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On-sight of a 14c
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By Ladd Raine
Administrator
From Plymouth, NH
Dec 14, 2007
Waiting for lift-off, Thin Air(5.6) Cathedral Ledge, NH

Patxi Usobiaga onsighted the FA of Bizi Euskaraz (5.14c) at Etxauri Crag in the Navarra region of Spain.

Check out the complete article at climbing.com

Now grades aren't everything, but the mental focus that Patxi shows by onsighting these hard routes really is amazing. A reminder to all those "sport climbing is neither" folks, that a r/x rated climb isn't the only kind of climbing that requires commitment.

For all those folks that haven't been overseas. Patxi's onsight made the news in spain, not just climbing mags and websites. The spanish equivalent of ESPN and CNN highlight ascents like Patxi's in their morning news headlines. Oh how I wish climbing could be even a little more accepted. Spanish climbers are regualrly sponsored by banks, newpapers, drink companies, etc... The benefits of our culture considering climbing a sport instead of a way to get hurt would be amazing, and surely they would make access issues easier to work out with all that money floating around.


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By Tom T
Dec 14, 2007

Ladd Raine wrote:
Patxi Usobiaga onsighted the FA of Bizi Euskaraz (5.14c) at Etxauri Crag in the Navarra region of Spain. Check out the complete article at climbing.com Oh how I wish climbing could be even a little more accepted. Spanish climbers are regualrly sponsored by banks, newpapers, drink companies, etc... The benefits of our culture considering climbing a sport instead of a way to get hurt would be amazing.




uhhhh speak for yourself dude. Climbing is my escape from the world of money grubbing, greedy corporate super powers. Thats just my opinion though, the benefits you mentioned would be debatable....and that is an awesome send.


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By CalebSimpson
Dec 14, 2007

I agree with Tom, I don't want more attention drawn to the sport. Plus, increased crowds at the crag would more than likely hurt access issues more than help them. Litter bugs are already a big enough problem, we don't need an influx of stupid people climbing.

There is a group of climbers I am involved with here in Dallas that IMO have a lot to learn. They are all new to the sport and are always loud at the crag and drink to the wee hours of the morning in family friendly camp grounds where they disturb others sleep.

My main point being, more attention to the sport could do more damage than to help it. While I love to introduce friends to the sport, I enjoy small to now crowds and solitude.


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By bbrock
From Al
Dec 14, 2007
feeling free <br />

Yeah screw climbing becoming a mainstream media sport. Let the money grubbing ego maniacs have their corporate sponsored man made entertainment. Can you imagine climbing becoming a spectator sport like golf. Crowds of people walking from climb to climb watching elite climbers. That is the most disgusting thought to ever enter my mind.


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By Jason Himick
From Boulder, CO
Dec 14, 2007
Future Goal

Ladd Raine wrote:
The benefits of our culture considering climbing a sport instead of a way to get hurt would be amazing, and surely they would make access issues easier to work out with all that money floating around.


Ladd,
It looks like everyone is giving you a hard time for this statement... and I have to admit I don't agree with it either. I know this isn't the point of your thread... but I'm curious (for the sake of good discussion) how you think this is true.


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By Richard Radcliffe
From Louisville, CO
Dec 14, 2007

bbrock wrote:
Crowds of people walking from climb to climb watching elite climbers. That is the most disgusting thought to ever enter my mind.

This has been happening for years. It's called a "comp".


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By Adam Winters
Administrator
From the Shire
Dec 14, 2007
Red-tail Hawk, Buttermilks

undaground 4 lyfe


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By bbrock
From Al
Dec 14, 2007
feeling free <br />

Well the fact of the matter is that climbing will never be mainstream in America for several reasons. The first is that it is just so dull to watch, due to slow nature of the sport. Second the general American public could care less about these types of sports. They want hard hitting action in a controlled man made setting. (arenas and fields. Surfing, kayaking, skiing, and climbing just don't fit into the general publics lifestyle. Most American would not even be able to get to the places were these types of sporting events would take place due to the out of shape nature of our society. Americans want to watch enormous, fast, aggressive atheletes, not sport climbing twig men.


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By Ladd Raine
Administrator
From Plymouth, NH
Dec 14, 2007
Waiting for lift-off, Thin Air(5.6) Cathedral Ledge, NH

Jason Himick wrote:
Ladd, It looks like everyone is giving you a hard time for this statement... and I have to admit I don't agree with it either. I know this isn't the point of your thread... but I'm curious (for the sake of good discussion) how you think this is true.


I know that I'm an admin, but just to be clear, this is my opinion not the opinion of MP or of other admins.

I think that historically climbing has been the left to "dirtbags" and therefore we[climbers] get to put up routes where we want, in the style we deem appropriate and give it a name, grade, etc...

Take the microcosym that is Muir Valley and consider how Rick Weber acting as big brother has had veto power on the routes people want to put up so he has a chance to make sure that squeeze jobs don't get put in and that the lines are pure. After the FAist is done Rick makes sure the bolts are "safety" put in (to the best of his ability) and that the space between them isn't silly[too close] or scary[unsafely far apart]. I believe that Rick Weber's big brother approach has been extremely benefical to the climbing community not in onyl bolting however. He also makes trails, bridges, tests bolts and the rock as well as telling folks where on his property is strickly out of bounds.

The above is only an example. I feel that if planned development was the standard that crags could be developed without too many squeeze jobs and without too many bolted lines that could go with gear. Also, I think that planned development would only be possible with some measure of finacial backing[Ex. Fenway Park] not only for bolts and drills, etc... but also for trails, bridges, rescue teams, anchor replacement, education in safety techniques, etc...

