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Indian Creek guidebook special
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By Fred Knapp
Mar 10, 2009

The new Indian Creek: A Climbing Guide will be available in April. In order to help out Spring Break climbers, Sharp End is offering a pre-order special: Pre-purchase the new print guide and get a free ebook. www.sharpendbooks.com

This second edition of Indian Creek: A Climbing Guide posed quite a challenge for us at Sharp End. The first edition was well received and forever changed the face of climbing guidebooks. It was the first full-color climbing guidebook in America and, as such, created a new standard. I donít believe it was color alone that made it so special. The book captured the aura and the feel of The Creek and allowed readers to dream of the place when they werenít there.

Making the second edition better and more complete was no easy task. I appreciate the many comments and suggestions we received, and we tried to implement the brilliant advice. I believe users will welcome the expanded gear beta, larger cliff photos, and the addition of star ratings. With the inclusion of essays by Steve Hong and Scott Carson, we have added insight into the rich climbing history. We have included information on new crags and off-the-beaten-path climbs that will interest those looking for adventure and solitude. Over 70 new photographs from such talents as Andrew Burr and Celin Serbo give the book a fresh face.

Of course, visitation has grown and we wanted to address environmental, cultural and access issues in greater detail. Many thanks go to The Nature Conservancy, the Bureau of Land Management, Friends of Indian Creek, and the Redd Family for their continued acceptance of climbers and their essays on environment and stewardship.


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By CJC
Mar 10, 2009

hahaha i lold


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By Dpurf
From Superior
Mar 10, 2009
My on sight of Touch and Go, Joshua Tree

It is the same book as before. First in color, then black and white, now back to color.

Not sure how to equate this to putting out the misery of a dying animal. It is the same damn book that helped injured the animal.


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By Bryan Gilmore
From Your Mama
Mar 10, 2009
Beagle

I've got the original "Dr." David Bloom book, in color if anyone wants it... it can be yours for $28, includes media mail shipping through USPS. Book is in great condition with no writing or marks in it.


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By Bryan Gilmore
From Your Mama
Mar 10, 2009
Beagle

To be honest, I think the climbing magazine guide that Steve Petro put together is still the best and it fits in your pocket! Oh yeah and on the back of the photo copy you can write in the new routes.


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By Buff Johnson
Mar 10, 2009
smiley face

Put a #4 right there -- no, there; not there; that's the 1.5


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By Tony B
From Around Boulder, CO
Mar 11, 2009
Got Milk? How about forearm pump? Tony leads "Alan Nelson's Bulging Belly" (5.10, X) on the Lost and Found Flatiron. Belayer is Mark Ruocco. Photo by Bill Wright, 10/06.

FUNGUY wrote:
WTF?? A new IC guide already? Do we really need it?? Just for a few new routes. The 1st edition is from 2004. About 33% of the routes have the gear listed to the exact cam to take. Is this paint by number climbing? Dont think I need it.


Not to agree or disagree, but to point out-
The old book was out of print. Why reprint an old one on an expired contract when you can correct errors, add routes and make it a new edition?

So if you reprint, then yes, new edition.

I'd be curious to know how many of the old ones existed- how many total were sold. Fred?


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By Kevin Bains
Mar 11, 2009

Sounds like Sharp End has taken an outstanding guide book and made it better. Thanks for the offer on the ebook. I'll be there in late March, so I'm buying one.


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By Erik W
From Bay Area, CA
Mar 11, 2009
North face of Ama Dablam - taken on approach to Kongma La.

Fred, I like the deal, but upon hitting the checkout button I discovered the $7.95 shipping charge (23% of the cover price). Is there any way you could provide a pick-up option for folks here in Boulder?


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By T.Ward
From Boulder, CO
Mar 11, 2009
Cooper's Rock in WVA

Beagle wrote:
To be honest, I think the climbing magazine guide that Steve Petro put together is still the best and it fits in your pocket! Oh yeah and on the back of the photo copy you can write in the new routes.


Do you remember which issue it was?


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By kevin fox
From parker
Mar 11, 2009
cody

I really like the color guide book and will definitely pick up the new one as well. Fred, I know their is a group of climbers that have issues with seeing a ton of people in the creek. but it is what it is. I think really the only way to reverse the damage that has been done truly is to stop going there all together. new routes always tickle my fancy and shit, if it spreads people out...kudos.
you can bet your ass I'll support your business. you are right about color guide books.. they have changed the face of climbing. instead of a fucking drawing and standing at the base of a climb wondering, you can actually find where you are at and get to stepping. to me it means more climbing. my partners and I thank you.


