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Etiquette when finding booty?
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By Jim O'Brien
From Branford, CT
Nov 21, 2008
My new avi

If you find gear on a route, it's booty, not someone else's crap that you need to return for them. My philosophy when climbing is that the gear must be bomber but removable. It's my own fault if I can't properly place the gear to be removed by my second. Bail gear is just that- you're bailing, too bad. Find a way to get it back, rap down, ask a better climber to go get it for you (been there) or just thank the gear gods you are on the ground safely and replace what you left behind.
BTW, if you lost a .75 camalot or a reverso(ground score) on el cap in september, thanks!


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By Andy Novak
From Golden, Co
Nov 21, 2008
Living the High Life.

jimo wrote:
BTW, if you lost a .75 camalot or a reverso(ground score) on el cap in september, thanks!


Just curious, but does this mean you found them on the ground at the base of the route? If so, how do you know it wasn't dropped from the headwall 800 meters up? I dropped a biner from only 50 feet last sunday and retired it.


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By Eric D
From Gnarnia
Nov 21, 2008
Born again on the last move of the Red Dihedral, high Sierras.

Booty comes and goes in a cycle. You leave some, you get some and it all probably evens out in the end. I've probably left the same amount of stuff for other people to have as I have collected. I once found a .75 left lying on a ledge. Not in a crack or anything, just sitting there. BOOTY!


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By tom selleck
Nov 21, 2008

I employ the "don't ask don't tell" philosophy.


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By AJS
From Boulder, CO
Nov 22, 2008
In the sea of Cortez - Baja California, Mexico

Danno wrote:
I employ the "don't ask don't tell" philosophy.


I'm the opposite. I brag to all my friends that I bootied a sweet, full rack but in reality all I got was a stuck nut.

...but as far as climbing gear goes that's another story

:-)

/somebody had to go there


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By Sam Lightner, Jr.
From Lander, WY
Nov 22, 2008
The Shield

AJS... I hit that one on page one. No body said nothin' to my chagrin


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By AJS
From Boulder, CO
Nov 22, 2008
In the sea of Cortez - Baja California, Mexico

Ahhh, so you did - nice one!...must be a highbrow crowd here - they probably don't appreciate the finer points of tawdry humor :-)

-Adam


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By Ben C
From Portland, OR
Oct 18, 2009
just before the crux

is it still booty if you left it and then come back to retrieve it?


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By broppler
From Oakland
Oct 19, 2009
dinner ledge

If you attempt to give it back, its not booty


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By JPVallone
Oct 19, 2009

What goes around comes around, The longer you climb the more you will leave behind and the more you will find. It seems to all even out in the end.

I think its trash and you are picking it up and keeping the climb in it's proper state by removing it and giving it a good new home. I would never expect anything back if I leave it in the mountains, If I leave gear, well that was the price of admission that day, At least I got home, could of been worse.

There is an art to leaving a solid but inexpensive anchor if its a bail situation, but if its just a stuck piece then it costs the price of the piece. Ce La Vie

New Question though:

If you and your buddy are climbing together and your on lead and find a nice cam that was on the route you cant clean it or you clip it instead and your second cleans the nice shiny cam, Who gets it, the guy who cleaned it or the guy who led the pitch?

Or in the OP's case who has to find and return the piece to the owner, the leader or the second who cleaned it?


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By Rafe
Oct 19, 2009
hardman

Yarr! Plunder the booty ye swashbuckler!


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By lee hansche
Administrator
From goffstown, nh
Oct 21, 2009
getting to the last jug before the top out

JPVallone wrote:
If you and your buddy are climbing together and your on lead and find a nice cam that was on the route you cant clean it or you clip it instead and your second cleans the nice shiny cam, Who gets it, the guy who cleaned it or the guy who led the pitch?


IMO It is best form to collect booty free on the lead, haha... if i want the booty but want to clip it, i remove it and yell to my belayer that it is mine then put it back and clip it...


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By Buff Johnson
Oct 21, 2009
smiley face

Rafe wrote:
Yarr! Plunder the booty ye swashbuckler!


I keep yelling this every time I ramble into a Bronco cheerleader party; but it just never works, wtf?

maybe they are just not climbers, they always seem to freak out when I show them my cordalette

I try to explain about proper etiquette and anchor rigging when finding booty, I try, I really do


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By JPVallone
Oct 21, 2009

lee hansche wrote:
IMO It is best form to collect booty free on the lead, haha... if i want the booty but want to clip it, i remove it and yell to my belayer that it is mine then put it back and clip it...



Nice!!!


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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Oct 21, 2009
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Peak.

The trigger wire of the Trango cam I found at Turret Dome in Elevenmile years ago broke completely as I was trying to place it while climbing "The Martyr" earlier in the week.

