Gym Climbing Question

Is it ok to smear on routes in the gym? I find that some of the routes in the gym I go to are reachy and awkward unless I do a quick smear. I was trying to do a 5.10 that I thought was impossible to do without smearing and my partner for the day said that smearing was off. Is this what route setters intend? What are the rules during competitions? I figure smearing is pretty much always an option outdoors, but it seems that gym climbing plays by a different set of rules

Using the features on a wall is pretty much never "off" unless it's specified on the ID tape at the base.

i.e.:

"'Boogie til you Poop': 5.11+ (arete off)"

or

"Double Rainbow: 5.12- (crack off)"

Can't remember ever seeing, "(smears off)"... sounds like you're buddy might just be one of them know-it-all Gumby types.

I'd say that's someone interpreting "you have to follow the colored tape to stay on the route" to mean you can't use any walls. Which would be quite bizarre since smearing is a pretty essential skill for any climber and gyms are for training....

Yeah, I agree with Jon. Unless the tape specifies that a specific feature is off, the wall should be fair game.

That's kinda what I figured. I'd be willing to bet that a piece of tape came off a foothold or something

John Marsella wrote:One of the gyms I climb at has "nats on" on the tape of some routes. I think: when are nats NOT on?

chufftard wrote:You cannot scratch your balls, unless otherwise specified

"Nads off"

^ +1 ^

One of the best things I've read on here in a while.

It depends on the gym. Our college gym was pretty much vertical and so heavily featured that "No naturals, no smearing" is a necessary contrivance to make hard routes... otherwise the holds have to be heinously small and bad.

I've also been to a gym with few natural features, but a bunch of small screw-in jibs, which were implied to always be on. It made sense for that gym.

Many people approach the gym as training for climbing. At CATS, for example, matching and heel-hooking is frowned upon. While this is an extreme form of contrivance-in-the-service-of-training, it's on the same continuum as "nats off."

In general, though, smearing is implied to be on (certainly in competitions). If you think it's too much of a contrivance, try climbing the route with and without smearing, and see if you learn anything new!

John Marsella wrote:One of the gyms I climb at has "nats on" on the tape of some routes. I think: when are nats NOT on?

Sometime this is done to remind people, usually when the route was set around so called "naturals". If it wasn't marked, people would bitch about how bad or hard it was for the grade because gym climbers can't see past the tape.

I've never thought that smearing would be off, but I almost never remember to use the arete in the gym. Part of the reason is that my previous gym would explicitly say "arete on/off", so I ended up with that mindset and so now I assume it's off unless listed. It's made for a few "wtf is this so hard" moments until I clue in. =)

Rajiv Ayyangar wrote:At CATS, for example, matching and heel-hooking is frowned upon.

Seriously? Heel-hooking is its own skill worthy of practicing. Would be a shame if you get outdoors and don't know how to heel-hook...

Craig T wrote: Seriously? Heel-hooking is its own skill worthy of practicing. Would be a shame if you get outdoors and don't know how to heel-hook...

For really strong climbers who climb plenty outside... it makes sense:
catsclimbing.com/2012/02/ca…

I tried it myself for a while, and acquired a bunch of new techniques.

Rajiv Ayyangar wrote:At CATS, for example, matching and heel-hooking is frowned upon.

That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard of. Honestly if a gym employee came up and told me not to match, I'd most likely fall on the floor in gut busting laughter. It's a staple move. And that article sounds like BS. We don't allow matching and heel hooking because we want you to be a better climber? Climbing is a personal thing, and matching doesn't make me a better or worse climber. And in my opinion, not allowing those things aren't "ethics" anyways. They are just contrived rules.

Other than having the nesseary gym etiquette, I climb however I want to. Smearing, steming, or whatever work for me which has included using empty stud holds.

It's the gym. Try not to take it too seriously.

Rajiv Ayyangar wrote: For really strong climbers who climb plenty outside... it makes sense: catsclimbing.com/2012/02/ca… I tried it myself for a while, and acquired a bunch of new techniques.

I read that. To me it seemed poorly written, not to mention that the points he is trying to convey do not make sense at all. To be blunt, IMHO it sounds like a bunch of pretentious BS.

So pretentious it's where all the pros in Boulder train. It's not that heel-hooking and matching isn't good technique. It's that when you're in the gym trying to get stronger (particularly on short, steep walls like at CATS where there are no "routes" or "problems" anyways) squaring up and avoiding those techniques will maximize the gains of the workout. Pretentious. Maybe, but there are other gyms if you don't like it. Effective. Definitely, as the frequent users of CATs are the strongest climbers around Boulder.

TheBirdman wrote:So pretentious it's where all the pros in Boulder train.

Hmmm funny I see Lynn Hill, Cedar Wright, Daniel Woods, Matt Segal and other pros training and climbing at Movement.

They must have gotten kicked out of CATS for matching a double heel hook.

Gym climbing is a game, play by whatever rules you want.

I thought this was called "Mountain Project??" What does that have to do with a gym? Isn't there a place called "gym project?" No, well could someone please start it and move this over there?

Scott McMahon wrote: Hmmm funny I see Lynn Hill, Cedar Wright, Daniel Woods, Matt Segal and other pros training and climbing at Movement. They must have gotten kicked out of CATS for matching a double heel hook.

Hmm, how do you know these are the strongest climbers in Boulder? And what makes you think they don't train at CATs too?

T.C. wrote:I thought this was called "Mountain Project??" What does that have to do with a gym? Isn't there a place called "gym project?" No, well could someone please start it and move this over there?

Maybe if you don't like reading about gym climbing you might consider NOT reading threads titled 'Gym Climbing Question'. Just sayin

Scott McMahon wrote:...It's the gym. Try not to take it too seriously.

+1