Fire and Ice  

This route just got a whole heck of a lot harder this weekend. I ripped off the only good hold between the last bolt and the anchor. The move now is going to be a desperate high step mantle with jack for hand holds. And not to mention that you will be standing a nice little bit above the last bolt. While this was already a technical and excellent slab route, it is now way harder (the crux will be getting to the anchors) and with a little more sketch to it.

If it used to be 11d (definite sandbag), it is now probably around mid 12.

Before and after the broken hold, this route is an amazing piece of slab climbing.

Three stars...but
My 2 cents is: despite a high quality sport route, the grade is 100% wrong. A 5.11 Eldo or sport climber should not get on this thinking it will be a good time.
I climb mid-12 sport, mid-11 Eldo gear, V6 bouldering; there were moves I just couldn't pull.
Normally I would pass this off as stylistic and personal differences, however my friend Tony (who climbs 13c Rifle, and on-sights mid to upper 12) took two days of projecting F&I. Jeff Cloud thought it was 12c, before the flake pulled, and Pat Adams himself thought it was pretty ridiculous in hindsight when I asked him about it.
Just a thought, but when the first acentionist thinks it's probably wrong, it might be time to modernize the rating. Traditionalism or not.

I agree that a 5.11 climber would have his or her hands full on this route, although 12c is way off. I onsighted this route pretty easily, in 1990, right after taking three tries to stick the crux of Downpressor Man. There was no stopper move on the route - just sustained and relatively thin climbing most of the way.

In my opinion, the last section above the 3rd bolt (high-step w/ funny pinch hold) and where the flake got ripped off is not any harder than before.... For me being 6', 12a has always seemed a reasonable grade for this route, but it is height-dependent, so.... The route is relatively easy to read and no moves are as hard as the crux of Downpressor Man (12a). Oh yeah, it is tenuous and hairy getting to the anchor, for sure (always has been)!

In response to a comment above...What does it mean to "modernize the rating" anyways??? Ratings are ratings...This route, like many hard routes all over the world, was first freed in EB's (or worse!). No sticky rubber or sensitivity and a blunt toe and using inferior bolts as protection!!!! Modernize? If anything, many ratings should be lowered due to technology!!!

Anyways...Ratings don't mean shit!

Now Alex, ratings do mean shit. That's why your profile is full of them. And I also think that Fire and Ice is weirdly stiff since the hold broke. Hope all is well, crazyman!

You are absolutely correct Hank, ratings do mean shit. Thanks for calling me out! When am I going to see you out in the canyon? Let's do something crazy, soon!

Found a video of this route:

Fun little route, the epitome of an Eldo climb that either feels easy or impossible. If you enjoy this style of climbing, definitely check out "Book of Numbers", P1 of BoN is about the same grade as F&I.