Route Guide - iPhone / Android - Partners - Forum - Photos - Deals - What's New - School of Rock
Login with Facebook
Cactus Cliff
Routes Sorted
L to R R to L Alpha
Alexi's Climb 
Alignment, The 
Almost French 
Almost Gothic 
Are You Experiential? 
Awesome Offwidthin' 
Axis of Evil 
Banana Split 
Barbed Wire Love 
Beach Ball 
Beef Cake Formula 
Bionic Minnow 
Black Slabbeth 
Blackman's Burden 
Blade Runner 
Blarney Stone, The 
Blond Princes 
Book of Dude-Aronomy, The 
Cactus Cliff Addict 
Candy for Big Kids 
Carnage (aka "Wild Virus") 
Cellulite District 
Centurion Enigma 
Cheeseburger In Paradise 
Child's Play 
Chompin' at the Cholla 
Christmas Tree 
Chunky Monkey 
Crimpin' and Pimpin' 
Crimpson Candy 
Critic's Choice 
Crynoid Corner 
Cure For The Common Crimp 
Da Fly 
Dances with Cholla 
Dereliction Affliction 
Divinity School 
Don't Be Messin' With Ma Moves 
Early Bird 
Et Tu, Brutus 
Fast Food Nation 
Flight of the Phoenix 
French Are Here, The 
Fully Equipped 
Glass Babies 
Glue Slippage 
Good Red Road, The 
Great Expectations 
Half Breed 
Hero Driver 
Hey Pueblo Gringo, Got a Hanger? 
High Heeled Tittty Twister 
Hot Beach 
Hurricane Hinzi 
I Claudius 
I Lean 
I'm Having A Vision 
Ian's Climb 
Illegal Smile 
Impulsive Hands 
Institutional Meat 
Joy of Cholla, The 
Jumpin' the Gun 
Just Thesenga It 
Kalahari Sidewinder 
Killer Toupee, The 
King Louie's Traverse 
La Temperatura de Shelf 
LaCholla Jackson 
Lats Don't Have Feelings 
Legend on the Fall 
Leisure Class 
Manly Bulges 
Midget Toss 
Morning Joe 
Muscle Beach 
New Ethics 
New World Order 
Ol' 47 
Oscar de la Cholla 
Out There Take Anything 
Paleolithic Tool Traditions 
Part Muffalo 
Pick Pocket 
Politically Incorrect 
Poquito Mas 
Puff Daddy 
Purple Corner 
Quasi Quasar 
Raven, The 
Reach Around, The 
Red Eclipse 
Red Giant 
Redman's Burden 
Richard Simmons' Tanktop 
Risky Business 
Shelf Pride 
Short Man's Burden 
Six More Bottles of Basco 
Six Pack O' Whoop-Ass 
Solar Eclipse 
Spray Lord 
Squeeze the Moment 
Stand, The 
Super Suka 
Third Stage 
Three-Quarter Ton 
Thumbs Up 
Tits Up 
Too Much Beef and Not Enough Meat 
Total Recount 
Totally Blonde 
Turkey's Bleak 
Two For One 
Under A Blood Red Wall 
Usual Suspects, The 
Utter To A Scream 
Wadsworth Boulevard 
White Punks on Pockets 
Whiteman's Burden 
Working Man 
World Peace 
You Show Me Your Heavy Weapon, I'll Show You Mine 

Lats Don't Have Feelings 

YDS: 5.11d French: 7a Ewbanks: 24 UIAA: VIII British: E5 6a

Type:  Sport, 1 pitch, 75'
Consensus:  YDS: 5.11c/d French: 7a Ewbanks: 24 UIAA: VIII British: E4 6a [details]
FA: Bob D'Antonio, Richard Aschert, Dave Dangle, Darryl Roth, 1987
Page Views: 6,548
Submitted By: Richard M. Wright on Sep 24, 2001
Good Page? 0 people like this page. Your opinion:   

You & This Route  |  Other Opinions (145)
Your todo list:
Your stars:
Your rating: -none- [change]
Your ticklist: [add new tick]
Ian Achey leading a proud onsight of Lats Don't Ha...


At just about the mid-point of Cactus Cliff is a red wall with two lines that nearly converge. The left is Lats and the right is Blood Red Wall. For Lats, fire up pockets and edges just left of a block that starts Blood Red. Chase a seam with pockets for an additional half dozen clips. It is very continuous 5.11 climbing with no terrifically specific crux that ticks in at 5.11d. Excellent stone.

N.B. Some of the old maps have misnamed Lats, so check the source. In the old versions, Blood Red was sometimes called Lats, however, Lats starts left of the block.


Eight bolts.