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By Jaaron Mankins
From Bayfield, CO
Mar 11, 2009
San Juans.

I have been going to the Creek for 13 years. The new guidebook was great at spreading out some of the use. People are gonna come regardless-just look at the place, it's amazing. People who complain about the situation are lame. There is tons of other climbing right under your friggin noses, so quit whining when there are 30 cars at Supercrack Butress and go somewhere else. I will defeniteley pick up the new guide and visit new areas. Every crag here has five star routes on them. Enjoy


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By Clyde
Mar 11, 2009

johnL wrote:
The fact remains that books and movies will destroy the creek despite anyone's best efforts.


And NOT printing a guidebook will make a difference how? IC was doomed to popularity the moment Ed first climbed Supercrack. Better education and spreading out the impacts are generally a good thing. NIMBYs have been arguing against magazine articles and guidebooks for decades and ultimately they've pretty much always been wrong. Good information is better than bad information, which is the only alternative. Pretty ironic for a wannabe teacher to be a book burner.


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By kevin fox
From parker
Mar 11, 2009
cody

john
how would going without chalk change where the creek is at today.just trying to understand your point of view. and what is the difference when it comes to different climbing destinations i.e. turkey, eldo rmnp? should we stop climbing altogether. I see that as the only true way not to destroy the land.


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By Monomaniac
Administrator
From Morrison, CO
Mar 11, 2009
Insurrection, 5.14c.  Photo Adam Sanders.

kevin fox wrote:
should we stop climbing altogether. I see that as the only true way not to destroy the land.


Interesting idea. What if there were no climbers in IC? What if there were no outdoor users? Do you really think the BLM would hesitate for one second to pimp this land out to the highest bidder if it weren't for climbers?


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By Paul Hunnicutt
From Boulder, CO
Mar 11, 2009
Half Dome

Personally I think IC would be much better with designated campground sites, user fees, and a few more toilets. It is a beautiful place and people will NEVER police themselves properly. There is no way humans can behave themselves without regulation. Of course the guidebooks and movies have brought more people, but so have cams, climbing gyms, overall popularity in climbing, and just more damn people in the world. You can't soley blame a guidebook because it is printed in color and isn't a piece of crap. With a rise in popularity you almost have to have guides and regulation. They grow with each other. Some people want to climb and not spend all day finding which crack is which. Ok, you don't like that and have all the time in the world for adventure...great. The guidebook isn't the problem - a lack of regulation is.

I find most people getting super upset about IC (or any climbing area) and blaming guidebooks/new climbers mostly just want less people so they can have the place to themselves and think they are more hardcore than the average joe climber. They aren't in it to save animals or any other user groups really. If they really cared in a true environmental sense perhaps they wouldn't be climbing/camping themselves. In the end climbers could be a user group who "saves" IC. Instead you might just have a golf course, luxury homes, or oil rigs. This would take more than a few dirtbag climbers to achieve. If you want to go inward...how would you ever regulate the amount of people? Just keep it all to your damn self?

I think the too many bolts/too much chalk thing gets wayyyyy blown out of proportion from an environmental standpoint. Much more damage to the environment just driving/walking to the cliff and being there. Generally speaking IMHO, climbers always seem to be SOOOOOO concerned about a few bolts, some chalk, and more climbers (lame pussy climbers) on "their" routes. Instead of stepping back and seeing the real environmental issues.


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By Fred Knapp
Mar 11, 2009

Erik W wrote:
Fred, I like the deal, but upon hitting the checkout button I discovered the $7.95 shipping charge (23% of the cover price). Is there any way you could provide a pick-up option for folks here in Boulder?


Yes, we can provide a pick-up for locals. Normally, I steer people to the local shops, but I understand this is different. The Boulder Rock Club has kindly offered to serve as a pick-up location when the printed books arrive. So, if you're a Boulder local and you want to avoid shipping charges, mention on the Notes section of the order form.

FYI: We ship Priority Mail and oftentimes a 1.5 pound package costs more than the $7.95 to ship.

Bummer about all the haters. I just wanted to provide an option for climbers heading to the Creek before the print books arrived.


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By Bryan Gilmore
From Your Mama
Mar 11, 2009
Beagle

Thom Ward wrote:
Do you remember which issue it was?

