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Re-slinging rigid stem cams, am I gonna die?...
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By Danger-Russ Gordon
From Tempe, AZ
Apr 9, 2013
Slope on a rope

So I recently got a hold of 4 rigid stem friends, and the slings needed some TLC. I got these guys for 5 bucks a pop, and the cams themselves are in very decent shape. That being said the dirt bag in me really does not want to spend more money on re-slinging the cams than I paid for them.

Basically, what I am wondering is if its considered acceptable (and fundamentally safe) to just take some 5.5 titan spectra cord and tie a double fisherman and call it good? In the attached picture i used some cord I found lying around my house, but it just shows the idea of what I'm talking about. If anyone has some ideas on the best way to re-sling cams like this i'd love to hear them (excluding the obvious option of sending them out to a shop)

Thanks

Re-Slinging idea
Re-Slinging idea


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By bearbreeder
Apr 9, 2013

Youll be fine

use a triple fishermans with spectra


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By Arlo F Niederer
From Fort Collins, CO
Apr 10, 2013

Slinging friends with cordage was the original way they were used.

I'm still here, so I can attest that it works. Early stoppers, hexes, and tube chocks used cordage safely for many years.

I've used supertape with a ring bend knot, but these tend to come untied so you have to constantly check them.

You should consider whether spectra is the best cord to use. Kevlar was the strongest and really popular when it first came out, but then it was discovered that it would weaken rapidly when fatigued by continued bending, as in tying knots.

I'd just do a little research and put the largest cord that will fit the size hole in the stem.

Here's an interesting web page with images of how "it used to be done." Many of the early "hard" free climbs were led on this type of gear."

www.needlesports.com/NeedleSports/nutsmuseum/nutsstory.htm


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By Robbie Brown
From Flagstaff, AZ
Apr 10, 2013
Jumping across the mace gap with a PBR

YER GANNA DIE!!


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By Danger-Russ Gordon
From Tempe, AZ
Apr 10, 2013
Slope on a rope

Hey Arlo, thanks a million for the input and links, I really appreciate it.


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By Jon H
From Boulder
Apr 10, 2013
At the matching crux

I'm not sure of any other cordage that's surpassed Titan cord for slinging rigid friends. You'll be fine, just make sure to use a triple (not double) fisherman and leave plenty of tail - at least 3". Also, replace it more frequently than you would think to with regular accessory cord.

9/16" supertape or 12mm ultratape (nylon/spectra blend) is probably a bit better and would last longer, but would require that you send them out for bar tacking.


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By verticon
From Europe
Apr 10, 2013

Robbie Brown wrote:
YER GANNA DIE!!


Yeah, but it doesn't matter how many cams you'll sling, you'll die only once!


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By wivanoff
Apr 10, 2013
High Exposure

You'll be fine. $5 a pop is a great deal. I'm pretty sure the first RSFs I bought years ago came without any cordage at all. We'd typically sling them with tape and a ring bend.

I still have a set of RSFs that I now use as duplicates for my C4s. They are all slung with Maxim Tech cord as "Gunks Tie Offs" with triple fisherman's knots. I use longer cordage than what is usually shown because I use only the Gunks tie off - nothing on the end of the stem.

WC Gunks Tie Off

WC Forged Friends Hints

As far as Kevlar vs Spectra vs Technora, here's something I wrote over on RC. com Tech Cords


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By Dylan B.
Apr 10, 2013
Orgasm Direct, Devil's Lake, 5.11a  c. 2008

Why not just girth hitch an 8mm Mammut sling to the cam? Would the hitch weaken the sling too much?


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By wivanoff
Apr 10, 2013
High Exposure

D.Buffum wrote:
Why not just girth hitch an 8mm Mammut sling to the cam? Would the hitch weaken the sling too much?


A Basket Hitch might be better. I've done that with TCUs.
dmmclimbing.com/knowledge/improvisation-larks-foot-or-basket>>>


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By will smith
From boulder
Apr 10, 2013

Looks like you have a # 1 ridged stemmed friend among the mix be prepared to get it stuck, the shaft and the cam sizes when closed are very close easy to over cam then no room to work the cam loose. I have found more # 1 ridged friends stuck than anything else.


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By pooler
From Albany, NY
Apr 10, 2013

+1 for the "Gunks Tie off"


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By Dylan B.
Apr 10, 2013
Orgasm Direct, Devil's Lake, 5.11a  c. 2008

wivanoff wrote:
A Basket Hitch might be better. I've done that with TCUs. dmmclimbing.com/knowledge/improvisation-larks-foot-or-basket>>>


I'm really surprised to see that girth hitching two wires is weaker than a sling to a wire. I would never have considered putting a sling directly through a wire, because it seems like it would cut too easily. And since this demo doesn't include any lateral motion or sawing, I'd still be hesitant to put them through a wire.

