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Red River Gorge vs. New River Gorge

Original Post
Ladd Raine · · Plymouth, NH · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 5,505

Which do you like better?
Why?
For sport?
For trad?
For the better mix?

Jim Matt · · Cincinnati, OH · Joined Sep 2003 · Points: 255

Good question. I've only been to the New once (we are going over Memorial Day...we're still looking for a fourth to join our party of three) but the Red is famous for overhanging, pumpy, strenuous routes (this is a gross generalization, of course). My impression of the New is that it is a bigger and more spread out area, with a greater variety of routes.

Ladd Raine · · Plymouth, NH · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 5,505

I've guided at the New for 2 seasons.
I've gone to the Red for 3 spring breaks in a row.

I'm not the most experienced person to be making a judgement here. However I'll make one with regards to my experience.

The Red is so fun. Trad line that are pure, self-evident, long and beautiful. Sport climbs with long moves, big throws, pockets, and many no-hands rests. I love the rope streching lines that provide clean falls, and a gigantic pump. Especially now with the addition of Muir Valley and the Pendergass-Murray preserve the Red has almost(I could be wrong) as many climbs as the New.

The New is the best the East Coast has to offer for single pitch, both trad and sport. This is due to the varied nature of the cliffs, from dramatic roofs to slabs, horizontal cracks with dynos in between and body tension heavy 5.9s. There is such a high density of climbing here in grades from 5.4 to 5.13 it is amazing for both trad and sport. Climbing here doesn't require much in the way of biceps, but it will challenge your technique almost as much as Rumney, and it'll give you a forearm pump along with it. The New has more climbs than the Red, especially if you include Summersville, and the Meadows River areas.

In my book they are both awesome. They both hold dear places in my heart, the Red holds my first 5.11 sport, the New my first 5.11 trad. They both have such unique styles that climbers will come from one to the another and have to drop at least a whole number grade, even though the rock type and texture is the same.

I love them both, for different reasons.

I guess that is why I'm so interested in hearing other's opinions.

Chris Chaney · · Stanton, Kentucky · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 5,046
Jim Matt wrote: My impression of the New is that it is a bigger and more spread out area, with a greater variety of routes.
My impression was that the new had less in terms of variety. The Red has so many different types of climbs and even similar climbs have vastly differing geologic features and the walls all have a unique character, almost as if instead of one cohesive geologic area, you have literally hundreds of unique pockets of similar, but different crags.

I thought the New was unintersting and boring aesthetically. THe routes (at least at Summersville) seemed close in nature to RRG routes, but were still painfully monotonous.
Hank Caylor · · Livin' in the Junk! · Joined Dec 2003 · Points: 643

The New, hands down. And not just because of the sweet BASE jumping either. Cooler little town(Fayeteville), more diverse routes, and better camping(Rogers) I think. The Red has it goin on, no doubt. But I like the New. The most cops I have EVER seen around Fayeteville though.

Jay Young · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2007 · Points: 0

I don't have the experience at the Red to compare the two, but I've climbed all over the country for well over 20 years and I think the New is paradise. I love the bullet sandstone rising from lush forests, but then, I guess the Red also has that. I love how sport and trad lines live happily right next to each other, but then, I guess the Red has that to some extent, too. Hmm... maybe I need to get to the Red.

But the Red does not have Fayetteville, which, IMO, is the best place to live on Earth.

James Beissel · · Boulder, CO · Joined Aug 2004 · Points: 905

The Red makes The New squeal like a pig.

Jay Young · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2007 · Points: 0

The Red has a purdier mouth.

Tom Helvie · · Bishop, CA · Joined Jul 2006 · Points: 1,670

New River, without a doubt. I do love the Red (especially the fluffy grades) but in my mind it lacks the variety. If you want to tug on overhanging jugs it is top notch. The Red has some pretty good cracks as well. The New has a more even spread of technical routes, slabs, overhanging routes and cracks. Both of them have shitty weather and both of them have rainy day routes and both of them start seeping if it rains to much. Most of all I like the New better because it's less crowded. The Red attracts more people because jug hauling is "in" and soft grades pull in the crowds. The New is empty in comparison, which is a good thing... a very good thing. And Roger is a way bigger pervert than Miguel and therefore, much more fun to talk to.
Anyway, its not really worth arguing about, 'cause there close enough together that you can travel back and forth.
As far as living at either place...Fayetteville or Slade? no thanks to either.

Julian Smith · · Colorado Springs, CO · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 2,140

Hmmmm... I moved to Colorado about 10 years ago now... 'nugh said..;-)

Dylan Randall · · Nashville, TN · Joined Sep 2012 · Points: 615

With the addition of a plethora of new routes to both the Red and the New over the past 7 years (since this thread was active), I think this question should be revived. Have at it!

Dylan Randall · · Nashville, TN · Joined Sep 2012 · Points: 615
Jake Jones wrote:I can't compare because I haven't been to both. I will say though that the New is 3.5 hours closer and the scene, rock and people are the best I've ever encountered so I don't really have an urge to explore many other destinations anymore as far as single pitch cragging goes.
That's exactly how I felt about the Red. I haven't been to the New but the Red had such an amazing scene and an incredible amount of unique pocketed climbs, I felt I never needed to travel to its brethren. Yet, I revived this thread to get opinions regarding the pros and cons of both!!
5.samadhi Süñyātá · · asheville · Joined Jul 2013 · Points: 40

Versus thread thats hilarious. Like are they wrestling, boxing or what?