Photos of Lats Don't Have Feelings Slideshow Add Photo
Ian Achey finishing the Aestethic Lats Don't Have Feelings.
Ian Achey finishing the Aestethic Lats Don't Have ...
A.S. getting into the goods on "Lats Don't Have Feelings".
A.S. getting into the goods on "Lats Don't Have Fe...
Travis warming up, first route at shelf. Make it a classic. <br /> <br />Photo: Ben I.
Travis warming up, first route at shelf. Make it a...
4th bolt before repair.
BETA PHOTO: 4th bolt before repair.
Making the 3rd clip.
Making the 3rd clip.
Kevin Mclaughlin leading "Lats".
Kevin Mclaughlin leading "Lats".
4th bolt after repair.
BETA PHOTO: 4th bolt after repair.
Cactus Cliff - Left (2). <br /> <br />Errata: Route 31 is Tits Up, Route 32 is Hot Beach.
BETA PHOTO: Cactus Cliff - Left (2).

Errata: Route 31 is Tits...
Long bolts require a special bit.
Long bolts require a special bit.
A.S. approaching the anchor of "Lats Don't Have Feelings".
A.S. approaching the anchor of "Lats Don't Have Fe...
Broken studs. 5th bolt on left, 4th on right.
BETA PHOTO: Broken studs. 5th bolt on left, 4th on right.
A.S. surveying the road ahead on "Lats Don't Have Feelings".
A.S. surveying the road ahead on "Lats Don't Have ...
The 3rd bolt that was replaced 12-31-09. In with the <a href='/v/106641994'>new</a>.
The 3rd bolt that was replaced 12-31-09. In with t...
5th bolt before repair.
BETA PHOTO: 5th bolt before repair.
A.S. reaching high on "Lats Don't Have Feelings".
A.S. reaching high on "Lats Don't Have Feelings".
5th bolt after repair.
BETA PHOTO: 5th bolt after repair.
Great route, final rest before the finish.
Great route, final rest before the finish.
Comments on Lats Don't Have Feelings Add Comment
Show which comments
Comments displayed oldest to newestSkip Ahead to the Most Recent Dated Mar 23, 2014
By Dan Green
Jun 1, 2002

Climb is very continuous with a good jug a little above the mid point to take some of the edge off of your lactic burn. There is also a deep mono that you can shake out on. This route deserves 3 stars and is a must do for the grade. Nothing on the route is harder than 11c but the endurance test is what makes it really fun!

By Matt Johnson
Nov 6, 2002

*** don't think i've ever seen my lats explode through my skin before*** a must do!!! one of my favorites in the valley... just keep thinking "there's a rest soon i know it" but dont count on it...move fast!!.

By richard magill
Dec 2, 2002
rating: 5.11d 7a 24 VIII E5 6a

Classic! I did this again last weekend and I still think it is one of the nicest 5.11 sport climbs in the front range. Great stone, great continuity, and a building forearm pump the whole way!

By Anonymous Coward
Dec 15, 2003

I don't know why this has lats in the name. Forearm pump I felt, but it's vertical, so lats, not so much. It's also a really fun 11c-ish route. I also didn't think it was too run out, either. the holds are big thru there, and you won't hit anything if you fall.

Re: above can it be an onsight on your second burn? Did you keep your eyes closed for the first?

By Stephan Greenway
Dec 15, 2003

In the immortal words of Hiditaki Sizuki...."First time I climb not so good....second time Onsight Frrrrrash"

By willem
Jun 6, 2004

This climb has been retrobolted. The manky old cold shuts have been replaced with new hangers, and I believe two new bolts got added. Not sure why there is one about three feet from the anchors though....

By Ken Trout
From: Golden, CO
Dec 29, 2007
rating: 5.11d 7a 24 VIII E5 6a

New hangers are a start. More bolts might be okay but are not what this route really needs. Since the route has new hangers now, it is even more important to get rid of the old bolts. When the nuts were unsecrewed to put on the new hangers, the old bolts were likley weakened!! I've broken off several 3/8" wedge-bolts while trying to unscrew them with a short wrench.

It's not so hard to do it right at Shelf, thanks to the soft rock. I did a same-hole replacement of the first bolt on Arnold-Arnold years ago. Here is what worked for me. First, I drilled along the top-side of the old bolt with a 3/16" drill bit. Then, tapping the old bolt toward the new void, got it loose enough to pull easy, no crow-barring. Finally, I redrilled the hole to 1/2" and put in a 1/2" x 3" Rawl.

If the hole seems too wide, it is possible to use a 1/2" by 5 & 3/4" Rawl bolt. See my picture of the special bit needed for these long bolts. Flared holes have not been a problem for me at Shelf, but it's good to be ready.

I've been waiting for years for someone else to do the fix. Not the FA guys, they've done a lot for climbers. I've got a borrowed drill and lots the proper hardware, thanks to Kirk Miller. If I get motivated, then I'll update this page.

