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Freedom of speech vs censorship
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By Eric Coffman
Aug 3, 2012
mountainlion

I believe in freedom of speech that we have in this country. You can say anything as long as it isn't a hate crime. Further more we are all adults and should be able to take it. Most of the time it is a humorous post (to the poster) but may not be percieved that way by others in the community. This is where the most lively threads originate most of the time. I've noticed that some posts and entire threads are deleted but then other poster's comments are allowed to stay even though they say the same thing as the deleted post(same goes for profanity, some of it stays some is deleted). This amounts to censorship, if a post or thread doesnt directly threaten another poster it should be allowed to stand. Let the poster feel the wrath of the community or lack of wrath from the community. I get that MP being a private enterprise can set and enforce it's own rules but then they should be consistent. Dont want any personal attacks then delete them all. Just my 2 cents.


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By bag
Aug 3, 2012

You don't seem to get the part about MP being a private enterprise etc. if you bothered to post this. Your freedom of speech applies to political speech and it really doesn't apply to whether a website chooses to leave your post up or not. MP has no constitutional or legal obligation to be your megaphone, esp. for shit as inconsequential as what gets discussed on here. Now if they somehow made it impossible for you to petition the government with your grievances you might be on to something...


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By Old and Busted
From Centennial, CO
Aug 3, 2012
Stabby

Why don't you itemize the general themes of the posts you've seen disappear? Maybe there's a trend. How about starting a thread where you can report a yanked post. My guess is that when the personal attacks start that triggers the deletions.


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By matt davies
Aug 3, 2012

Eric Coffman wrote:
I believe in freedom of speech that we have in this country. You can say anything as long as it isn't a hate crime.

So you are more an advocate of free speech in practice, which has been cowed by PC thuggery into a demure obsequiousness, over the First Amendment?

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I don't see any exceptions for "hate crimes".

The inconsistencies in MP forum policing are par for the course for the former, the latter has no practical bearing on the censorship or lack thereof of a private website.


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By Eric Coffman
Aug 3, 2012
mountainlion

I dont expect anything I just am airing my 2 cents. I just find it funny that I see a post in the morning and wonder what was said about it to find that it was removed during the day. Lots of times it is funny as hell from my POV.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

Here's my take on it: im advising a climber with his partner he just met on the internet to follow professional guides at 4am up The Grand ...in the dark a hard to find approach that requires 4th class scrambling on a wet in parts rock to ensure their first and successful ascent of the Grand ..of course some Dumbo is saying : dude wear a helmet! Well yea helmet is a freakin necessity and if discrediting my good advice makes the douche feel good about himself and its 'funny' so its all good. Yea and don't pick in my spelling..its kinda getting old. Whatever.


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By gunkshunk
Aug 3, 2012

I think what Eric is talking about was a thread called "a man who climbs hard is good to find". Those who know me know that I'm a gay climber and I often read offensive stuff posted that isnt removed referring to gay people (i dont expect or want it to change it is what it is). Yesterday some mom and her daughter posted the "hard man" thread and it was funny as hell and I also wanted to read it (even though it was about how 5.7-5.8 climbers were less than real men in these women's opinion--I climb in that range). However it touched a nerve with a certain pirate or buccaneer who seemed to get all butthurt. Next thing you know the post is gone. Sorry you all missed out.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

dude I saw the thread yea it was offensive. Some things funny can offend people and that kind of threads should be deleted. I work with a lot of gay men and they all have a great sence of humor but nevertheless are sensitive to certain issues and we all should be respectful of that. I get a lot of heat from some douchebags here and sometimes they get me to respond sarcastically so the thread inflames and gets deleted. I try not to succumb to their level though.
p.s. so anyway there was this guy (nasty dude) called Yarp and I started getting on his nerves on purpose so he got his but hurt too and complained to the mods like some bi**ch hahaha. The reason I was doing it is because he was very mean to a lot of people , I think I ran him off! :)


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

Eric Coffman wrote:
Your right Buggs the thread was offensive (if you dont like offensive language, or cant lead 5.10). I see posts directed specifically at YOU that are mean, derogatory, and offensive. The thread yesterday was no of those things. The lady merely asked for you to put up or shut up...ie if you have the stones to talk trash on MP post the pics of yourself kickin ass on the rock...if you dont kick ass on the rock stop postin your b.s. and find a different forum more suited to your skills.

