For Gear Heads Only: Which Climbing Hardware Brand

Limey here. Doing a bit of research on climbing hardware in the USA. It would be great if you have the time to give me some feedback on the following gear companies.

I'm interested in metal bits; carabiners - lockers, singles and quickdraws; belay devices, nuts, cams etc

What am I interested in?

Which are the premium brands, budget brands, middle of the market?
Who do you trust the most?
Who don't you trust or avoid?
Who are your favourites?
Does price matter or are you more interested in quality?
What's the pecking order?
Are there some brands that are getting popular; emerging?

Any snippets to full blown opinions. Even product specific. Tank you verdy much. Mick

Obviously Black Diamond are the climbing hardware brand leader in the USA…. and the rest in no particlar order…are (I think)

Mammut
Grivel
CAMP
Metolius
DMM
Omega Pacific,
Petzl
Mad Rock
Edelrid
Wild Country
Climb X
Stubai
Cypher
Austri Alpin
Trango
Fixe
Climb Tech

Happy Spring

Mick

3...2....1....... Go! Haha

This is a tall order, perhaps you'd be better off looking into brands you are interested in? Good luck

Who is the worst (besides Climb X, I assume they've got it locked down)?

the climb X shoes are quite decent ... i own and use em ... better IMO than some shoes 50% more expensive

for nuts DMM all the way ... the offsets especially

;)

If I were to choose one company who does everything well AND sexy, it would be DMM. Biners, nuts, cams, ice tools. Petzl is close second, but they're not in the removable pro business. Otherwise, everything they make is well thought out and well made: sport climbing hardware, ice climbing, big wall, caving, rescue.

BD is more of a mass market titan in my eyes, makes things well but not too elegant, except for the cams and ice screws, nothing in their product line makes you lust for it.

C.A.M.P., Trango, Metolius are more of niche manufacturers (offer unique very specialized gear), but at the same time offer regular products for budget-concious (biners for example). WC makes very nice biners too. The only people I've seen in the US using Grivel biners are Steve House and his Alpine mentors trainees, I've never even seen them in stores, so never played with them. Carabiners are funny - so simple in design, but so easy to screw up (like breakfast eggs).

Black Diamond for medium and larger cams, DMM for nuts (especially the offsets as mentioned above), Fixe/Totem for smaller cams, Petzl for harnesses/belay devices.

But that of course is all just my opinion!

bearbreeder wrote:the climb X shoes are quite decent ... i own and use em ... better IMO than some shoes 50% more expensive for nuts DMM all the way ... the offsets especially ;)

Yea, that is because its not their design. It's not hard to make carbon copies of existing products.

ClimbX shouldent even be on the list. I would rater buy from Gearforrocks.com.

20 kN wrote: Yea, that is because its not their design. It's not hard to make carbon copies of existing products. ClimbX shouldent even be on the list. I would rater buy from Gearforrocks.com.

the history of climbing is littered with copies ...

ever wondered why almost all dual stemmed cams look the same?







i expect a gear review of you whipping on a gear for rocks cam in the near future !!!

;)

Grivel should be much lower in that list with Petzl placed higher.

Stubai shouldn't even be on the list. You'd be lucky to find there stuff anywhere.

John Wilder wrote: true, but Climb X literally took old Mad Rock inventory and stitched over their logo with their own for their first production runs. While the brands have separated and have their own designs, the way it happened with the players involved was truly disgusting. I'm stunned any retailers will carry Climb X after the way they started.

its murica ... folks will buy anything

personally i LIKE climbx shoes ...

theres definitely a market for em ... folks buy em for budget shoes and cute gurls use em if nothing else



i suspect the history of climbing gear is littered with egos, copies and bad will ....

now if these major shoe companies priced their shoes more reasonably ... the new guide tennies for example are now 150$ up from 120$ at mec, and they switched the production to china ...

spending 160-180$ for a pair of solutions, miuras, TC pros, boostics to climb fairly moderate grades, especially in the gym ... thats the new climbing

;)

kevin deweese wrote:Grivel should be much lower in that list with Petzl placed higher.

First of all, the OP said it's not in any particular order. Secondly, Grivel's hot drop forging technology makes the best metal hardware out there (I'm just not very familiar with their rock climbing equipment). Family-owned, solar-powered, innovative, high quality - if the three words: "Made In Italy" don't mean anything to you. Maserati of climbing equipment.

Black Diamond and Petzl are tied for #1.

CAMP, Trango, DMM, Wild Country, and Metolius are tied for #2.

Cams: Large sizes (hand size and larger) - BD, DMM, Wild Country
Small-med sizes - Alien, Metolius, BD, Totem (no particular order--really depends on the rock type and your application--aid vs. free) Wild Country Friends are good too. With small sizes I wouldn't touch a Trango with a 10-foot pole--the heads on those things are way too wide compared to these other brands. Totem has some unique and useful-looking stuff, though I think they're very backordered at the moment.

Nuts: DMM. Wallnuts, Peenuts, Offsets. These are hands-down the best.

'Biners: CAMP is the champ of small+light (the NANO), but I've never used them. I really like the Wild Country Heliums or the DMM equivalent. Them Brits make good 'biners. Most other brands have some pretty rockin' models too--really comes down to how much you wanna shell out. I currently have a bunch of BD OZ Hoodwires--very happy with them.

