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Help Climbers Attacked in Peru
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By Michael Dupont
Jan 4, 2013

Jon Zucco wrote:
Makes me want to go taco on Peru.


Not sure what this means. Eat at Taco Bell and foul their water supply?


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By NickinCO
From colorado
Jan 4, 2013
after the hard stuff, into cruiser hands.

Old Crusty wrote:
Don't you wish you could send in the Marines! What a horrible story.


or brandish a firearm when they started throwing rocks... I'd be more afraid of what the local government would do to me if I did end up having to use it though.


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By Unassigned User
Jan 4, 2013

NickinCO wrote:
or brandish a firearm when they started throwing rocks... I'd be more afraid of what the local government would do to me if I did end up having to use it though.

Don't worry we won't have the right to defend ourselves very long.


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 4, 2013
modern man

thefish wrote:
but true


I wont even drive a car into Juarez for 30 minutes


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 4, 2013
modern man

NickinCO wrote:
Living in chicago I've been jacked multiple times by gun and knife point. It really sucks to be in that situation. I don't roadtrip (even within the US) unarmed.


how does that go crossing borders Nick or do you just buy a new one after every crossing?


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By PatrickV
From Albuquerque, New Mexico
Jan 4, 2013
mexico

Sorry to rain on the inevitable woulda, coulda, shoulda, internet tough guy parade, but bouncing from country to country in South America (crossing borders, dealing with police) with a loaded gun seems to me just as naive as stopping to camp along side a country road in the third world... "because we shouldn't be driving at night." Am I wrong?

My condolences to these three, nobody should have to endure things like this.

-Patrick


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By Unassigned User
Jan 4, 2013

TRmasta wrote:
how does that go crossing borders Nick or do you just buy a new one after every crossing?

its no problem when the local mexican cops are your buds!

Nobdy F's with you!


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By Ryan Williams
Administrator
From London (sort of)
Jan 4, 2013
El Chorro

I wish them all a speedy recovery - both mental and physical.

It's pointless to sit here and argue about how you (or anyone) travels or should travel in "third world countries." Good chance that at least a few people that have responded couldn't even give a completely accurate definition of that term anyway.

I've illegally crossed into Burma on a jungle road, picked up a Burmese refugee, and snuck her back into Thailand. I easily could have (and probably should have) gotten in all kinds of trouble for that, but of course nothing happened. Then these completely innocent people in Peru got the shit kicked out of them and had all their belongings stolen because they turned down the wrong road.

Bad shit can happen anywhere and often times it is more about luck than anything else. I certainly didn't get away with my adventures in the lesser traveled parts of Asia because I was thinking clearly.

The world is a big place. In some parts it most certainly is "standard procedure" to have a guide or a local with you at all times. There are A LOT of places where the locals aren't kind and friendly at all - at least not to rich outsiders (which all of us are when we travel to these places).

Then there are other places where you can travel freely without any fear of anything like this happening (but sometimes it still does). There are actually a lot of places that are much safer than the US and some of them are in fact third world countries but let's not kid ourselves, the world can be an ugly place and it's only getting worse. Most people are friendly, third world or not, but it only takes a few shitty folks to create a big mess like this one.

If I was going to drive from the US to Peru with $5000 worth of personal gear I'd expect to have some problems keeping it secure. You can't just roll around snapping pictures with your DSLR and downloading them to your $4000 laptop and expect no one to notice. That's not the way the world works.

Like I said, I wish these folks a speedy recovery and in no way am I saying that any of this was their fault. But expecting for everything to go fine on a trip like that is unrealistic and making blanket statements about the safety of travel in the third world is like making a blanket statement about the safety of high altitude mountaineering. A shit ton of objective dangers involved in both and by participating you are accepting that those dangers can fuck you up or kill you.


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By Unassigned User
Jan 4, 2013

good post Ryan, well said


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 4, 2013
modern man

will you be donating Ryan? she did lose an Iphone 5.


