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old style camalots

Original Post
Shelton Hatfield · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2011 · Points: 650

Does anyone have an idea of what is a good price for dual stem camalots in good condition? If not, what would you pay? Would you even want to climb on them? I came across someone who has a handful of them.

Thanks

Gunkiemike · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 3,492

I'd only use them in hard rock, due to the smaller cam lobe surface area. Also, check them for cracks where the cable end "ball" meets the cast aluminum axle block. That being said, I still use them. I'd say they're worth $10-15 apiece.

Evan Sanders · · Westminster, CO · Joined Dec 2010 · Points: 140

I wouldn't use them. Not because they're old, but because the dual stem camalots had a defect where they would fail before the rated strength. I might use them for aid though. Might.

Luc-514 · · Montreal, QC · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 12,506

Still have a #2 in good condition, I was climbing on my #1-3 until last season, decided it was time for an upgrade.
sold the others for 10-15$ at a gear swap.

Never had any issues with them apart from the plastic piece on the wire swage coming loose out of the axle block.

never had any bad falls on them either and I've got a 10 year no climbing gap in there. Cleaning and inspecting them regularly.

mcarizona · · Flag · Joined Feb 2007 · Points: 180

only 15 bucks??!!

Those pieces are bomber! Sure, I have an updated rack but it gets SO tiring hearing that the oldstandard isn't good enough. Webbing: 5 years inside, deteriorating. Harness: taking a beating, replace every season. Sunglasses: so I sat on them, they're fine. Rope: manufactured to start to decay the day it leaves the factory. Sticky gate on a biner: yer gunna die!!!

I did climb both days this weekend, but you caught me between shoveling right now so I had to rant.

Steve

Tim Stich · · Colorado Springs, Colorado · Joined Jan 2001 · Points: 1,520

I still have two old ones, a red and blue. The problem with that design is the plastic sleeves on the wire will crack where it meets the head of the cam axles. This happened on my blue one. I had to melt a plastic collar onto it so you could deploy the cam. Needless to say, it's way too funky now to trust in the field.

Definitely don't pay more than $10 per piece.

Wally · · Denver · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 0

My old camalots are typically delegated to my Indian Creek rack (where you often times need 6 to 8 pieces of the same size) or when I am doing something easy and I want to save the wear and tear on the C4s. I feel these pieces are bomber. I can't (or don't want to be able to) afford an Indian Creek rack of C4s.

I have friends that climb on rigid friends much older than the original camalots. Surely other old timers do as well.

The above being said, I think the price estimates below are reasonable to a bit low, maybe $15 to $20 per old style camalot. ?? I certainly have no interest in parting with mine.

Wally

Brandon Gottung · · CO Western Slope · Joined Dec 2010 · Points: 1,613

I got a rack .5 - 4 of the u-stem camolots gifted to me, which serves as triples / quads. I'm happy I have them, living in Moab six months a year, but outside of desert splitters, they don't get much use. I carry the .5 with me virtually any time I climb on my rack, just haven't replaced that one yet, it fits perfectly between the orange and red metolius units. Never fallen on the old C4s, but hung on the #4 while groveling through rattly fists, lowered off of a lone #3 (not far) in a sudden rain at the creek and relied on the C4 as sole protection in that size before I bought a new C5; all with confidence in the gear. If I didn't have them and lived in Moab, I'd buy them at $20 a cam max, if I didn't live in Moab or climb there often, I'd buy powercams (cheap and light), C4s (bomber), or helium friends (smooth and light). *Just tie some thin powercord holding the plastic sheath and trigger tight in place, threaded through the provided holes.

Kent Pease · · Littleton, CO · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 1,066
Gunkiemike wrote: Also, check them for cracks where the cable end "ball" meets the cast aluminum axle block.
According to BD, they ran tests on units with cracked heads and they failed in other ways first. Regardless, you probably would not want to buy one in that condition.

Also! Check where the shaft cables enter the head for frayed and broken wires. Think of the problem with frayed trigger wires at the swage connections – this is the same phenomenon but on a bigger scale and it is truly a structural problem. The unit can fail! I found this problem with two of my old Camalots and retired them (and the rest of the set too) immediately.
Aric Datesman · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 145

Dunno if I'd call behavior like this "bomber". YMMV.

mountainproject.com/v/c4-wi…

youtube.com/watch?v=AsExl8t…

Ray Pinpillage · · West Egg · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 180
Aric Datesman wrote:Dunno if I'd call behavior like this "bomber". YMMV. mountainproject.com/v/c4-wi… youtube.com/watch?v=AsExl8t…
That video indicates a peak force of just over 2K pounds but if you watch closely the axles/head starts deflecting and placement slipping below 1K pounds. Once the axles deflect enough to be compromised the cam looks like it just holds as a wedge until it finally fails completely.
Aric Datesman · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 145

Actually the video is a bit misleading in that regard as the pull was done with a hand pumped hydraulic cylinder, which meant that the cam could re-grab between pumps. As a continuous pull it would have continued skating out at a much lower force. Also if you follow the link you'll see it took me 4 attempts to even get it to stay in the fixture on account of the axle flex.

Locker · · Yucca Valley, CA · Joined Oct 2002 · Points: 2,349

"Actually the video is a bit misleading in that regard as the pull was done with a hand pumped hydraulic cylinder, which meant that the cam could re-grab between pumps. As a continuous pull it would have continued skating out at a much lower force. Also if you follow the link you'll see it took me 4 attempts to even get it to stay in the fixture on account of the axle flex."...

INTERESTING and informative answer to the above...

To someone like myself, watching the clip above I'd NEVER have thought along the lines of your answer...

Shit can sure be MISLEADING as you wrote...

funkyicemonkey · · Colorado · Joined Nov 2011 · Points: 0

If its the type with the circular crimped "ball" on the ends of the cable AVOID. I had one that split while working a project and taking a bunch of falls. Very spooky although it did not fail, I would not trust it in the least. You simply dont know if it was abused and that may kill you.

Aric Datesman · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 145
Locker wrote: Shit can sure be MISLEADING as you wrote...
Yup, which is why I switched to a electric pump for this sort of thing; seen too many cams slip and regrab with the hand pump while skating right out under a constant pull. You can really see it in the charts of the applied force, as it'll have all sorts of dips and peaks rather than a load to peak and then failure.
Chris Owen · · Big Bear Lake · Joined Jan 2002 · Points: 11,617

I would think that a failure mode where a continuous and steady increase in load is presented to a belay anchor, fixed or running, until it ultimately fails is not a likely scenario in rock climbing. Instantaneous shock loading seems more likely to me.

Aric Datesman · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 145

That may be, Chris, but that's not how the UIAA tests them.

slim · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2004 · Points: 1,103

also, the test above doesn't discount the possibility of the camalots to fail well under the rated load during a transient load. it would be interesting to see results of this sort of test. my bet would be on the units slipping out below the rated load.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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