Belay Devices: If you're getting a tubular device, go for a BD ATC Guide or a Petzl Reverso. Costs a few more bucks, but the added auto-blocking for bringing up a second on multi-pitch is priceless. I prefer the ATC Guide for the way it sits on the masterpoint (a Reverso in guide mode will sit sideways while an ATC Guide sits oriented straight out from the wall). Otherwise, many swear by the Gri Gri, though that's over twice the price. The Mammut Smart Alpine belay device is pretty good too, though setting it up for auto-blocking to bring up a second isn't 100% intuitive.

Slings: BD and Mammut make the smallest slings that I'm aware of--but they're dyneema. If you want nylon (and you should probably have a mix of each, depending on your application), I'm sure any brand will do.

My personal impressions:

I would say that Black Diamond is the standard that everything else is compared with here in the US. They aren't necessarily the best at everything, but they have a very broad line, and pretty much everything they sell is very good. They have a history of innovation (Chouinard pretty much invented clean climbing, and more recently they were some of the first to successfully market carbon fiber ice tools, dual axle units, first truly modern ice screws, etc.) They are the market leader and the reference brand in the U.S.

I'd place DMM as the #1 in terms of quality. They aren't necessarily the most innovative, but whatever they make is extremely well made. Just handling any of their gear, you can tell that the quality control is world class. Their passive pro and carabiners are world class. You get the feeling that they don't have regular employees, but rather craftsmen that make their stuff.

Camp/Cassin are about ice and alpine with an emphasis on technical ice and lightweight alpine kit.

Metolius has good cams.

Petzl/Charlet is one of the most innovative companies. Curved shaft ice tools, leashless tools, Gri Gri, Reverso, etc. They seem to have some very creative R&D folks there.

Omega Pacific is solid gear that can often be purchased cheap. Good middle of the road stuff for people on a budget.

Stubai is traditional snow and ice gear. Back in the 1980's and 1990's, they were more cutting edge. These days they are nothing special.

Trango seems like a company without anything to set them apart. Their B52 was a good belay device when it was introduced, but it's been a while since I've seen anything from Trango that impressed me.

Fixe: Best fixed gear. I'm always happy when I see that the bolt anchor is Fixe gear. If I were bolting something, I'd use Fixe gear.

Edelrid: A traditional, solid brand that historically hasn't been cutting edge, but lately they've been upping their game significantly. Their new rope lines, Jul belay devices, and harnesses are state of the art.

Mammut: The Euro Behemoth. Everything they make is first class. Ropes are world class. Headlamps are also best in the market. Clothing and packs can be heavy and somewhat over-engineered, but a good choice if durability is a concern. They are similar to Black Diamond in that they are one of the companies that has a wide array of products and just about everything they make is a reference that others are compared to.

Grivel is ice tools and crampons. Quality stuff forged by Italian elves in hidden mountain valleys. I'm pretty sure that Narsil, Glamdring and Orcrist were forged by Grivel smiths. Steve House uses their gear, so it must be good. (Although he could probably climb M6 with a pair of ice cream scoops for ice tools.) Their ice screws are some of the best.

John Wilder wrote: true, but Climb X literally took old Mad Rock inventory and stitched over their logo with their own for their first production runs. While the brands have separated and have their own designs, the way it happened with the players involved was truly disgusting. I'm stunned any retailers will carry Climb X after the way they started.

Exactly.

ClimbX did not improve on Mad Rock's design, they made an exact copy of their entire product line. Any moron can make a copy of another design, especially when that moron has the exact machining equipment used to make the original design. That takes absolutely no innovation.

You´ve left a few out though perhaps they aren´t well represented in the USA.

Salewa (who own Wild Country anyway)
Climbing Technology
Kong
Singing Rock
Rock Empire
.....

20 kN wrote: Exactly. ClimbX did not improve on Mad Rock's design, they made an exact copy of their entire product line. Any moron can make a copy of another design, especially when that moron has the exact machining equipment used to make the original design. That takes absolutely no innovation.

people that steal and support thieves suck is what it boils down to.

The best companies are the ones that have climbers working for them, not just the designers but the people making the equipment. I personally dont like the idea of my thank-u-god piece after a long runout being made by some guy in China who makes 2 dollars a day.

MJMobes wrote:The best companies are the ones that have climbers working for them, not just the designers but the people making the equipment. I personally dont like the idea of my thank-u-god piece after a long runout being made by some guy in China who makes 2 dollars a day.

guess you dont use camalots then

what cams and nuts ... and harnesses and slings DO you use???

;)

Kai Larson wrote: Trango seems like a company without anything to set them apart. Their B52 was a good belay device when it was introduced, but it's been a while since I've seen anything from Trango that impressed me.

I disagree - they have many unique products like Big Bros, ballnutz, cinch for example. Their ice tools are pretty nice and inexpensive too. I always had an impression that they were more of a distribution company for small innovative cottage industry folks. I'm not sure if they even have their own in-house R&D and manufacturing.

There also should be SMC and Rock Exotica on the list.

That DMM factory production video from last year was pretty awesome. true quality products