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Grapevine area in Southern California
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By Nelson Day
From Joshua Tree, CA
Jul 16, 2012
me (about to sneeze)

I have been up to the Grapevine area in the High Desert a few times now, and would like to add it to the Mountain Project database. I realize that this area has not been identified in any guide books, or on mountain project as of yet. It has been featured in a Rock and Ice magazine issue a few times, but the location has never been identified. I wanted to make sure I wasn't stepping on any toes before proceeding with creating this area on Mountain Project for everyone to see. Are there any objections to posting routes, approach information, maps and such on this website? I don't know who put the routes up, and don't know a lot of the history, but would like to give credit where it is due. If anyone has an objection to the addition of this area to mountain project, or if anyone has any first ascent information on the area, would you please contact me? I will wait a couple weeks for responses.

This area has some truly outstanding climbing; probably the best I have been on in a 70 mile radius, and compares in quality to great lines in Joshua Tree and Tahquitz in rock quality, position, and movement. I would like to share this area with the climbing community, unless anyone has objections.

Thanks,
Nelson


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By Tom Fralich
From Fort Collins, CO
Jul 16, 2012

Well, I think you should share it with me at the very least...


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By kennoyce
From Layton, UT
Jul 16, 2012
Climbing at the Gallery in Red Rocks

Tom Fralich wrote:
Well, I think you should share it with me at the very least...


Me too!


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By Ben Gordon
From La Canada, CA
Jul 16, 2012

Me three!

As for stepping on any toes, I think as long as you make a good faith effort to credit the FA party/solicit input you are golden.


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By Murf
Jul 16, 2012

Why put in on MP? All you'll do is get a few points for your MP id.

Unless of course you've bolted a few new lines that you want to expose? There's not more than a dozen or so routes, of which only one is classic, IMO.

For god's sake can we just have a few crags that people find out about because they actually talk to each other in the real world?


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By Nelson Day
From Joshua Tree, CA
Jul 16, 2012
me (about to sneeze)

Murf wrote:
Why put in on MP? All you'll do is get a few points for your MP id. Unless of course you've bolted a few new lines that you want to expose? There's not more than a dozen or so routes, of which only one is classic, IMO. For god's sake can we just have a few crags that people find out about because they actually talk to each other in the real world?


I appreciate the networking, and finding areas by climbing with others is definitely better than reading about them. My main intent is to share this area because I really really enjoyed it and wanted to share the love, not for a few points with MP. If you would prefer to not have this place posted, I will refrain. I just have a hard time keeping excellent climbing areas in my vicinity (which are few and far between) to myself. I guess I'm just easily excitable by good rock...

I have only been on a few routes up there. There is a really really good offwidth line that I TR'd last weekend. I TR'd it because 1. I suck at offwidth and need to practice and 2. because I don't have enough big gear to lead it... All of the routes on the rock I was climbing on were excellent. The rock quality itself is amazing. Getting Smaller has one of the best hand cracks I have ever been on, as well as a squeeze chimney and some interesting face climbing. Full value!


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By Ryan Nevius
From The Range of Light
Jul 16, 2012
Mt. Agassiz

You may want to try contacting the Rim of the World Climbing Club . As far as I know, they did some development in the area a few years back.


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By Guy Keesee
From Moorpark, CA
Jul 16, 2012
Big Boulder, just a bit downhill from Temple of Kali. Alabama Hills, CA.

Nelson.... Please post the location.

And screw points, get some good Karma Points - from me.

Who gives a rats A about the rim o the world klub.

If all the spots are well known it spreads out the herd.

Thank you

Guy Keesee


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By SeanG81
Jul 16, 2012
Triassic

Guy Keesee wrote:
Nelson.... Please post the location. And screw points, get some good Karma Points - from me.


+1


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By Steve_Sil.
From Los Angeles, CA
Jul 16, 2012

I am also interested in the details about this location. That crack looks really fun!!


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By duh
Jul 16, 2012

Nelson Day wrote:
I realize that this area has not been identified in any guide books, or on mountain project as of yet. It has been featured in a Rock and Ice magazine issue a few times, but the location has never been identified. I wanted to make sure I wasn't stepping on any toes before proceeding with creating this area on Mountain Project for everyone to see. Are there any objections to posting routes, approach information, maps and such on this website?


Fight Club???

We don't talk about and certainly don't post info on other peoples semi secret areas. The area has been around for about 20 years... and so far everyone has respected the fa's choice to keep it semi secret. Don't be "that guy" who breaks the trust.


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By Ryan Nevius
From The Range of Light
Jul 16, 2012
Mt. Agassiz

Some of it is already online:

Page 117 of mOthEr rOck (Page 9 of Issue #10)

SummitPost of Gnome Dome

I'm sure there's more, but that's what 60 seconds of Google did.


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By Nelson Day
From Joshua Tree, CA
Jul 17, 2012
me (about to sneeze)

Well, so I have differing opinions here. Keep it off the site, or no... I respect the desire to keep it semi-secret. If it is that important to Jack and/or others, I will keep it off the site. That was the intent of this post - to feel out the opinion of other members as well as the fa people. There are areas that just haven't been organized well, or that people have just not put in the work to publish anything official, and I wasn't sure if this was one of them.