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By NickinCO
From colorado
Jan 4, 2013
after the hard stuff, into cruiser hands.

TRmasta wrote:
how does that go crossing borders Nick or do you just buy a new one after every crossing?


In the US like I posted? It goes fine. Why wouldn't it? I haven't taken a roadtrip outside of our borders, only flown and stayed at a resort. I also wasn't arm chair quarterbacking.. only posting what I personally do. I wouldn't road trip through mexico. Crossed the border once and had to bribe a cop out of going to "mexican prison" for speeding (which we weren't doing).


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By Ryan Williams
Administrator
From London (sort of)
Jan 4, 2013
El Chorro

TRmasta wrote:
will you be donating Ryan? she did lose an Iphone 5.


No I won't be. Sorry that this happened to them but I have to admit they lost a little bit of credibility with me when they posted up the MSRP value of their goods that were stolen. Shit sucks - but they weren't on that kind of trip w/o some extra cash in the bank and the girl that is headed home has gainful employment. None of them are stuck in Peru w/o enough money to fly home. If they were, maybe I'm shoot 'em a few bucks, but donating money to people who probably have more than I do in the bank? Don't think so.


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By Josh Janes
Jan 4, 2013

If this was just a typical mugging or theft - even if it involved the victims being assaulted or killed - this story might not be so surprising. But what I find interesting is that, according to the victims, an entire village seemed to want them lynched. That begs the question of whether something else was going on here - perhaps they were confused with other criminals or they had committed some sort of trespass themselves?

The fact that they were just chilling around their vehicle drinking beers (as if it was a campfire in Indian Creek) on an unknown dirt road in a dangerous area makes me wonder if there was more going on here - be it in attitude or action.


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By gearwhore
From Orange, CA
Jan 4, 2013

Ryan Williams wrote:
If I was going to drive from the US to Peru with $5000 worth of personal gear I'd expect to have some problems keeping it secure. You can't just roll around snapping pictures with your DSLR and downloading them to your $4000 laptop and expect no one to notice. That's not the way the world works.


Amen brother!


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By Dirty Gri Gri, or is it GiGi?
From Vegas
Jan 4, 2013
Growing a winter coat in Red Rock Canyon- December 2013.

Josh Janes wrote:
But what I find interesting is that, according to the victims, an entire village seemed to want them lynched. That begs the question of whether something else was going on here


Remember this story?

Misunderstanding...


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 4, 2013
modern man

Josh Janes wrote:
If this was just a typical mugging or theft - even if it involved the victims being assaulted or killed - this story might not be so surprising. But what I find interesting is that, according to the victims, an entire village seemed to want them lynched. That begs the question of whether something else was going on here - perhaps they were confused with other criminals or they had committed some sort of trespass themselves? The fact that they were just chilling around their vehicle drinking beers (as if it was a campfire in Indian Creek) on an unknown dirt road in a dangerous area makes me wonder if there was more going on here - be it in attitude or action.


I started thinking negative thoughts after reading about how her Iphone5 was taken. If it was a droid would it have been mentioned? I think not.

Imagine the morality of these people. Didnt they know all of her contacts were on that one device???


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 4, 2013
modern man

that happens here in the US of A too, right here in CT a guy was put in the hospital after a bunch of thugs came down on him after their buddy on an illegal dirt bike ran a stop sign and got pulverized by a working stiff in a van. I'm sure this is not an isolated experience to S America.
www.newhavenindependent.org/index.php/archives/entry/mayor_n>>>


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By Jon Zucco
From Denver, CO
Jan 4, 2013
yaak crack Red Rock Canyon, NV

Michael Dupont wrote:
Not sure what this means. Eat at Taco Bell and foul their water supply?