Honedtly its a retarded question. They both have pluses and minuses.

Dylan Randall · · Nashville, TN · Joined Sep 2012 · Points: 615
5.samadhi wrote:Versus thread thats hilarious. Like are they wrestling, boxing or what? Honedtly its a retarded question. They both have pluses and minuses.
If you read my previous post you would see that I revived the thread to highlight those pros and cons to help define each area. This isn't supposed to be a battle.
5.samadhi Süñyātá · · asheville · Joined Jul 2013 · Points: 40

true, though the wording is hilarious. Battle on the east coast who will be the victor!

Just go to the areas - it quickly becomes evident based on your own personal needs which you will favor (if either, plenty people love them equally).

My two cents based on my own experience: the climbing at the red is better but the aesthetics of the new (the lines themselves and the wilderness) are better.

Thats just me though. Why ruin your own exploration by some guy's opinion on the internet before you have a solid basis of experience to form your own opinion? :)

Brian Adzima · · San Francisco · Joined Sep 2006 · Points: 560

I am pretty sure the red already has a lot more developed routes. In terms of potential routes the red wins hands down. Both are pretty rain prone, but there are more routes you can climb in the rain at the red. The summers at both can be brutal.

In terms of route quality both places blow most western cliffs out of the water, but the short seasons, weather, lack of partners and medicore (and expensive) camping really evens out the choice between west and east in the end.

chopsticktown Moore · · Blandon, PA · Joined Sep 2011 · Points: 10

I will bite...

These are just my opinion based on my three trips to each place.

The climbing: The New is generally known for technical face climbs while the Red is know for overhanging jug hauls. You can find numerous styles of climbing at each area including jug hauls, face climbs, slabs, splitter cracks etc... It just happens to be that my two favorite styles of climbing are jug hauls and face climbs.

The rock: The rock at the New is very bullet hard and has some the coolest features I've seen. The Red's rock is a bit softer and a bit more sandy then the New. Both have very great rock for climbing IMO.

The climbing scene. Miguel's Pizza at the Red is known as the "Hub of Climbing culture at the Red" and I couldn't agree more. The atmosphere at Miguel's is one of the big reason I am pulled down there. I feel like there isn't that cultural hub at the New. I first went to the New after Roger's campground closed and heard people say that was the Miguel's of the New. I never camped at the AAC campground but to me that would seem like a logical place to have a cultural hub.

Food,camping,supplies...ETC The New is very convenient when it comes to this category. You can go from climbing to a Wal-Mart and then get your tanked filled in a very short amount of time. Just about everything you need is in Fayettville; Fast food,gas stations, Wal-Mart, Lowes the list goes on. Up the road in Summersville is very similar to what is in Fayettvile. The Red seems to be more secluded and one of the last times I was there we traveled quite a bit to get groceries. The most popular place to eat at the Red is obviously Miguel's. There are a few other places to eat around there but the options are spread far. Another option for the Red would be drive the hour towards Lexington to have a large choice of options. I've never camped at Miguel's but I prefer a more quiet approach when it comes to camping. I heard AAC campground has almost the same camping scene as Miguel's. Both places have an option of quiet camping. My two favorites are Chestnut Creek Campground at the New and Lago Linda at the Red.

General Aesthetics The New wins this category hands down. Topping out on some climbs at the New will reward you with an awesome view of the river or bridge or both! I like how the crags are situated above the river. Over at Summersville the views of the lake are pretty sweet. The Red will give you a more an out there in the middle of nowhere feel which is cool too. The sandstone arches or Natural Bridges are a cool site to see as well. If you like to be in the middle of nowhere, the Red is for you.

Take this post with a grain of salt. These are my observations. I say try both areas and see for yourself. I love both areas equally and love the climbing at both.

Go ahead and fire away... I might have forgot a few things so feel free to add.

5.samadhi Süñyātá · · asheville · Joined Jul 2013 · Points: 40

^ there's a grocery store 10 miles down the highway in Stanton at the Red (12 miles from Miguel's).

Don't climb out west if THATS your definition of far :D

chopsticktown Moore · · Blandon, PA · Joined Sep 2011 · Points: 10

I've never been out West yet...

That's the grocery store I was talking about.

Ben Circello · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2009 · Points: 95
Brian Adzima wrote:I am pretty sure the red already has a lot more developed routes. In terms of potential routes the red wins hands down. Both are pretty rain prone, but there are more routes you can climb in the rain at the red. The summers at both can be brutal. In terms of route quality both places blow most western cliffs out of the water, but the short seasons, weather, lack of partners and medicore (and expensive) camping really evens out the choice between west and east in the end.
I can't speak for the New, but the Red has some of the cheapest camping and easiest to find partners I've ever encountered.

The only cheaper camping I've encountered is free.
Ryan Watts · · Bishop, CA · Joined Apr 2013 · Points: 25
Brian Adzima wrote:In terms of route quality both places blow most western cliffs out of the water
Lol.
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Southern States
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