the reason i dont post my pics is because the douches were picking on me. Trust me I have a ton of pics, good ones too! Most people know who I am and I have been climbing for a long time, have a lot of hands on knowledge, but at my best im average. I dont consider myself ballsy but meticulous in my approach. I dont take crap either. people know how i climb , no I did not bolt any routes the hardest I lead sport is 10a on a good day, trad 5.8 but the main reason im sarcastic is because it should not matter if im a man or a woman i have my voice and my opinion.

p.s. some mods know who i am and thats why they delete posts that attack me. I don't ask them to do it they do it on their own.


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By matt davies
Aug 3, 2012

Eric Coffman wrote:
I dont expect anything I just am airing my 2 cents. I just find it funny that I see a post in the morning and wonder what was said about it to find that it was removed during the day. Lots of times it is funny as hell from my POV.

I agree with you there. Guideline #1 is subjective enough to extend carte blanche to the moderators. Humor and offense are essentially linked. Mean is funny (and entertaining), but it is almost always at someone else's expense.
Personally, while I lament the fact that a lot of stuff I've posted that people seemed to enjoy has been recently deleted along with the threads they were posted to, I don't see any way the admins could do any better than they are. Some skins are thicker than other's and this is a general-use website, not some edgy comedy free-for all.
Also, it may be that the trolls that supply a good deal of the humor around here are just getting a bit too sensitive themselves, and deleting their own threads (you can delete a thread you start, right?) when the piling-on becomes too hilarious at their expense.
Who knows?
By the by, what happened your post Buggs quoted? I don't see it in the thread anymore.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

hehe im guilty of deleting my own posts and threads to "add drama" honestly its kinda silly.


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By Rob Gordon
From Hollywood, CA
Aug 3, 2012
Tough Mantle Problem.  Haven't sent yet...

Serious question though Buggs... Why is everything you post bordering on completely nonsensical. I'm not talking about the spelling. I just have no idea what you're trying to say half the time.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

im from another country its hard to understand me if you are not on the same page. it takes time getting used to the way i speak.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

...
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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

...
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By Eric Coffman
Aug 3, 2012
mountainlion

Hey Matt Davies my thread bugs quoted doesnt appear anymore because my computer was responding so slowly I thought it had frozen up. I was in a hurry and tried closing the page,hitting submit, and cancel I dont know but it appears to have canceled my post. I liked your post to a thread recently and there was nothing wrong with the thread it didnt hurt anybody. However I have posted some pictures of my wife climbing. Some people have made derogatory comments about (not removed BTW). I dont care I'm an adult and it is like water off a duck's back. However like I stated previously if posts are removed that are not hurting anyone and posts are kept that clearly are hurtful in thier intentions then what does that say about this site? Still entertaining though.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

Eric Coffman wrote:
Hey Matt Davies my thread bugs quoted doesnt appear anymore because my computer was responding so slowly I thought it had frozen up. I was in a hurry and tried closing the page,hitting submit, and cancel I dont know but it appears to have canceled my post. I liked your post to a thread recently and there was nothing wrong with the thread it didnt hurt anybody. However I have posted some pictures of my wife climbing. Some people have made derogatory comments about (not removed BTW). I dont care I'm an adult and it is like water off a duck's back. However like I stated previously if posts are removed that are not hurting anyone and posts are kept that clearly are hurtful in thier intentions then what does that say about this site? Still entertaining though.

i remember that...at work we just had the discussion about how the new generation has no respect for elders, what is human is lost and all is left is a servant to machines, stuff, more stuff. Lack of compassion, kindness viewed as a weakness. Indeed this website is not immune. The mods cannot be your mom and wash your mouth out with soap each time u blurt things out that are disrespectful, hurtful or offensive to another human being. Eric u have wisdom and good values. You are an individual who does not take what life brings for granted.