On the other hand, it looks like a basket hitch on a cam would be perfectly acceptable.


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By Hard Landin' Brandon
From Happy Camp, CA
Apr 10, 2013
Gneiss day for climbing in Western Massachusetts!  Time to put some scratches on that new #4 cam.

wivanoff wrote:
A Basket Hitch might be better.

This is how I've reslung my old rigid friends. I also slipped a tube of 1" webbing over the sling to protect it from abrasion, as I first saw it done here:
www.kakibusok.plus.com/Equipment/ReslingCams/Resling.htm
Here's what that looks like on one of my cams:
Reslung rigid stem friend
Reslung rigid stem friend


Reslung rigid stem friend
Reslung rigid stem friend


Reslung rigid stem friend
Reslung rigid stem friend

The caveat here is that you must never ever clip into just one loop of the sling. For this reason, I have a policy of never removing that biner, and I make sure anyone else using my gear is aware of the unconventional setup. This isn't always ideal, but I'm happy with it.


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By wivanoff
Apr 10, 2013
High Exposure

Hard Landin' Brandon wrote:
I also slipped a tube of 1" webbing over the sling to protect it from abrasion.....The caveat here is that you must never ever clip into just one loop of the sling.


Good idea.

Similar thing here. I added a bit of my blue and yellow plastic ID tape to keep the loops together as shown on the yellow sling. Prevents clipping only one loop.
The red vs yellow is kind of a before/after taping.

TCU basket hitch
TCU basket hitch


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Apr 10, 2013
...

Those open slings probably cost more than a resling would cost.


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By wivanoff
Apr 10, 2013
High Exposure

Locker wrote:
Those open slings probably cost more than a resling would cost.


That's probably true, Locker. I just happened to have some laying around unused.

There's also the idea that some places won't resling gear that they deem to be too old.


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By Hard Landin' Brandon
From Happy Camp, CA
Apr 10, 2013
Gneiss day for climbing in Western Massachusetts!  Time to put some scratches on that new #4 cam.

Locker wrote:
Those open slings probably cost more than a resling would cost.

True. The cost is comparable, so the OP isn't saving much if any money this way. In my case, I didn't want to miss any climbing while my cams were in the mail, so I started looking around the house for ways to resling. I suppose it has also been convenient to be able to remove all the soft goods when cleaning the cams.


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By Weekend Warrior
From Denver, CO
Apr 10, 2013

I still use rigid and old "flexible" friends, and also have a bunch of earlier gen C4 camalots that needed reslinging.

Mountain Tools did a first class job reslinging all of them, and it was cheap and quick.

https://www.mtntools.com/cat/rclimb/cams/mt_camresling.htm


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By Sorden
From inside the Bubble, Colorado
Apr 10, 2013
~Here to party~

I think you're referring to your knot as a double fisherman and there's a post suggesting you use the triple fisherman. The triple fisherman doesn't technically exist (you can wind it around as many times as you want and call it a quadruple fisherman, etc., whatever, but there's only a single and double for arguments sake) so I think you need to beef up your "double" by making it a "triple" and call that shit good.


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By Fat Dad
From Los Angeles, CA
Apr 10, 2013

Arlo F Niederer wrote:
Slinging friends with cordage was the original way they were used.

They were originally sold unslung, but everyone I ever saw just used 1" webbing. The only folks I ever saw use cord were folks from the Gunks, and they threaded it through the holes halfway down the stem for horizontal placements (but still used webbing at the bottom of the stem).

Back on topic though, you'll be fine. Half of my cams are still rigid friends and I'm still here. As long as you're smart with your placements, they won't get stuck any more frequently than your newer ones.


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By Woodchuck ATC
Apr 10, 2013
Rock Wars, RRG, 2008

I still have original solid stem Friends that are slung with 1 inch tubular webbing, tied in water knots. Works fine, saved lives and held falls for the 80's so why not today?


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Apr 10, 2013
...

...
...


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By NYClimber
From New York
Apr 25, 2013
Awesome slab climb right out of the water! Rogers Rock, Lake George, NY. Summer 2013.

My original larger nuts and Hex's were all slung with cord versus sewn slings and I never had any issues with them in the 80's and I'm still here!


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