I think that the alpine climbing world realized this decades ago, and that is why you have alpine parties that shuttle folks up mountains for[insert reason that can get funding/grants here] in order to be able to climb peaks, establish routes, make base camps, teach others the techniques used[so they don't get killed] and to have adventures. Mainstream financial backing allow [some not all]alpinists to make bold ascents of remote peaks.

I'm not saying take the adventure out of climbing, I'm not even saying take the fear or freedom out of climbing. I just think that the 'dirtbag' or 'outlaw' generation of climbers are getting older and for climbers of my generation to continue developing new areas while holding on to their old areas we will have to have some mainstream backing. Otherwise development and "mainstream" needs will take over our special places and our wilderness.

Just think if there was a professional team of extreme caribo watchers in ANWAR that the public loved to watch on TV...I bet they wouldn't even consider drilling. A little far fetched I know. However, I think it would help save QCC if climbing was a more mainstream sport, and it would definetly be easier to get life insurance.

-Ladd


Remmber that this is
Jason Himick wrote:
for the sake of good discussion

I'm not even sure if I believe my point completely.

Just a side note: I love MP, there is NO WAY I could ever post this on that other site without having my teeth smashed in.


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By caughtinside
From Oakland CA
Dec 14, 2007

vegastradguy wrote:
no offense here and good on him for getting the onsight of a project route, but the route was graded by him and has no confirmation except from a couple of guys on the ground going 'yeah, that looks like .14c'- i'm no expert, but i've noticed that at the higher grades like that, it takes a while before a route of that difficulty is confirmed- and even then it can be changed later on. (note: onsighting something is a far cry from redpointing something like the other famous tough routes that were sent after months of work- with a redpoint, you have some real time to think and compare the route with others...with an onsight- its on the fly....no time to think at all...) at any rate, woohoo for Patxi, but at the same time, i think the media is jumping the gun a little on this one....although i do hope the route is confirmed at the grade, because that'd be really sweet.


I think there was some confirmation, or at least agreement from the guy who bolted it and was working it. Unless you think you have to send it to offer a grade opinion.

Also, I read somewhere that paxti said himself he hoped guys would get on it and offer their opinions on the grade as well.


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By Bill Ballace
From Pullman,WA
Dec 14, 2007

I think that the guy who Paxti snagged the FA from was Dani Andrada. Given the resumes of both Paxti and Dani it is probably .14c. not to mention the sending spree that Paxti has been on. He has sent something like 4 routes graded 9a or harder in the last month or so, at least one of those on his second try. It is currently just a proposed grade.

I think that Ladd makes a reasonably good point about development of areas and usage. lets face it sport climbing is pretty mainstream and I think that it would be better for climbing if we were seen as productive members of society who just like to get out and have fun, kind of like skiers, rather than a bunch of dirt bags. I guess that is why I find the sends of guys like Piz and Anderson to be much more impressive than someone like Potter. Piz and Anderson hold down full time jobs and both have masters degrees.


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By Maurice Liddy
From Plymouth, NH
Dec 14, 2007
Personal photo, riding the rails in SD

Ladd,

We have to keep the sport underground as much as possible. If not then we wouldn't feel cool sauntering around places like boulder,CO , buying our $9 salads at Whole Foods while wearing harnesses with quick draws jangling.
The more climbers there are, the less gnarly and badass we feel.
-M


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By slim
Administrator
Dec 14, 2007
tomato, tomotto, kill mike amato.

ladd,

no offense, but your 'suburban housewife' approach to the future of climbing is depressing. i seriously had to pry the shotgun out of my mouth after i read it.


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By Zappatista
Dec 15, 2007
Book me, officer.

No offense...sure, that's what you meant.

I've been climbing for a few years now...it seems to me that more climbers aren't necessarily good for my personal enjoyment of the crags (see a recent forum about how annoying some nearby girls climbing were in CO for every possible side of the story), and the whole LCD (lowest common denominator) marketing approach where Lauren Lee and Sharma are shoved down our throats 24-7 and those two nice folks start getting creeped and cagey from dealing with public figure status rather than dealing with crushing and crushing alone...there's no solution. Our world is changing, you have to roll with it. The New was wall to wall twerps when I went to any remotely popular wall, but I got to meet some of my best friends up there too, when they were ripe gumbies, I might add. The Red sounds like it's hit the big time and it's going to get ruined as fast as possible, but on the other hand, there are now climber-owned cliffs, and for good or ill, we'll be learning something from all this soon.

I'm not sure that an increase in the number of sponsored climbers and/or government involvement with climbing past what we've already got would help anything. There are surely many that would disagree with me. Less rules, less people, more quiet, more freedom...anyone argue with that distillation?


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By Justin Roth
Apr 29, 2008

old topic, i know, but just had to say:
if you're one of those craggers who feels the crag's too crowded, remember that you are a part of that problem. perhaps consider a more obscure sport -- road luging, perhaps. or stop roadside cragging and try some adirondack backcountry new routing, you will have all the solitude you like out there.


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By Josh Audrey
From LAS VEGAS
Apr 29, 2008
maneater

yeah, screw more people climbing! I'm not even going to use partners anymore,
because that's just one more person in my way. God, i wish people just reconize that they
don't deserve to be out in the wilderness. Man this thread has opened my eyes, if feel like there is so much I don't know. Praise this thread, oh jesus god praise it! Down with
people!yes!


Retards.... Everyone


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