By GeoffElson
Sep 15, 2008

In the picture topo it shows a additional route going left after the first few bolts and it is called "I Have a Vision" is this corect? I there a reason this marvelous route isn't submitted?

By climberz
Apr 16, 2009

A heads up.... The 3rd bolt and the 5th bolt are pretty bad, particularly the 3rd. From below, you can see a cm or so of the bolt sleeve. If the 3rd pulls (seems like it will sometime soon), decking will happen. If someone has the expertise and equipment, I would be happy to help. Too good a climb to have such shoddy gear on.
Looks like a same hole replacement will not work. The hole is eroded and flared on the bottom side.

By Rob Kepley
From: Westminster,CO
Apr 16, 2009
rating: 5.11+ 7a 24 VIII E4 6a

Agree about the 3rd clip. I remember being kinda sketched out moving above it because the climbing is sorta tricky there.

By adrenalated
From: Thornton, CO
May 25, 2009
rating: 5.11c/d 7a 24 VIII E4 6a

Hopefully someone with the knowledge to do it properly (I don't) can go up there soon and replace the bad bolts. As someone else said, this climb is too aesthetic, too classic to have bad gear on it....

By Caleb Phillips
From: Boulder, CO
Oct 19, 2009

Is it just me or does the third clip risk a pretty serious ledge fall if you blow it? Maybe the terrain is easy there? Broken ankles suck.

By slim
Oct 19, 2009
rating: 5.11d 7a 24 VIII E5 6a

For me, the 3rd clip (currently 5th clip) was ALWAYS the crux of the route. If the bolt was a foot lower you could clip it from good holds and the best stance. Definitely be careful, as I had a partner blow the clip and come really close to getting busted up on the ledgy terrain below.

By Monty
From: Golden, CO
Jan 2, 2010

Replaced the 3rd bolt on New Year's Eve at night; new year, new hardware. The 3rd bolt was looking a little sketch especially for that soft stone.

The 5th bolt, yes the one that you clip before the "run-out" looks very similar to how the 3rd looked (not as bad), didn't know that when I was there that night. It's on my to do list.

By adrenalated
From: Thornton, CO
Jan 3, 2010
rating: 5.11c/d 7a 24 VIII E4 6a

Thanks, Monty!

By Doug Lintz
From: Kearney, NE
Jan 3, 2010

Thanks, Monty. It looks like you moved the replacement bolt a little lower, so hopefully it'll ease the sketchiness of the clip.

By Tony B
From: Around Boulder, CO
Dec 30, 2010

Lats don't have feelings afterall. Not a lats type of climb. Forearms, however, do have feelings and mine had some griping to do about trying this at the end of a cold day.
Nice climbing, but I can't give 4 stars to it.

By Kegan Minock
From: colorado springs
Jan 30, 2011
rating: 5.11c 6c+ 24 VIII- E4 6a

Super awesome route. If you don't have endurance, this will get pretty pumpy.

By kzittle
From: Boulder, CO
May 10, 2011

Awesome route! My first 11+ route and loved it. Almost got the onsight, but the pump got the best of me going from the final bolt to the anchors. Excellent.

By Curt MacNeill
From: Boulder, CO
Jan 11, 2012

This route is dope! I remember way back to my first trip at Shelf seeing Lats from the Bank campground. It will be one of the first routes that catches your eye from across the canyon. The heavily chalked streak going up the beautiful, red colored face is well worth doing. I would say that if you are a 5.11 climber, then Lats may seem a bit hard and extremely pumpy. If you're a solid 5.12 and up climber, you could easily use this climb as a warmup and it will feel pretty chill. The stone is bullet hard, and although some people think it's polished, I didn't think it is (definitely not Rifle polished). Regardless, this super sweet route is a Shelf Road Mega Classic, and I would say in the top 10 of all routes in the area.

By Derek Lawrence
From: Bailey
Jan 22, 2012

5th and 4th bolts have been replaced. (While the 5th was the one with the rock blown out around it, after seeing how rusted it looked, I went ahead and replaced the 4th as well....)
Big thanks to ASCA for the hardware!!

By Ben Hall
From: Boulder, Colorado
Feb 14, 2013

First 11d onsight! This route seems to favor balancy climbers. Thin feet and committing crimps make this route a Shelf Road classic. Beautiful line.

By Jordan Hirro
From: Colorado Springs/Glenwood Spri
Dec 2, 2013

Such a fun route! As mentioned, I didn't find any moves harder than 11c...just the fact that they're stacked back to back makes it more difficult. You definitely need the endurance for a solid redpoint. Go have fun!

By sanz
From: Raleigh, NC
Mar 23, 2014

Absolutely stellar route. Several 11+ cruxes with still 5.11 movement between. Bolt placement was much, much spicier than anything else we did at Shelf. Reminded me of the New. Do not blow the fifth clip.