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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Jan 1, 2014
Thumbtastic

When we who are in the know bitch and moan rather then mentor and teach, we throw in the towel on the solution. We can change the future by having input with the next generations.

Anyone think of that?


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By 5.samadhi
Jan 2, 2014
me

VaGenius wrote:
When we who are in the know bitch and moan rather then mentor and teach, we throw in the towel on the solution. We can change the future by having input with the next generations. Anyone think of that?

uhhh...yes??? What planet are you on???


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By TomCaldwell
From Clemson, S.C.
Jan 2, 2014
Me on One Pitch Wonder at Whitesides.  Photo credits to Kyle Jones and his lucky anti-rain jacket.

VaGenius wrote:
When we who are in the know bitch and moan rather then mentor and teach, we throw in the towel on the solution. We can change the future by having input with the next generations. Anyone think of that?


I agree. There is a lesson to be learned/taught by erasing the route in discussion. The nice thing from my stand point about this influx of climbers is that they aren't jumping into trad (with a few exceptions). The climbers that need to worry are the boulders and sport climbers since they are the closest to entry level as possible. This is another reason why NC locals want to keep things the way they are. Call it exclusive, elitist, or whatever, but really all we are saying is just that you have to put some effort into it. We aren't saying that "you" can't climb here, just learn the skills and these routes that seem so far fetched will one day become a reality. I definitely got bent out of shape the first time I climbed Yardarm at Stone when I was new to trad, but now it seems so far away even though it was only ~6 years ago.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Jan 2, 2014
Thumbtastic

Hey Tom, random question-did you climb in tuolomne this year?

Oh, and 5.samadhi, fail. Thank you for playing. Or not.


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By TomCaldwell
From Clemson, S.C.
Jan 3, 2014
Me on One Pitch Wonder at Whitesides.  Photo credits to Kyle Jones and his lucky anti-rain jacket.

VaGenius wrote:
Hey Tom, random question-did you climb in tuolomne this year? Oh, and 5.samadhi, fail. Thank you for playing. Or not.


Never climbed in Yosemite. I hate crowds. I know I should one day, but I would rather hit more remote areas first. Why?


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 3, 2014
modern man

TomCaldwell wrote:
Never climbed in Yosemite. I hate crowds. I know I should one day, but I would rather hit more remote areas first. Why?


yeahhhhhhh, hate to break it to you Tom but your perception of the crowded west is dead wrong. you should try it someday, unwrap yourself from the NC ethics thing. Maybe Killis can give you a tour and you two can bitch about how all the rock has been ruined by unethical sportos and people who rap in to bolt.

better yet a slide show tour around the country educating climbers even younger than you two are on how things should be(from the perspective of BITD)


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By TomCaldwell
From Clemson, S.C.
Jan 3, 2014
Me on One Pitch Wonder at Whitesides.  Photo credits to Kyle Jones and his lucky anti-rain jacket.

MJMobes wrote:
yeahhhhhhh, hate to break it to you Tom but your perception of the crowded west is dead wrong. you should try it someday, unwrap yourself from the NC ethics thing. Maybe Killis can give you a tour and you two can bitch about how all the rock has been ruined by unethical sportos and people who rap in to bolt. better yet a slide show tour around the country educating climbers even younger than you two are on how things should be(from the perspective of BITD)


I do go out west. Look at my profile before you make assumptions about where I have been. I've been to JTree, Tahquitz, and Red Rocks a bunch of times. Mainly because my brothers live in San Diego, so it is convenient. All of those places are quite busy. I have just heard too many stories about tourists and congo lines in Yosemite. Or people being turned away from camping. I am not against Yosemite, logistically it is more difficult for me and like I said I don't enjoy crowds. It wasn't a knock on the place, but merely a factual statement. It is crowded, why have they been talking about permit systems there... I am all for sport climbing and rap-bolting at cliff's where this is the norm or acceptable. It is not acceptable in most cases in NC, merely because history dictates that, not because I say so. If you knew anything about me you'd know that I am more of a moderate on the subject. But keep taking your uneducated jabs at me.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Jan 12, 2014
Thumbtastic

I love how positive some people keep it. Look forward to bitching with ya sometime, Tom.


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Jan 13, 2014
modern man

I've never waited in a line or dealt with crowds while cragging at Jtree or Red rocks or Yosemite. I dont like crowds either so I suspect you may like to talk about things without a strong knowledge to back up your claims which I find to be somewhat relevant in all of your ethics postings. We all like to spray though, right Killis?


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By TomCaldwell
From Clemson, S.C.
Jan 13, 2014
Me on One Pitch Wonder at Whitesides.  Photo credits to Kyle Jones and his lucky anti-rain jacket.

MJMobes wrote:
I've never waited in a line or dealt with crowds while cragging at Jtree or Red rocks or Yosemite. I dont like crowds either so I suspect you may like to talk about things without a strong knowledge to back up your claims which I find to be somewhat relevant in all of your ethics postings. We all like to spray though, right Killis?


So tourists aren't a problem in the valley? Ever try to get on a trade rotue in RR, say Birdland, CC, DOWT, Solar Slab? How about any moderate in HVC? Maybe your just lucky or maybe your denial of such claims is your self serving bias. I like how you don't refute that Yosemite has been contemplating a permit system. Just think about how long someone has to reserve a camp site in advance to know that it is a crowded place. Don't forget, me saying that Yosemite is crowded is my opinion. My tolerance for people is most likely different than yours. It doesn't mean I am wrong, just that we have a difference of opinions. I have had way too many close calls on trade routes in RR with people dropping things above me or just poor consideration of others.

What have I talked about without a strong knowledge to back up my claims, especially in regards to local history/tradition? My post history is listed. I'd be glad to back any of it up with facts. I typically keep don't speak in regards to things that I don't have personal experience or knowledge of some part of the history. Just like you should when it comes to tradition and history in NC. So why is it that you are posting in a thread regarding NC history/ethics when you have never climbed here. Considering your last post, you sound like a hypocrite.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Jan 18, 2014
Thumbtastic

Nice post, Tom. Btw was asking because I met some Carolina boys on a wall in Tuolomne and some of the things you said sounded familiar. Thought we might've shared some wall space a while back.

Mobes is a confirmed hater, seems to have no real function on here but tearing down. As such, mildly annoying, but you gotta give him credit for out posting JLP and being more legible than Hellenor. I think he's my nomination for Current Saddest MP Troll if we're holding the awards show as per usual this year. He'll probably put the prize on the shelf where his self-respect used to sit.


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