Figure 8 device: thoughts?
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I picked on of the BD figure 8 devices up a few months ago because it was on sale and I was curious. I finally tried it this evening and I actually quite like how it feels for rappelling. |
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I quit using one when ropes got skinny; there wasn't as much friction as I'd like. And I had a "tube style" device which worked better for belaying anyway, so why carry two rap devices? |
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I didn't even think about the extra friction I'd get on a thicker rope. I tested it on a chunk of 8.4mm. |
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I have seen them twist the rope after lowering or rappel. |
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They twist the @#%# out of the rope. |
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I use one quite a lot running canyons. I have no really complaints. I have not noticed that they twist the rope more than any other descender as Will and IE have noted. |
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Makes a great paperweight. |
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I use them a ton for rappelling. I do a lot of slot canyons in southern utah, and when your rope gets sandy it wears groves in gear really fast(Worst canyon i ever did i wore out an 8 in a day) so the fact that it only wears on the 8 instead of the ATC and carabiner is nice. I also think that they flow smother then the ATC. Then because when canyoneering i often take people new to rope work i find the device is much easier to learn then the ATC(i don't really understand why, but they pick it up faster). The 8 also has a super easy lock off method. Then you can use the small loop as an atc as mentioned. |
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For normal climbing theres no real use for em as others have mentioned |
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In situations where you are wearing two sets of gloves and really don't want to take them off, e.g. above 7000m, they are used as they are much easier to get a frozen fixed line into than into a belay plate. |
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Thanks for the replies. |
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I use one for short or low angle raps in canyons. They're also nice for wet disconnects or flowing water canyons. |
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Pretty much agree with everyone else, figure-8 is good for rappelling, not so good for climbing. However, there is one advantage of a figure-8 device over a tubular device that no one else has mentioned yet: it may be easier to pass a knot on rappel with a figure-8, i f the knot is small enough to go through the large hole. You can just pass the knot through once you unweight the rope. With a tubular device, you have to take it off the rope in order to pass a knot. But this one small advantage is still not enough to get me to use a figure-8 device. |
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my dad uses one. He started climbing in the late 60's and picks it up once a decade. as far as I can tell he's the only one left that bothers with one. |
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Great with mittens. |
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jacob m s wrote:As for a belay device for climbing, they can be used, but i remember looking at Petzl's instructions and they had alot more factors to be aware of compared to the ATC, especially for the lead belay. Another thought is the 8 does not have nearly as much breaking power as the ATC so if you caught a lead fall it will always be a soft catch compared to the ATC,...A trick us old-schoolers did bitd was to use the small hole as an ATC device. Not unlike the use of a single link of chain, which was used prior to the availability of the Stitch Plate in this country, which was prior to the Tuber, a.k.a. the original ATC. Somewhere in a box in the basement resides all this stuff from the 70's. |
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Ok for short drops in caves on muddy ropes, where you do not want the weight of a rack. Mostly replaced by Petzl Stop and such. |
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Will S wrote:Advantage: more metal to dissipate heat, but not enough to work for really long raps like cavers sometimes do (that's why high rise window washers, cavers, etc run brake-bars, not 8s or tube style like ATC, otherwise they'd constantly burn themselves and/or glaze the rope sheath).On my understanding this is not really correct. In my experience fig-8 don't run cooler than tube style devices. On a fig-8 most of the friction is metal on rope. On a tube device a large proportion if no the majority is internal rope friction due to tight radius bends. Thus less heat is transferred to the rope. High rise window washes and cavers use brake bars because of friction adjustability, nothing to do with heat. That said, I haven't seen thorough tests. Some stuff here but nothing useful about fig-8s. Maybe Jim Titt can add some thoughts... |
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Could be, Patto. |
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Marc801 wrote: A trick us old-schoolers did bitd was to use the small hole as an ATC device. Not unlike the use of a single link of chain, which was used prior to the availability of the Stitch Plate in this country, which was prior to the Tuber, a.k.a. the original ATC. Somewhere in a box in the basement resides all this stuff from the 70's.Yes and still has application for frozen fat ropes |
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patto wrote: O....High rise window washes and cavers use brake bars because of friction adjustability, nothing to do with heat. That said, I haven't seen thorough tests. Some stuff here but nothing useful about fig-8s. Maybe Jim Titt can add some thoughts...In addition to friction adjustment, you can use Stainless break bars, which do not wear out on muddy ropes. I really muddy rope will wear through an aluminum brake bar quickly. |