1st District
ph: (202) 225-3035 | fx: (202) 226-1230

Rob Bishop - Utah, 1st District
ph: (202) 225-0453 | fx: (202) 225-5857

Rob Wittman - Virginia, 1st District
ph: (202) 225-4261 | fx: (202) 225-4382

Paul C. Broun - Georgia, 10th District
ph: (202) 225-4101 | fx: (202) 226-0776

John Fleming - Louisiana, 4th District
ph: (202) 225-2777 | fx: (202) 225-8039

Glenn 'GT' Thompson - Pennsylvania, 5th District
ph: (202) 225-5121 | fx: (202) 225-5796

Cynthia Lummis – Wyoming, At-large
ph: (202) 225-2311 | fx: (202) 225-3057

Dan Benishek - Michigan, 1st District
ph: (202) 225-4735 | fx: (202) 225-4710

Jeff Duncan - South Carolina, 3rd District
ph: (202) 225-5301 | fx: (202) 225-3216

Paul Gosar - Arizona, 4th District
ph: (202) 225-2315 | fx: (202) 226-9739

Bill Flores - Texas, 17th District
ph: (202) 225-6105 | fx: (202) 225-0350

Mark Amodei - Nevada, 2nd District
ph: (202) 225-6155 | fx: (202) 225-5679

Steve Daines - Montana, At-large
ph: (202) 225-3211 | fx: (202) 225-5687

Kevin Cramer - North Dakota, At-large
ph: (202) 225-2611 | fx: (202) 226-0893

EX-OFFICIO
Doc Hastings
- Washington, 4th District
ph: (202) 225-5816 | fx: (202) 225-3251


Democats ---

RANKING MEMBER
Rush Holt
- New Jersey, 12th District
ph: (202) 225-5801 | fx: (202) 225-6025

Steven Horsford - Nevada, 4th District
ph: (202) 225-9894 | fx: (202) 225-9783

Matthew Cartwright - Pennsylvania, 17th District
ph: (202) 225-5546 | fx: (202) 226-0996

Jim Costa - California, 20th District
ph: (202) 225-2778 | fx: (202) 226-0346

Niki Tsongas - Massachusetts, 3rd District
ph: (202) 225-3411 | fx: (202) 226-0771

Jared Huffman - California, 2nd District
ph: (202) 225-5161 | fx: (202) 225-5163

Alan Lowenthal - California, 47th District
ph: (202) 225-7924 | fx: (202) 225-7926

Peter DeFazio - Oregon, 4th District
ph: (202) 225-6416 | fx: (202) 226-3493

Tony Cardenas - California, 29th District
ph: (202) 225-6131 | fx: (202) 225-0819

Raúl M.Grijalva - Arizona, 7th District
ph: (202) 225-2435 | fx: (202) 225-1541

Colleen Hanabusa - Hawaii, 1st District
ph: (202) 225-2726 | fx: (202) 225-0688

Joe Garcia - Florida, 26th District
ph: (202) 225-2778 | fx: (202) 226-0346

EX-OFFICIO
Edward J. Markey
- Massachusetts, 7th District
ph: 202-225-2836 | fx: (202) 226-0092

-----------------------------------------------

etc and reminding our manners...

Official address:

The Honorable (Full name)
United States House of Representatives
(Fax Address)


Chairman of committee/subcommittee:

The Honorable (Full name)
Chairman (Committee/Subcommittee name)
United States House of Representatives
(Fax Address)

Letter salutation:
Dear Mr./Ms. (surname):

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By Ben Watson
From Tempe, AZ
Mar 20, 2013
Rappelling from Mt. Gilbert
Thanks for compiling this list, Kirra.
Faxed my letters to several subcommittee members, including Mr. Lamborn, as well as another to Mr. McCain on the Senate side. Here's to hoping it has an impact -- it certainly is worth the small bit of effort.

FLAG
 
By Geir
From Tucson, AZ
Mar 20, 2013
Toofast
Thanks Kirra for your hard work. Also thanks to everyone who is taking time to voice opposition to this bill.

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By Curt Shannon
Mar 20, 2013
Just FYI for those who may be interested--tomorrow's hearing in the House Energy & Mineral Resources subcommittee can be viewed live at 7am Arizona time.

naturalresources.house.gov/liv...

The hearing will cover 7 separate bills including H.R. 687, so I expect that it will be somewhat lengthy.

Curt

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By BlueFrog
Mar 21, 2013
Here's the AZ Republic article about today's meeting:

azcentral.com/news/politics/ar...

Watching the House meeting online now...these men with dollar signs in their eyes look dangerous. Calm, methodical, not unlike mad doctors.

Let's hear it for Raul Grijalva and the representative for the Superior Town Council who are speaking up for Oak Flat!

