PSA: Gamesmanship at Poke-O-Moonshine

As of 6/10/14, there are two softball sized but square loose rocks perched about 2/3s of the way up the 2nd pitch. They are almost completely detached and directly in the line of ascent. While easily avoidable, one is covered in chalk and makes for a tempting bucket from below. It is sufficiently loose that it could conceivably be dislodged even by rope movement. I was unable to trundle it due to others in the area at the time, and so had to settle for avoiding it and placing gear to keep the rope away. If the coast was clear, it would be wonderful if it were dropped, but in the meantime, heads up to avoid killing your belayer...

Oh my gosh

while the concern for the safety of others is admirable has it really gotten to the point that we expect every hold on every climb to be like those at the gym? As time goes on and nature has its way climbs will be continuously changing a hold that was good last week may not be so secure in a month. Do we want everything outside so dialed in that it is like climbing inside? when you head up there how much do you really ant to know? How safe do you want to make it? how safe should it be? Every hold is suspect, this is something I should understand.

'when you head up there how much do you really ant to know? How safe do you want to make it? how safe should it be?'

Personally, I'd like to know if there are two grapefruit-sized blocks perched in and detached from the crack. I do like climbing a lot, especially in the ADKs, but not to the point of placing my life in danger. The OP was simply giving a heads up, like any good steward to our sport.

I remember those rocks, maybe others, it's just life on cliffs.
I'm more afraid of someone releasing them while I'm at the base or climbing below. The going was easy avoiding them was a snap.
Same as the bunch of flakes about to snap off you find everywhere.
Pay attention, knock, if you're not sure how anchored a rock is, don't step on it!
Saw a baseball rock fly down around the main rap last weekend, no warnings. I wear a helmet near the cliff when people are there for a good reason...

July 4, 1998. Rock came down during a rain storm that hit a climber - partially severed leg and open head wound. Me and my partner were first on the scene. Not a pretty sight. Long story short - every climber, local SAR and State Police worked together and got him out in about four hours. 87 closed when a helicopter landed and flew the climber across the lake to Fletcher Allen Trauma Center.

Miraculously the head injury was not life threatening and it took a long while - over a year but the doctors performed miracles on the leg injury.

The climber was back at the crags less than two years later.

So there's loose stuff everywhere we climb and it can come down for no reason. My lesson learned - since that day I always have my helmet on at the base of any cliff I climb at (even sport cragging at Rumney).

beensandbagged wrote:while the concern for the safety of others is admirable has it really gotten to the point that we expect every hold on every climb to be like those at the gym? As time goes on and nature has its way climbs will be continuously changing a hold that was good last week may not be so secure in a month. Do we want everything outside so dialed in that it is like climbing inside? when you head up there how much do you really ant to know? How safe do you want to make it? how safe should it be? Every hold is suspect, this is something I should understand.

Let's do a little thought experiment, shall we? If you had just completed the route and were packing up at the base when another party arrived and started to rack up for an ascent, would you not mention this issue to them? Think of this as an electronic version of the same common courtesy.

I'm not sure how such a friendly heads up somehow equates with thinking every hold should be like in the gym or somehow dumbs down the experience for others. We're talking about one of the only moderate full length routes at the cliff. A route that attracts a disproportionate number of relatively inexperienced parties, potentially ill equipped to assess rock quality. You ask "how safe should it be?" to which I reply "why add unnecessarily contrived hazards?".

Scott Franklin once famously said that any adventure in small cliff rock climbing is contrived anyway. Don't kid yourself: An ascent of a 5 pitch roadside 5.8 with a fixed anchor rap descent is hardly a journey in to the unknown...

The microwave sized block on P1 of the Great Dihedral still shifts when you grab it as of last August. completly freaked me out. Ihen I remembered that isa said it moved on her about 15 years ago... Still don't like it...

Microwave sized block? Hell, I'm waiting for the entire first pitch of Great Dihedral to fall off, nothing to recommend about that pitch except as access to the great climbing above it.

Seriously though, everyone should remember that Poke-o has no shortage of loose rock and to be wary when other parties are above. I've had at least three close calls with rockfall here, in one case watching a large rock cut down several small trees right in front of me below FM. The climb had several parties on it yet no yell, no warning and certainly no arguing about whether or not a helmet would have helped.

The loose microwave is just before the really scary looking balanced stuff that you have to climb under and pull up on. The Microwave teters. If you grap it is shifts about a 1/2 in one way but when you stand on it it feels reasonably solid.......