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Making Trad Draws
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By metcalfd
From Reston VA
Apr 16, 2013
Soloing in the Dells

Making trad draws and looking to get some input on components. Looking for a "no nose" style of biner like the BD Hoodwire but not sure which sling to use. Any ideas/comments would be great. Thanks!


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By D.Buffum
Apr 16, 2013
Orgasm Direct, Devil's Lake, 5.11a  c. 2008

I really liked my Mammut 8mm, but the BD 10mm slings have been an adequate replacement.


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By metcalfd
From Reston VA
Apr 16, 2013
Soloing in the Dells

Been thinking about those but still not sure on using dyneema for something that takes a dynamic load. I know nylon is wider and heavier but isn't it more suited for the task? I also acknowledge that most trad draws use dyneema. If you've seen the DMM videos on nylon vs spectra/dyneema, you'll know why I'm asking haha


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By Allen Corneau
From Houston, TX
Apr 16, 2013

I'm a fan of the Blue Water Titan slings.

They're a good balance between weight/bulk savings over full nylon slings and the knot-ability/durability over the mostly-Dyneema slings.

bluewaterropes.com/home/productsinfo.asp?Channel=Recreation&>>>


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By Sunny-D
From SLC, Utah
Apr 16, 2013
Top of Jah-Man Sister Superior

Check out the Misty Mountain Nylon slings for a good "alternative" to the dyneema they are skinnier then all the other nylon that I have found. I tend to run about half and half skinny dyneema and the misty mountain skinny nylon, that way I get the best of both worlds. My normal rack of draws and slings for trad routes.
4-6 quick draws
6 alpine draws made of dyneema 24" slings
6 over the shoulder misty mountain 24" runners with one biner on each runner
2 48" long runners with one biner on each one
1 48" long Misty Mountain nylon sling with one biner
1-2 cordelettes with a small locker on each (I tend to lead most of the pitches so cordelettes make more sense for me)
4 free biners
2 free lockers

This set up works really well for me.
Dallen


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By Rob Selter
From running springs Ca
Apr 16, 2013
me

plus one for the blue water titan slings


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By Kyle Napierkowski
Apr 16, 2013

Dyneema's no good if the rest of the system is static, but when using slings for trad climbing you have the dynamic rope in the system. Dyneema slings seem to be preferred due to lower bulk and weight- just avoid taking static falls on them (ie without rope)


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By Derek Doucet
Apr 16, 2013

I think you're misunderstanding the implications of those DMM tests. The reason dyneema slings failed so miserably was that they were being subjected to high fall factor drop tests without a rope or any other dynamic elements in the system. For clipping pro with a dynamic rope, dyneema is a fine choice. Just don't use it as a personal tether, climb a couple of feet above your anchor and pitch. The right tool in the right application...

Edit: Kyle beat me to it...


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By DEF
From CT
Apr 16, 2013

I love the Wild Country helium biners... they're incredibly light, and have a hooded nose similar to the hoodwire but cleaner looking in my opinion.


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By Doug S
Apr 16, 2013
Edge of Time <br />

Kyle Napierkowski wrote:
Dyneema's no good if the rest of the system is static, but when using slings for trad climbing you have the dynamic rope in the system. Dyneema slings seem to be preferred due to lower bulk and weight- just avoid taking static falls on them (ie without rope)


+1

And also very important, don't tie or girth-hitch them. Otherwise they're light and strong. I use them for my alpine draws.


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By metcalfd
From Reston VA
Apr 16, 2013
Soloing in the Dells

Kyle Napierkowski wrote:
Dyneema's no good if the rest of the system is static, but when using slings for trad climbing you have the dynamic rope in the system. Dyneema slings seem to be preferred due to lower bulk and weight- just avoid taking static falls on them (ie without rope)


Makes perfect sense. Thanks for all the help everyone!


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By Larry S
Apr 16, 2013
The wife and I road-trippin on the Connie.

Depends on what you plan to do and what your budget is. I personally have and recommend the blue water titan slings like a few others above. They are less bulky than normal nylon and they wear great, I think they're good for just about everything. They are a spectra/nylon blend. They are not, however, lighter than plain old nylon - a 24" blue water titan weighs 42g, a 60cm BD 18mm nylon is 36g, and the nylon will last a long time.

The 8mm dyneema slings "Dental Floss" are much more compact and light, but are more expensive and much less durable should be replaced much more often. I don't own any, but i've climbed on them and it's great how compact and light they are, i loved using them. You should know the limitations of the material though, dyneema is very temperature sensitive, and weakens substantially above 180F, so don't prussik with them, don't keep them locked in your trunk in the desert, and keep them away from that hot belay device.

Here's an interesting link www.outdoorgearlab.com/Climbing-Slings-Reviews/buying-advice


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By teece303
From Highlands Ranch, CO
Apr 16, 2013
Aiding.

Allen Corneau wrote:
I'm a fan of the Blue Water Titan slings. They're a good balance between weight/bulk savings over full nylon slings and the knot-ability/durability over the mostly-Dyneema slings.


I also like the Blue Water Titan.

Nothing wrong with the Dyneema, but honestly, the shoelace size of it makes me nervous (this is irrational, it's plenty strong).

I like the balance of the Blue Water Titan: not as bulky as 18mm nylon, but not as skimpy as 10mm Dyneema.