Issue 128, Scott Carson climbing "Slice and Dice" on the cover. Remember, it doesn't have "From Switz. with Love" or "The Belly Full of Bad Berries" or "The Extension to Tricks" or "Hong Kong Phooey" or "The Optimator", but who cares.


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By Bryan Gilmore
From Your Mama
Mar 11, 2009
Beagle

Fred Knapp wrote:
Bummer about all the haters. I just wanted to provide an option for climbers heading to the Creek before the print books arrived.

I think your motivation may lie elsewhere! And I'm a lover, not a hater... especially of IC.


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By Sergio P
From Idaho Springs, CO
Mar 11, 2009
World Champion NY Giants logo

I want to apologize to anyone who has ever climbed at the Creek. I fist climbed there about 8 years ago. Soon after I bought the Bloom book. I really enjoyed the first edition and will likely get the new one. I have top roped (not through the anchors) routes that I could not lead. I enjoyed those top rope climbs. I have hung on gear b/c I ran out of gas. I use chalk. I have camped at multiple different locations in the canyon and had a fire from wood I brought from home. However, I have always packed out my shit and trash. I have told my friends about the creek and told them to go check it out. Everyone who has ever gone (even my sport loving friends) has come back smiling.

I too have seen the creek grow in popularity. Like many of you I am not a big fan of the over crowed dirty campsites. I donít like waiting in line for some of the classic lines. I hope that I donít have to pay for camping in the future but if it helps protect the environment Iím in favor of it.

Through all of this, I still love the creek. I love the weather. I love that sharing gear with total strangers is accepted practice. I love those splitter cracks. I love watching newbies get their butts whooped on hand cracks just like I used to. I love having my ass handed to me every time I go. I love talking with total stranger in the camp grounds. I love that 95% of the people I meet at the creek seem to be good hearted people because I donít get that ratio in my day to day life.

If my actions and love for the creek have upset you Iím sorry. However, there are thousands of people just like me. We donít love the creek b/c of the book. What brings us back to the creek is not the book. What brings us back is the same thing that brings everyone else back. I admit that my presence is part of the problem. I will continue to do my best to minimize my impact and advice my friends to do the same.


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By Sunny-D
From SLC, Utah
Mar 11, 2009
Top of Jah-Man Sister Superior

Fredd, Your guide book sits on my coffee table, right next to castle country climbs (remember that one) I think it is well done.


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By Cpt. E
Mar 11, 2009

By johnL
4 hours ago

J. MAN wrote:
People who complain about the situation are lame.


"How many anchors have you replaced there?
How many bags of other peoples trash have you removed?
How many shit bags (with a strangers shit) have you packed out?
How many notes have you left on tents to inform someone they are camping on private property?
How many years have you gone without chalk?
How many tickmarks have you personally cleaned?

You've got no leverage in this one buddy. The fact remains that books and movies will destroy the creek despite anyone's best efforts. The only thing that could possibly save it would be camping fee's.

I'm personally in favor of camping fee's, chalk restrictions, and a new route moratorium. "

- i'm glad your a 'do-er' JohnL, but JMAN was pointing out that mere complainers on the subject are lame, and so you jump his shit in order to post your laundry list above that apparently 'qualifies' someone to bitch about the situation?

How many years have i gone without chalk?! get the fuck out.
And please do not approach my tent to post your gay little note either or i'll have my wife shoot you in the face.


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By Cpt. E
Mar 11, 2009

with pepper spray of course.


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By tenesmus
Mar 11, 2009

Keep up the good work Fred. I think the standard is set and hope we all get to use full-color guidebooks. Pushing those standards is good for us all in this medium too.


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By Cpt. E
Mar 11, 2009

nope, but if you want to be an activist in the inner corridor by god do it with some civility.

i do more than my part when i choose to climb at The Most Popular Crack Destination in America(the corridor), and i expect to see a whole bunch of people fucking up when i go there. a person with the right(wrong) disposition could go there any weekend and stay completely pissed off the whole entire time for observing all kinds of urban-behavior-based b.s. going on.

i'm all for pay sites too, but w/ regret as it marks a passing of an age. but then again i'm not effected as i live in close proximity to the area and don't camp anywhere near the corridor.

btw...myself, my wife, child and 2 good friends had the entire Supercrack Butress to ourselves all day sunday.


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By Rob Kepley
From Westminster,CO
Mar 11, 2009
Yosemite Valley..

I propose we have Chuck Norris patrol the canyon handing out "ass whoopins'"


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