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By Ben Watson
From Tempe, AZ
Mar 21, 2013
Rappelling from Mt. Gilbert
BlueFrog wrote:
Let's hear it for Raul Grijalva and the representative for the Superior Town Council who are speaking up for Oak Flat!
Absolutely! Terry Rambler was very concise and deliberate with his reasons for supporting the preservation of Oak Flat too.

One question on a topic that keeps coming up...
If the copper ore pocket located beneath Oak Flat is truly worth extracting (obviously $billions$ to be made), why can't Resolution Copper (Rio Tinto / BHP) offer up NEPA / watershed / environmental impact studies a priori, before moving forward with any privatization of the protected land, as to simply gain the trust of all the stakeholders concerned with preserving the natural character to Oak Flat and its adjacent areas?

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By BlueFrog
Mar 21, 2013
Ben,

Grijalva actually answered your question at the hearing by saying that he feels that RC's plans would not survive the transparency and public input that NEPA would require. In other words, RC likely believes it has little chance of succeeding if it needs approval for its plans prior to a land exchange. There has to be merit to this statement, otherwise why has the company insisted on a non-NEPA process with so many consecutive failed bills?

Chairman Rambler was very impressive, and it was a great showing by Soyla Peralta from Superior too.

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By Curt Shannon
Mar 22, 2013
BlueFrog wrote:
Ben, Grijalva actually answered your question at the hearing by saying that he feels that RC's plans would not survive the transparency and public input that NEPA would require. In other words, RC likely believes it has little chance of succeeding if it needs approval for its plans prior to a land exchange. There has to be merit to this statement, otherwise why has the company insisted on a non-NEPA process with so many consecutive failed bills? Chairman Rambler was very impressive, and it was a great showing by Soyla Peralta from Superior too.


The crux to RCM is the 760 acre withdrawn parcel called the Oak Flat campground. Documents released under a FOIA request made to the Forest Service show that the Forest Service has been repeatedly asked since the 1970's (by ASARCO and others) to consider lifting the 1955 withdrawal from mining and to allow mining appropriation of the Oak Flat area. Each and every time the Forest Service has been asked, they have replied that the Oak Flat area is still a heavily used area for camping and other recreational purposes--and thus the original withdrawal of the area for those purposes is still valid. RCM knows full well that another appeal made through the normal and proper process of mine approval (through the USFS) would similarly fail. They have therefore been attempting to bypass that process (and NEPA) via a legislative land exchange for the last 8 years.

Curt

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By BlueFrog
Mar 22, 2013
Here's a well written account with photos of yesterday's hearing in the House about Resolution Copper.

cronkitenewsonline.com/2013/03...

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By ClimbandMine
Mar 23, 2013
kirra wrote:
Lobbying Dollar$ $pent- Rio Tinto Group - 2012 = $1.1 Million 2010-2011 = $1.9 Mill 2009 = $1.5 Mill 2008 = $1.5 Mill


That's all?

How much did the Audobaun Society, Sierra Club, etc. spend?

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By ClimbandMine
Mar 23, 2013
Dale Evans wrote:
ClimbandMine is correct here. In Block caving they gently coax out the underpinnings of the earth's surface leaving an undisturbed and paradise like surface. See images here: No brute force needed Can we send the 400 out of work miners to Rio Tinto's operation in Utah to deal with the 9000 acres of tailings that are totally improving the health and well being of the locals there?


You misquoted what I said, and you know it. That sort of behavior is exactly why Rio Tinto shouldn't give in to people like you. You accuse them of distortion then turn around and do it yourself.

BTW, I know where that mine is and it proves my point. The footprint of the mine is less than half the depth of Resolution, and the "crater" you see is less than half the diameter of the mine footprint underground.

Bingham has been in operation since 1906. Kennecott has been reclaiming tailings. There are over 100 years of tailings, most that were unregulated as they were put down prior to the laws and knowledge governing them. You want them to be able to teleport, too?

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By BGBingham
Mar 23, 2013
night ice
ClimbandMine wrote:
BTW, I know where that mine is and it proves my point. The footprint of the mine is less than half the depth of Resolution, and the "crater" you see is less than half the diameter of the mine footprint underground.


What you don't mention and what is quite pertinent, is how far along in the mining process is the mine in question? The surface expression in that photo may be just the beginning of subsidence.

On the other hand Resolution has published cross section and oblique views of their subsidence zone and it is substantial. A depth of 850 feet and over a mile long. This takes it well below the bottom of Devil's canyon - and another orebody adjacent which they own and don't mention in any of their press releases.

These are the sort of things (and there are plenty) that should be presented to the public before public land is given to a corporation.

