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How to Set Up New Routes?
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By Zack Wentz
From Vancouver, BC
Oct 12, 2012
All I need is cams, cams, cams....

Hello everyone!

I've been wondering for awhile how exactly does one set up a new sport route? Now, to get things straight, I know a good bit about which bolts/hangers to drill in for what rock types, location, etc, but I haven't found anything on technique for drilling/placing a bolt itself and knowing where to purchase a drill and bolts/hangers. I live in Vancouver, BC Canada, so if anyone has any ideas for places to find a bolt drill and bolts, please let me know.


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By skiclimber
Oct 12, 2012
jibbing at chasm lake

Awesome!!! Looking forward to this conversation. LMAO


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By Kevin Connolly
From CO
Oct 12, 2012

grab a bunch of redheads at home depot, hangers can be made with angle iron and a drill to save money. use aluminum if you are in to the whole light/fast thing. put one in every 2 to 3 feet and you should be good.


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By Dom
Administrator
From New Brunswick Canada
Oct 12, 2012
Moby dick 5.11-

Ahh man! To the OP, you are going to get Crucified on this thread. The best way to learn all this is going with someone who has done it before and will know all the details.


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By kennoyce
From Layton, UT
Oct 12, 2012
Climbing at the Gallery in Red Rocks

Zack Wentz wrote:
Hello everyone! I've been wondering for awhile how exactly does one set up a new sport route? Now, to get things straight, I know a good bit about which bolts/hangers to drill in for what rock types, location, etc, but I haven't found anything on technique for drilling/placing a bolt itself and knowing where to purchase a drill and bolts/hangers. I live in Vancouver, BC Canada, so if anyone has any ideas for places to find a bolt drill and bolts, please let me know.


The actual process isn't all that hard, but this is not something that you can learn on the internet. You need to find someone who is developing routes, and follow them in person. Developing routes is a lot more than just knowing the right kind of drill and where to buy bolts/hangers. You need to know how to tell where the rock is good enough to put a bolt, how to properly clean the route, how to tell if a route is even worth bolting, ect.

Also, you may want to ask yourself if it is really worth it to you. Do you really want to spend $500+ on a drill, properly equiping a route is going to run you around $50 minimum per route, not to mention the time involved. This past weekend I spent a full three days bolting a single 11-bolt route. Sure I could have showed up, rapped off and thrown in all 11 bolts in an hour, but then the route would have been dirty, with bad bolt placements in bad rock and it wouldn't have even been worth climbing. After investing 3 days of hard work into cleaning the rock and making sure that I have the bolts just where they should be, I think I've got a pretty good route. If you're not willing to put in the time necessary, please don't ruin the rock for future developers who are.


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By Josh Kornish
Oct 12, 2012
The Roach

.........

I'm just going to give it to you straight.

If you are asking these questions you have no business bolting anything.


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By 20 kN
From Hawaii
Oct 12, 2012

If you have to ask, you are not ready. Find someone experienced in your area and follow him around. That is the best way to learn.

kennoyce wrote:
You need to know how to tell where the rock is good enough to put a bolt, how to properly clean the route, how to tell if a route is even worth bolting, ect.


Yep, and in this case the "ect" is an entire book of things. I could write a 50 page article on bolting and I am sure I would still miss something.

Fortunately, someone else has already written that 50 page article.
www.bolt-products.com/Glue-inBoltDesign.htm


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By Zack Wentz
From Vancouver, BC
Oct 12, 2012
All I need is cams, cams, cams....

I just wanted to learn the techniques for drilling bolts; no need for insulting comments. I've climbed with legends in the climbing world that have established famous routes in Colorado. I'll talk to them next time if I have any questions.


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By Dustin B
From Steamboat
Oct 12, 2012
It's always a party.

Yet the caption of your profile pic says all I need is cams cams cams...


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By Ryan W.
From Boulder, CO
Oct 12, 2012
Gossamer at Rushmore

yeeerrrrr gonnnaaa dieeee!!!


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By Finn the Human
From The Land of Ooo
Oct 13, 2012
Mathematical!

Zack Wentz wrote:
I've climbed with legends in the climbing world that have established famous routes in Colorado. I'll talk to them next time if I have any questions.


Haha, you do that.


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By skiclimber
Oct 13, 2012
jibbing at chasm lake

I swear I wanted to call troll at the beginning of this thread, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt, But now that he climbs with legends, I am glad I didn't call him out. Sadly it wasn't a troll.


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By Keenan Waeschle
From Bozeman, MT
Oct 13, 2012
on top of the RNWF <br />June 2012

give it a fucking rest, the dude seems like a noob, but he just wants to know how to place bolts safely.