So, do I have to pay for the trigger replacement myself or can I get that from the previous owner? I never did find the owner.


I actually think it's nice that people worry about booty being stealing, or unsportsmanlike, or uncool, etc. I'm fine laying out what rules I go by and let them decide for themselves. This common thread is certainly more welcome than...


I was going to say pro/anti dog threads, but I get a huge laugh out of those. Ha ha ha. OK, I hate shoe threads the most I think. Absolutely no controversy or potential for entertainment.


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By ShibbyShane
From Estes Park, CO
Oct 21, 2009
Dappled Mare

lee hansche wrote:
IMO It is best form to collect booty free on the lead, haha... if i want the booty but want to clip it, i remove it and yell to my belayer that it is mine then put it back and clip it...


Wish I would have known this earlier. I was climbing with a friend who already had a full rack, but I was leading. Came across a fixed but nice shiny #1 C4, and yelled down that I was clipping it. So he follows me up and gets it out (breaking all the trigger wires in the process) and keeps it. I was bummed b/c I didn't have any of my own gear, but I guess he did all the work... Oh well.


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By Mark Hammond
From Eldorado Springs, CO
Oct 21, 2009

I'm with Lee on the cleaning booty on the lead thing. Sometimes I get conflicted over whether to risk blowing the onsight by fiddling with stuck booty if I'm on a route I care about. Often these days, I'll leave the booty for my 2nd unless it is easy to pluck.


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By Mark Hammond
From Eldorado Springs, CO
Oct 21, 2009

But back to the original question. I've returned booty, attempted unsuccessfully to find the owner, offered to clean for the party ahead of me on the route, greedily grabbed without considering the (past) owner, and once even face to face refused to give it back because of the attitude and inconsiderate actions of the cam loser.
Context matters.
Once I even rescued a fallen noob leader, (who had managed to live through no fault of his own,) retrieved most of his brand new rack, then regretted handing it to him because his clueless, false-front macho bravado in front of his 13yo son belayer pissed me off so bad. I nearly decked him for being an ass.


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By lee hansche
Administrator
From goffstown, nh
Oct 28, 2009
getting to the last jug before the top out

I love booty... Every time i find a piece i fall in love...

I work hard not to leave gear behind because once i do i consider it gone for ever.. i assume that what i find on a climb was left the same way, they said their good byes, the gear is dead to them...


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By Malcolm Daly
From Boulder, CO
Oct 28, 2009

I'm surprised this is a question. Do with booty you found just as you wish people who found your booty would do with yours.

Do you best to find the owner. If you can't find them, enjoy the good karma that came with your found booty and climb safe.

Mal


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By Darren Mabe
From Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 29, 2009
wham bam hand jam. Wrapping up the final moves of Twist of Fate, Oak Creek Canyon. <br /> <br />photo: Blake McCord

Malcolm Daly wrote:
Do with booty you found just as you wish people who found your booty would do with yours. Mal

unfortunately i dont think the Golden Rule applies anymore these days...


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By Marc H
From Lafayette, CO
Oct 29, 2009
The Cathedral Spires in RMNP, left to right: Stiletto, Sharkstooth, Forbidden Tower, Petit Grepon, The Saber, The Foil, The Moon & The Jackknife.

Just like "there's no crying in baseball," there's similarly no etiquette in rocklimbing!

--Marc


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By matthewWallace
From plymouth, nh
Oct 29, 2009
Cool movement on this line

anything i find i try to return if nobody claims it, cool you got free gear if someone does then cool you can return it, and feel good about yourself.


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By Timmamok
From Durango, CO
Oct 29, 2009
crack at undisclosed location - my little proj

Easy come, easy go.


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By Adam Block
From Tucson, AZ
Nov 17, 2009

Sam Lightner, Jr. wrote:
This damn thread comes up about once every two months... and that is silly for a couple reasons: 1. Can't we look back at the last time someone (an administrator) posed it? 2. Do we need a consensus on whether or not we should be nice to our fellow climber? Be kind. Lets move on.


This forum has one of the worst search functions I've ever seen. That is of course unless I'm missing where I can search titles only and so on. I would guess this causes many many re-posts.

As for the OP, if I leave something, I don't expect to get it back though like another poster said I'd be happy if I did. If I found something that seemed to be worth more than $20 or so I'd put a post up, I'd base my efforts to return in on value, Under $20 I'd just toss it into the mix and put it toward the cause, $20 to $100 I'd put up a post, wait a month and if nothing came of it I'd call it mine. Over $100 and I'd put up a post, get the word out to local climbers, tape up a sign where I found it if I could and wait a couple months before I called it mine.

Guess we all gotta do what we feel is right and moral.


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