And after reviewing the summitpost description, it pretty much sucks. I can put together something much better (been working on it for a bit now) that will give a lot better info on the area, but I really don't want to create any hard feelings in the local community.

Does anyone know who the FA team was? I know Rim of the World climbing club developed some of it, and I have emailed their president. Haven't heard back yet. The FA person/team opinion here would bring closure.


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By randy88fj62
Jul 17, 2012
Thunderbolt Peak in the Palisades

I live in Valencia and would love to know about closer climbing areas of good quality. If you won't post it then email me some info. I'd love to check it out.


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By Ryan Nevius
From The Range of Light
Jul 17, 2012
Mt. Agassiz

Good post Dayne


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By Nelson Day
From Joshua Tree, CA
Jul 17, 2012
me (about to sneeze)

I'm in the process of getting a decent approach map, driving directions, and pictures together and will be happy to share with people directly once it is completed, and while we are waiting to hear from the FA people on their opinion on the matter of adding it to the site. I agree that territorial/turf wars over "secret" areas are tiresome... this rock will be here for eons past any of our lifespans, and hoarding seems ridiculous. But such is the climbing culture.

I do respect Jack's opinion, as I have thoroughly enjoyed climbing in New Jack City, and he is a very prominent local. So I do want to not create too much dissention among the local community. If it comes down to it, we can always meet up somewhere and I can just show people where it is. Scheduling such outings is a PITA though. I will wait for a response from the FA peeps with regards to posting it on MP, but will share information directly with those who are interested once my compilation is ready.


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By Guy Keesee
From Moorpark, CA
Jul 17, 2012
Big Boulder, just a bit downhill from Temple of Kali. Alabama Hills, CA.

Dayne.... Thank you, for saying it like it is.

I have never herd this place called "GrapeVine"... its always been refered to as "Vector".....Old News

And to Duh.... why are you on MP???????????

I always thought this was THE PLACE to post about spots.

Nelson please put up any new stuff, you find.

GK


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By Fat Dad
From Los Angeles, CA
Jul 17, 2012

Does that means there's not going to be a page for Jack's Crag in the near future?

I always have mixed feelings about these issues. Back in the day, there weren't so many people to worry about letting the cat out of the bag. People didn't retrobolt, leave top ropes in place all day, etc. But then more areas spreads people out. If someone takes the time to develop, say, a sport crag then I say leave it to that person or group of people to decide. If it's just sitting there and hasn't seen much activity, then let your better judgment decide. Most of these little arcane areas are never going to be heavily trafficked.


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By Unassigned User
Jul 17, 2012

I know that area. Last time I drove through there I went back and checked it out. I would say that even with it on MP the area will never become crowded. It is good-ok climbing, good rock, desert temps. I dunno, I found it without MP, if you really look around you can find cool little gems like that.

JH


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By Tristan B
From La Crescenta, CA
Jul 17, 2012
Hanging out on Royal Arches

Shouldn;t be a big deal. Small places like Saddle Peak mountainproject.com/v/saddle-peak/106396557 and Tunnel Crag mountainproject.com/v/tunnel-crag/106559700
are both up on here, but I've only seen like 2 people at those spots before. It'd have to be something huge with like 50+ routes to really be worried about a bunch of people crowding it up. The only reason to really keep it secret is if there's potential for a few more FA's that you want to get, but it doesn't seam like thats the case.


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By Guy Keesee
From Moorpark, CA
Jul 17, 2012
Big Boulder, just a bit downhill from Temple of Kali. Alabama Hills, CA.

SECRET SPOTS.....

I have my own because I have projects going on and I dont wish to show up and have Noobs sending them all. (that was a joke)

The best way to keep folks from RETRO-BOLTING and CHIPPING is to publish your places, al la MOUNTAIN PROJECT or one of the other fine websites, send your stuff in to guidebook authors.

A prime example is poor old StoneMaster, Martin V. he kept his secret spot secret and when others found it... well they just added bolts and roots and went to town.


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By Nelson Day
From Joshua Tree, CA
Jul 18, 2012
me (about to sneeze)

Update:

I have been contacted by one of the members of the FA group. They have agreed to help me correctly identify the climbing areas, ratings, and FA information before posting it up on MP. Excellent! I'm stoked. He was the person who bolted Vector and Getting Small.

It may take a bit to get together with him, get all the information and such, but I will make sure to update this post once we have made some good progress.


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By Cosmiccragsman AKA Dwain
From Las Vegas, Nevada
Jul 20, 2012
BITD

Getting Smaller was done long before the bolts were put in.
The FA was done With cut pieces of slung 2x4s to pro the OW.
The original name of the Route was, Butt Crack, before someone renamed it.

There could be Access issues if this area is broadcast to the general public.

Please protect this area like the Margaritaville area has been protected. Keep this area adventurous


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