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By Eric Coffman
Aug 3, 2012
mountainlion

Thanks Bugs, I can be mean and hurtful to though (usually I regret it right away but it is difficult to put the genie back in the bottle). Regarding the thread that was deleted I was really looking forward to at least seeing if any of the blowhards on this site actually have any pics to show or are they people who would really like to be climbers but really are'nt climbers. For example my wife's sister has a boyfriend who was all gung ho about going climbing with us at Cantabaco. I explained to him that he would be safe since we have all the safety gear, know what were doing, grade I climbing area, and on top rope no less (for him). He replied that he wanted to go just to be able to tell people he was a climber also. The next words out of his mouth were "even if we just get photos of you climbing and I'm there looking like I am too nobody will know". I told him that there was no reason for him to have to lie it's not like there are real rules. I told him that the only thing that most climbers care about is that everyone has fun and comes home safe. It doesnt matter how hard you climb or if you make it to the top on your first time. He was full of excuses though --I smoke, I dont think I'll be able to do it, etc etc. I realized that he just really wanted the photos and to be able to lie about it and as such I've never taken him and dont plan to. How many people are posting on this forum who never climb? I dont know but it appears there are lots of wannabes.


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By Old and Busted
From Centennial, CO
Aug 3, 2012
Stabby

What was the funny post that got deleted?


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

thats true people are posers. oh I climb, 15 years now since i graduated from nursing school and could afford to buy things and had the time to climb, it started as a weekend warrior mostly because it was such a challenge for me with my hip and all. I love that, to me the constant challenge is the essence of climbing that attracts me to it. Well if your brother in law can find his identity in something I hope he does it for himself not just to show to other people and to be cool.


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By Eric Coffman
Aug 3, 2012
mountainlion

Delta Bravo I think the funny post in question was Matt Davies reply to the Trix predictament regarding his girlfriend taking his gear. It was truly hilarious. I only wanted to see the number of people who actually took the challenge NURdreams laid out. She would post her photos of who she was leading more than 5.10 by the way her daughter is the 17 year old leading less than a year who throws down 5.9 I do happen to know them both. So like they say in "one flew over the cucoo's nest" --"today is a new day and I believe they have a new ballgame today..." feel free to post away your best pics if you want to answer the call of the wild...I already said you woud be postin your own adventure porn Jake Jones it doesnt have to be for this challenge but this aint the brotherhood of the traveling stopper--you do have to climb to call yourself a climber.


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

Jake Jones wrote:
I think it was a post daring people that deem themselves anti-chuffers to post pics of them really climbing .10 and above and anyone that didn't is a poser. The truly hilarious thing about it was that NurDreams's profile, which apparently was a Coffman creation, stated that he leads 5.9 trad. Facepalm.

hey I enjoyed creating Russell and Mr. Zimmerman! ;)nice work too bad it was short lived.


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By NurDreams
Aug 3, 2012
nurdreams

For your info Jake Jones I am 38 years old and pretty hot I might add. I am what most guys would call a "cougar" I hang with all of Eric's crew who are mostly 18-26 year old dirtbag climbing hunks. He taught most of them to climb and he taught my daughter too. I wont post any photos of her but I will post some of myself throwin down the funkness. Lets see the people who post regularly--who have been puttin down Eric and his wife prove they aren't posers...game on


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

NurDreams wrote:
For your info Jake Jones I am 38 years old and pretty hot I might add. I am what most guys would call a "cougar" I hang with all of Eric's crew who are mostly 18-26 year old dirtbag climbing hunks. He taught most of them to climb and he taught my daughter too. I wont post any photos of her but I will post some of myself throwin down the funkness. Lets see the people who post regularly--who have been puttin down Eric and his wife prove they aren't posers...game on

u r a funny girl! are you a nurse? or is it "in your dreamz" thing? and yey for Cougars baby!. do u work? u had your daughter young so u r pretty responsible i say! totally post yur pics girlie!


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By BigJuggsjohnson
Aug 3, 2012
Stones

oh and you have to be 40 to be a Cougar now you are still a Puma :)


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By Morgan Patterson
Administrator
Aug 3, 2012
Stoked...

NurDreams wrote:
I wont post any photos of her but I will post some of myself throwin down the funkness.


I like where this is going...


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