Additionally, RCM and its elected proponents, such as Congressman Gosar, continue to view and treat critics only as "opposition". Black and white thinking - no nuance with this crew. They play with words and withhold information as a matter of course. No wonder they have been unsuccessful.

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By ClimbandMine
Mar 24, 2013
BGBingham wrote:
What you don't mention and what is quite pertinent, is how far along in the mining process is the mine in question? The surface expression in that photo may be just the beginning of subsidence. On the other hand Resolution has published cross section and oblique views of their subsidence zone and it is substantial. A depth of 850 feet and over a mile long. This takes it well below the bottom of Devil's canyon - and another orebody adjacent which they own and don't mention in any of their press releases. These are the sort of things (and there are plenty) that should be presented to the public before public land is given to a corporation. Additionally, RCM and its elected proponents, such as Congressman Gosar, continue to view and treat critics only as "opposition". Black and white thinking - no nuance with this crew. They play with words and withhold information as a matter of course. No wonder they have been unsuccessful.


I didn't say because I don't know for sure.

I do know the mine I worked at for 7 years was 40 years into its mine life and it broke vertical to surface from all its production areas.

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By Dale Evans
Mar 24, 2013
ClimbandMine
I am uncertain what you feel I distorted. You took exception when someone said that Block Caving was a brute force operation.I feel that your attempt to imply that this practice is gentle, natural, and not destructive was argumenative and a distortion of fact. The land left is unusable for current and future user groups.
The depression I pictured in my post you say is small considering the volume of earth missing underneath.So in fact a much larger surface area is unusable than just the already depressed area?
So we should not strive to correct the shortcomings of the past? No need to teleport, we can work on these issues now. Recovery of tailings seem like a job that out of work miners would be well suited to.

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By ClimbandMine
Mar 24, 2013
Dale Evans wrote:
ClimbandMine I am uncertain what you feel I distorted. You took exception when someone said that Block Caving was a brute force operation.I feel that your attempt to imply that this practice is gentle, natural, and not destructive was argumenative and a distortion of fact. The land left is unusable for current and future user groups. The depression I pictured in my post you say is small considering the volume of earth missing underneath.So in fact a much larger surface area is unusable than just the already depressed area? So we should not strive to correct the shortcomings of the past? No need to teleport, we can work on these issues now. Recovery of tailings seem like a job that out of work miners would be well suited to.


Gee, you wonder why I feel distorted?

Nowhere did I say that block caving was gentle (you obviously haven't stood next to a running drawpoint or active cave face) or destructive. I said natural forces (gravity / geology) were used. Open pit and other underground methods could be characterized as brute force. Block caving utilizes the fewest pounds of explosives per ton of ore extracted - I would characterize explosives per ton as a good metric of brute force, et tu?

I also didn't say the pictured depression is small relative to volume, I said it was smaller than the diameter of the extraction level (implying what the cave angle was).

And I mentioned that tailings at Kennecott were being worked on now, as far as I know. Tailings recovery and reprocessing is a separate issue that you didn't mention before and I don't know enough about that particular facility to comment on it.

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By Dale Evans
Mar 24, 2013
After reading your replies I understand why you feel distorted and why no one else bothers to recognize your posts.

I apologize to everyone for feeding the Troll!

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By BlueFrog
Mar 26, 2013
AZ Highways has published a new camping guidebook that features Oak Flat Campground as one of the "best campgrounds in AZ."

shoparizonahighways.com/arizon...

AZ Highways guidebook with Oak Flat Campground
AZ Highways guidebook with Oak Flat Campground

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By Red
From Arizona
Mar 26, 2013
Cobra Kai
That's awesome BlueFrog!

So is this excerpt from the hearing last week:

"Kirkpatrick said her district was “hit hard by the recession” and could use an influx of jobs and tax revenue. But she said environmental impacts of mining will need to be addressed before the bill can go through. She is considering amendments to protect land and water in the area."


While Gosar on the other hand...:

"Gosar said there is no reason for delay and that opponents simply do not understand the facts.
“This is a good bill all the way through,” Gosar said. “I’m not here to compromise a bill just to get people to get on board.”
Gosar said he would be open to compromise, he said he has not seen any efforts by oppponents to alter their stance.
“We’re grasping at straws, basing not on facts but on hearsay,” he said."


Gosar and everyone else are all missing the (NEPA) facts.

Full NEPA *before* land swap.

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By kirra
May 18, 2013
Followup on House Bill -Voting record May 15 - 2013 :

Adopted and favorably reported this bill in committee was agreed upon by 23 yeas - 19 nays

H.R.687 moves forward and now must be approved on the House floor

I encourage all to write/call your local state representatives ASAP to insure a "No" vote prevails on H.R.687. Current contact info is listed here in this thread.

sincere thanks!

save it -don't sink it
save it -don't sink it

FLAG


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