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Projecting and Pre-Hung gear
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Sep 2, 2009
Technosurfing, Rumney. Photo by Seth Hamel.
Paul Hunnicutt wrote:
personally I'd always rather have the draws up and concentrate on the movement. plenty of opportunity for fumbling with gear while trad climbing.


I agree.
Jay Knower
From Campton, NH
Joined Jul 1, 2001
6,048 points
Administrator
Sep 2, 2009
Insurrection, 5.14c.  Photo Adam Sanders.
Cam Mather wrote:
I used to climb with a guy who would pretend to unclip a draw from his harness and clip it to a bolt when we left draws hanging. but he was an idiot


LMAO!
Monomaniac
From Morrison, CO
Joined Oct 26, 2006
17,131 points
Administrator
Sep 2, 2009
Insurrection, 5.14c.  Photo Adam Sanders.
Here is an exceprt from the excellent, must-have history tome, "Wizards of Rock: A History of Free Climbing in America" by Pat Ament. Alan Watts describes the FA of the seminal sport route Chain Reaction in 1983 at Smith Rock:


"...I knew what to do, but linking the moves wasn't an easy task. One of the problems was that I would only try the route once in a day, placing all the quickdraws on the bolts and removing them as I lowered off. At the time, the only ascent that counted at Smith was a redpoint... All gear had to be placed on lead, and no pieces could be wighted. If there was a fall, every piece of gear had to be stripped off the route (including draws). This short arete, however, didn't lend itself well to this approach. In a few days, I had managed to get to the lip, but I always came up short on the last move. Finally, on day number eight, I realized I needed to be more efficient. This time, after failing at the lip, I lowered off, pulled the draws, and tried again. By now I was getting stronger, and I slapped the finishing jug but couldn't hold on. I quickly lowered off & pulled the rope to get ready to try again. This time however, I hadn't stripped the draws celan, and they were still dangling in the air. I couln't accept just leaving them there, so on my final attempt, I'd unclip each draw and reclip it to my rack. Then I'd unclip it from my rack and clip it into the bolt. It seems crazy now, but even we morally vacant hangdoggers had our ethics to uphold...."

- Alan Watts
Monomaniac
From Morrison, CO
Joined Oct 26, 2006
17,131 points
May 10, 2010
Big Bend
if i pre-hang my draws on my slabby 5.7 project, is it still a pinkpoint? Tyrel Fuller
From Denver, CO
Joined May 9, 2010
174 points
May 10, 2010
Bastille Crack Final Pitch
My opinion:

If I needed to hang draws to complete a climb, I would not consider myself able to climb at that level. I typically don't have this attitude towards fixed gear in trad climbing - though I don't think its that far out. I think the only difference is the intentional lowering of the climb in sport, and the opportunistic luck of it in trad.
John Maguire
From Boulder, CO
Joined Nov 23, 2008
212 points
May 10, 2010
Bastille Crack Final Pitch
SAL wrote:
So lets all call Sharma to make sure he knows his "pinkpoint" of Jumbo Love is just pink. He better get back to work clipping all 80 meters of that stone or else he is hosed.


Though I know this was sarcasm...

I'd say: No need. I wouldn't hold my standard of climbing upon anyone else. Its just the way I feel about it. That being said though, I think its way more impressive to watch Segal or Wilder placing gear on their trad climbs in the 5.13 or 5.14 range than it is to watch sharma clipping pre-placed draws on a 5.15...

Maybe thats just cause trad is way cooler, though...
John Maguire
From Boulder, CO
Joined Nov 23, 2008
212 points
May 11, 2010
Ancient thread dab. Mike Anderson
From Colorado Springs, CO
Joined Nov 15, 2004
3,094 points
May 11, 2010
Resurrection/troll/crappy ancient thread dab :) Price
From SLC, UT
Joined Apr 29, 2007
324 points
May 27, 2010
John Maguire wrote:
Though I know this was sarcasm... I'd say: No need. I wouldn't hold my standard of climbing upon anyone else. Its just the way I feel about it. That being said though, I think its way more impressive to watch Segal or Wilder placing gear on their trad climbs in the 5.13 or 5.14 range than it is to watch sharma clipping pre-placed draws on a 5.15... Maybe thats just cause trad is way cooler, though...



Unfortunately...those 5.13/14 sprad routes were rehearsed and rehearsed to the point where placing the gear is merely a formality...albeit maybe a more serious one...but it's not exactly "trad" climbing.
Blake Cash
Joined May 27, 2007
195 points
May 27, 2010
Bastille Crack Final Pitch
Blake Cash wrote:
Unfortunately...those 5.13/14 sprad routes were rehearsed and rehearsed to the point where placing the gear is merely a formality...albeit maybe a more serious one...but it's not exactly "trad" climbing.


Yea, I will agree with you on that. Still though, I think its an extra level of precision when you have to place your own gear. Even if it becomes routine or rehearsed, you are still trusting your life to it, right? There are a few projects I worked while trying to break into the 9 grade that I have every piece of pro I will need absolutely dialed. To me though, this doesn't take anything away from the climb. If anything it gets me more psyched since I know how much effort I have put into sending.



John Maguire
From Boulder, CO
Joined Nov 23, 2008
212 points
May 28, 2010
end of the day in the black canyon.
Dusty wrote:
This would be an idiotic way to grade climbs.


not sure if you're joking here, given that the YDS is predicated on this very ideal.
Aaron Martinuzzi
Joined Apr 15, 2008
1,585 points
Administrator
Jun 18, 2010
El Chorro
It doesn't matter. Just do whatever makes sense. If the route is too steep to clean at the end of the day and you aren't worried about someone stealing your draws, then leave 'em there. If you are really worried about climbing the true route, then make sure you are clipping from the hold that you would clip the bolt from. More times than not, this is the way the routes are bolted.

You don't see anyone calling "Jumbo Love" a pink point do you? No one cares... and if they do then they are in it for the wrong reasons.
Ryan Williams
From London (sort of)
Joined May 10, 2009
1,468 points


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