From a thread titled: Climbing Mag Doesn't Pay

By john strand
From southern colo
Dec 27, 2012


"I have tried tha t for several months... how about-


Pay Me


This is complete bullshit.. i have worked in the print media for many years.. pay for print is what we said .. end of disussion


I'm originally from the east coast.. the deal is pay me..

if not, then we have an issue.. not good

Maybe I'll go taco"


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By Devin Fin
From DURANGO
Jan 4, 2013
dream canyon fun!

they should call in the A team ! an get some revenge ! third world toilets....? who cares about an I POD wen you have lost some teeth! sounds like a nightmare... wen south of the border you have to be extra careful!!!


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By Brian in SLC
Jan 4, 2013
Climbing in Smuggler's Notch

Yep, first thing I thought of. US Travel Advisory to Guatemala still mentions that stuff...

Avoid close contact with local children, including taking photographs, especially in rural areas. Such contact can be viewed with deep suspicion and may provoke panic and violence.

Makes you wonder what the story is from the Peru side. Weird deal.


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By coppolillo
Jan 4, 2013

yeah, running over people and starting to shoot would've really controlled the situation....i'd put a grand that these folks would be dead had they started shooting or run some people over. seems they were outnumbered 50 to 3 or so? so unless they had a gun and a ton of ammo and were prepared to shoot dozens of people (how many guns did the locals have? how many did they have that went unseen?) or were going to run over a dozen people (would they have gotten out? barricades?), they probably would've been killed.

i'm not sure trying to out-shoot or run over 40 or more people would've worked. but hey, you're an american male, with a keyboard, so chest-pounding and bravado are de rigueur, right?

hope you guys heal up and get back to the States all right. sorry to hear of all this....spooky.


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By Highlander
From Ouray, CO
Jan 4, 2013

Maybe next time they will have travelers insurance, lesson learned. Maybe they should get a job instead of traveling abroad to pay for all their non essential material possessions.


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By Medic741
From Pittsford, New York
Jan 5, 2013
When I was a bum at Frey

As having been through the rioting random flare up roadblocks and South America shit its seriously how ya handle yourself. React calmly, respectively and assertively you're going to be ok most of the time. Carrying a weapon is not a good idea in sa IMHO unless you have an ARMY. And that's from my experiences down there...


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By jmeizis
From Colorado Springs, CO
Jan 5, 2013
The Beginning of Mr. Clean (5.8) at the Barkeater Cliffs in Adirondack Park NY.

Highlander wrote:
Maybe they should get a job instead of traveling abroad to pay for all their non essential material possessions.


Empathy not your strong suit? I don't think they're looking for a handout to replace their I-pad or some shit, it's just a list of things they lost. They have to pay to get home, to replace their papers. It sounds like they have medical bills they have to pay.


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By Dirty Gri Gri, or is it GiGi?
From Vegas
Jan 5, 2013
Growing a winter coat in Red Rock Canyon- December 2013.

Medic741 wrote:
As having been through the rioting random flare up roadblocks and South America shit its seriously how ya handle yourself. React calmly, respectively and assertively you're going to be ok most of the time. Carrying a weapon is not a good idea in sa IMHO unless you have an ARMY. And that's from my experiences down there...


My BF, and I rented a car in Argentina to get around, and go climbing, and it was a little unnerving having to go through so many surprise police checkpoints/roadblocks. Some military police even called us Gringos when showing our passports. : ( Anyway, I would not have felt comfortable having anything I wasn't supposed to have in our vehicle, and I would never dream of having a loaded gun when I'm "visiting" another country, that's for sure. That's just inviting trouble, and ill feelings, IMO. And yes, your body language, attitude, demeanor, and how you handle yourself in potentially volatile situations can make things better, or worse in an instant. We made the mistake of doing a quick turnaround drive into Chile from Argentina, and were detained by police as we were under suspicion when entering back into Argentina. We remained calm, and polite, and they ended up letting us through eventually. We weren't going to try, and piss them off. We'd lose. : )

Safe travels, everyone!


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