I get in situations that should be over my head all the time. I have grandiose plans of what I'm capable of and I usually manage to make it up my intended route, albeit with some french technique. Still, climbing is about having fun. Hopefully this guy isn't a massive idiot who will start bolting shit lines in popular areas, perhaps he won't actually bolt anything. Whatever he does, give him some info and point him (gently) in the right direction. Don't call him a troll like some fucking internet douche who does nothing but sit on climbing forums calling out people for being "trolls". BTW, those people can go fuck themselves, I hate you. It's like a chorus of douchey peons all jumping up and down saying the same inane thing, no one cares.

Zack, I've never placed a bolt in my life, I can't give you jack shit for advice, other than be smart about what routes you put up. If it's some undeveloped cliff mess around on there, TR the lines first and figure out natural clipping stances, figure out what the pro's do before you even think about sinking a drill into the stone, don't just get all willy nilly with the bolt gun.

If it's a already developed cliff practice somewhere else first, or get second hand info from a local. Basically don't get all willy nilly with that bolt gun.

Whatever you do, goodluck.


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By Goat
From Boulder
Oct 13, 2012
Unknown climb in The Needles

By Zack Wentz
From: Vancouver, BC
Apr 23, 2012

Just climbed "Buried Treasure" this afternoon, and I must say this has got to be one of my all-time favorite climbs. It's been so hard finding quality, bolted, multi-pitch routes in the canyon. It really is "Buried Treasure," as finding a route this well-bolted with this much vertical climbing in such a bomber spot is really discovering something new.

That said, please don't retro-bolt or remove bolts from this route. I'm new to climbing, and I'm hoping to eventually become a trad leader doing multi-pitch climbing. The standard progression for a climber learning to lead trad is to lead sport routes before attempting to lead trad. We need routes like these still available for amateurs like myself to practice the belay transition, hauling, and top-belay systems that are crucial to know when doing a multi-pitch and/or big wall climb. The bolts aren't affecting where you place your trad gear, so please cut us a break and leave the route as it is. I'll promise to approach it in a year with my trad gear.

End Quote

I'm impressed that you were able to penetrate into the elite climbing world so quickly. What climbing legends are you now associated with?


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By Josh Kornish
Oct 13, 2012
The Roach

Zack Wentz wrote:
I just wanted to learn the techniques for drilling bolts; no need for insulting comments. I've climbed with legends in the climbing world that have established famous routes in Colorado. I'll talk to them next time if I have any questions.


You end your OP asking where to buy bolting equipment. One would assume that if you are looking for said equipment you are looking to bolt rock. No one is personally attacking you just asking you to postpone your bolting plans.

Just curious, were they original stonemasters?


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By J. Albers
From Colorado
Oct 13, 2012
Bucky

Evan Deis wrote:
I'm impressed that you were able to penetrate into the elite climbing world so quickly. What climbing legends are you now associated with?


What exactly was the purpose of your post? Oh yeah, you wanted everyone to know that you are capable being a jerk. Got it. Perhaps you should read Keenan's post above...that was meant to be read by folks like you.

To Zack,

As 20 kN stated, you're not going to figure out how to bolt on MP. You need a mentor, plain and simple. Stick around the climbing community for long enough and you will find the right person. Good luck.


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By JCM
From Golden, CO
Oct 13, 2012

Ok, here's some useful and non-sarcastic advice (which seems to be missing thus far from this thread).

Bolting is a nuanced endeavor, and it is essential that you do it right. Botch-jobs are an eyesore and a danger. You won't learn the skills you need on this website; you should learn, in person, from someone experienced.

Fortunately, you live somewhere with a strong community of climbers, near a fantastic climbing area (Squamish, of course) that is undergoing a bit of a new-route renaissance. There are lots of folks around SW BC who are doing a ton of work unearthing new lines (literally unearthing, in your part of the world, since a lot of dirt and moss has to be removed to clean up new routes). This unearthing of routes is a lot of work, and I would venture than some of these folks would not protest the addition of an assistant to help with the manual labor.

So, post up in the "New Routes" section of the forum on www.squamishclimbing.com Say that you want to learn the dark arts of new routing. Offer to haul loads, belay for hours, and scrub granite until it shines, all in exchange for precious knowledge. Somewhat Faustian. Hopfully, someone will take the bait, you'll find a mentor, and they'll have an apprentice to help them dig moss out of that next Squamish classic.


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By s.price
From PS,CO
Oct 13, 2012
 Morning Dew ,self portrait

Jon Moen is spot on. Offer a hand. New routing is alot of work. Buck Up and you will soon be putting drill to stone with the knowledge you gleaned from a mentor. It is an extremely rewarding art.


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By Eric Whitbeck
Oct 17, 2012

Quit your job, climb for a few years living out of your truck or in a friends back yard. Climb some big walls. Boulder all winter. Spend a summers sport climbing. Do that and you will be able to answer your own question.


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