That said, I do love Dyneema for hero loops or the like: any palce where the reduced bulk is key.

As for the carabiner, I love me some Petzl Spirit. I can't get enough of them: they just feel so awesome when you use them (they are heavy by today's standards, though, and I haven't had opportunity to use the new, lighter version).

I really, really like key lock carabiners. I have grown to hate that notch on non-key lock biners.


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By Dan Allard
From West Chester, PA
Apr 17, 2013
Day at Summersville Lake

Might check out the Wild Country Heliums too - great wire gates.

If you go nylon, I'll second that Misty Mountain makes awesome stuff and I'm really stoked with a bunch of slings I recently got from Fish Products. Yes they are just slings but great prices, and made in USA quality and service doesn't make me think twice about where I shop. I always head straight to the smaller American outfits. Made by climbers for climbers and I'm never disappointed.


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By John D
Apr 17, 2013

I love my mammut slings! they're great, perfectly strong, and the lightest out there!

As far as biners, I really like mad rock's wire gate biners. They're not notchless, but they're nice and light, good size (not too fiddly) and cheap.


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By Jon H
From Northern NJ
Apr 17, 2013
At the matching crux

I do most of my trad climbing in Seneca and the Gunks, where the nature most of the routes wander and have roofs. With that in mind, I wind up extending most of my placements.

I carry 10-12 tripled 24" runners with either Mammut Moses or BD Oz biners and then two 48" nylon slings (i like to be able to knot them safely for a rappel tether). The runners are all either 8mm Mammut or the BD equivalent (10mm?). As said above, the major downside to using dyneema is they have a much shorter lifespan. The real benefit isn't the weight savings but the reduced bulk on your harness - it's a night and day difference. Much easier to look down and find exactly what you need when you're gripped.


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By MTKirk
From Billings, MT
Apr 17, 2013
Me on Supercrack

Being cheap and a little paranoid about dynema, I go with Trango ultra-tape for my slings. They are a blend of nylon & dynema. They are smaller than nylon slings and lighter @ 27 grams. Been using them for two years now and they've held up real well.

www.trango.com/slings_webbing/UltraTape_Draws_and_Runners


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By NickO
From Utah
Apr 17, 2013

Maybe this is obvious but I just want to double check. Would you not use a dyneema sling to top rope a classic 2 bolt sport pitch if you plan to tie two limiting knots around your master point as to not shock load a bolt in a failure? No knots in dyneema ever is what I have heard but feel like I have seen that happen a bunch.

Thanks


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By MTKirk
From Billings, MT
Apr 17, 2013
Me on Supercrack

NickO wrote:
Maybe this is obvious but I just want to double check. Would you not use a dyneema sling to top rope a classic 2 bolt sport pitch if you plan to tie two limiting knots around your master point as to not shock load a bolt in a failure? No knots in dyneema ever is what I have heard but feel like I have seen that happen a bunch. Thanks


Yes; I pretty much stick to all nylon slings for this, usually hand knotted double length (48") that I keep on me for bailing/unforeseen stuff. Sometimes I'll use a quad pre-tied from 7mm if I know I'll mostly be top roping on good bolts.


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By Jon H
From Northern NJ
Apr 17, 2013
At the matching crux

The "no knots in dyneema" is said with regards to scenarios where the sling would see large static forces. It is FINE to use a dyneema sling with limiter knots for toproping. It is similarly fine to use a dyneema sling to build an anchor on a multipitch - just make sure you are never tied in to the anchor directly with another piece of dyneema. That's the rope+clove hitch is for.


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By Sam Lightner, Jr.
From Lander, WY
Apr 17, 2013
The Shield

uhm, whats a trad draw versus any other draw?


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By Brian Scoggins
From Eugene, OR
Apr 17, 2013

Ah, trad draws vs. tripled slings, the semantic debacle of our time.

I used to be nutty about the straight dyneema slings, but the truth is that they are designed to be expendable, short life-span slings. If you don't have a super long approach to your regular crag, just get straight nylon slings. They'll hold up longer, and they're cheaper.

I still have a few dyneema slings, but I only break them out when I need spares, I'm ice climbing, or I actually have a long approach with a big rack.


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By Ryan Nevius
From The Range of Light
Apr 17, 2013
Mt. Agassiz

Sam Lightner, Jr. wrote:
uhm, whats a trad draw versus any other draw?


In case you couldn't imply from the responses, I believe the OP is talking about an "extendable" draw (also commonly referred to as an alpine draw).


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By Maurice Chaunders
Apr 17, 2013
Colombian Crack

+1 for trango ultra tape. Seems a good balance of thick and thin-burly enough but also light.


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By David Sahalie
From on the road again
Apr 17, 2013

Sam Lightner, Jr. wrote:
uhm, whats a trad draw versus any other draw?


Trad draws are more awesome because they are, well, Trad!


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By Sam Lightner, Jr.
From Lander, WY
Apr 17, 2013
The Shield

Ah yeah, thats what I thought... rather than any of the other names, if we say "trad" then it won't imply we are going sport climbing.

I do have some advice: Dont use the super skinny dyneema that looks a bit like oversized shoe lace. Being so skiny doesn't allow much overbuild in the strength, and whenever you have to knot them (and you often do when going light), the knots are incredibly hard to untie.


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