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equalizing webbing, and water knots
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By mike526
From schaumburg
Jun 20, 2011

You may have seen my post webbing vs. cord awhile back. I recently took a class on anchors up at Devils lake to go over things and learn some new tricks. Everyone i climb with uses webbing, however during this class it wes mentioned quickly and kind of laughed at and called old school. Using cord and protection and pulling down the loops makes sense to me easy to equalize and straightforward. I own webbing and have been shown numerous times how to go about setting up anchors with it and for the life of me it just doesnt click. I can never get the water knots equalized correctly, i find it takes for ever, and just a pain in the ass.

As much as i have trouble using webbing i was wondering if there is some sort of trick or method you have found works well for getting your loops equalized with waterknots that makes sense.

Thanks
Mike who thinks cord is so much easier, but would like to know how to do it with webbing also.


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By ROC
From Englewood, CO
Jun 20, 2011

You can essentially use it the same way you use a cord.


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By StuckNut
Jun 20, 2011

Tie the webbing into one large loop with a water knot and use it the same way you would a cordalette.


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By thecornyman
From Oakland, CA
Jun 20, 2011
mike

Ever since I started using Mammut Dyneema Cordelette I never looked back:
www.rei.com/product/751490/mammut-dyneema-cordelette-contact>>>


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By mike526
From schaumburg
Jun 21, 2011

Alright awesome about using webbing to make a webolette. However I notice at the lake people will make 3 individual loops of webbing bring them all together to make a master point. This Is the method that i find very time consuming and confusing, Should i bother to learn it this way since everyone else at the lake does it this way, or do what i'm comfortable with and say the hell with what everyone else does there.

Cant see harm in knowing both ways however even if the one makes no sense to me at the moment.


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By Andrew Shoemaker
From Garden Valley, ID
Jun 21, 2011
Me on Mt. Evans

mike526 wrote:
Alright awesome about using webbing to make a webolette. However I notice at the lake people will make 3 individual loops of webbing bring them all together to make a master point. This Is the method that i find very time consuming and confusing, Should i bother to learn it this way since everyone else at the lake does it this way, or do what i'm comfortable with and say the hell with what everyone else does there. Cant see harm in knowing both ways however even if the one makes no sense to me at the moment.


I think that if you find use the webbing like "everyone else" to be this confusing and you already have a method that works and that you are comfortable with then why change? To hell with those others. To each his own right? Stick with what you know and what works for you.


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By Matt N
From Santa Barbara, CA
Jun 21, 2011
OTL

mike526 wrote:
Alright awesome about using webbing to make a webolette. However I notice at the lake people will make 3 individual loops of webbing bring them all together to make a master point.


This uses 3 water knots, which need to be inspected before use to ensure proper tails each time. One loop, one water knot. And with a knotted master point, the water knot is isolated to only one arm. Sounds like a better system to me.


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By SlowTrad
From St Paul, MN
Jun 21, 2011

I climb at DL quite a bit, and what I think the poster is talking about is making top-rope anchors from pieces of independent webbing, which is normal for here. Pro is often very widely spaced, or trees that are back from the edge by 20-30 ft, or slung boulders.

1) Tie a bight into end of webbing and attach biners for rope to run through, adjust to where you want the anchor point to be.
2)Run other end of webbing to pro, tie to biner on pro (clove, overhand etc)
3)Repeat to other pieces of pro or trees
4) Water knot used to join two pieces of webbing to make it long enough to reach trees.

There are precious few climbs where a cordetlette would work.

Cord can be used in lieu of webbing, but it doesn't pack down as nice as webbing IMO.


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By sunder
From Alsip, Il
Jun 21, 2011
ICE PIT 2011

Here is what i use at Devils Lake for TR Setups.

I Carry 30' and 40' of webbing and a 50' length of 8mm Cordellete.

The setup is like the following.

Set the anchors
Extend the anchors with webbing if needed, just close to the edge.
Then use I cordelette to equalize.

1. I use the cordelte as a single stand. Tieing a Figure 8 in the end and clip it to one of the peices on the end.
2. Then i clip the cord though all the pieces.
3. Take you TR Biener and clip the cord bettween you anchors and pull it to equalize about 1' farther down then where you want your master point.
4. Go back tie a figure 8 knot in the end of the cordelette and clip it to the last piece.
5. Equalize it and tie a figure 8 to create you mater point
6. Check everything is locked, tied off and ready to go.



Example from Sunday's climb where you anchor points are about 10-15' away. Up a DL on Doorway Major Mass.

TR Setup
TR Setup


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By mike526
From schaumburg
Jun 21, 2011

I dont know i think i get what your saying. I know when i took the class all we used was cord but not once did the guide even go over webbing. actually he laughed at all the people at devils lake who use it and said he finds it a pain the ass and unneccessary. I feel like i have taken two anchor courses and i get how to do it with cord but as people have mentioned thats not always an option at the lake. feeling rather stupid for not understanding the other ways of building it with webbing.

i almost want to just get 90 feet of cord and be like fuck it but know its not the right way of doing things.


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By Yarp
Jun 21, 2011

mike526 wrote:
i almost want to just get 90 feet of cord and be like fuck it but know its not the right way of doing things.


classic... thanks for the laugh this evening


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By Josh Olson
From madison, wisconsin
Jun 21, 2011
Looking at a 5.7 crack with Nick

mike526 wrote:
i almost want to just get 90 feet of cord and be like fuck it but know its not the right way of doing things.


I wasn't aware that there was a wrong way to set up a toprope. If you wait to set up topropes until you understand everything in this sport, you will never leave the ground.

Edit, I should say wrong yet safe way.


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By Andy Hansen
From Longmont, Colorado
Jun 21, 2011
Intruder, 5.11+. Zion National Park. Photo: Matt Kuehl

I don't think there's a "wrong" way to set up toprope anchors and for that matter there is also not a "safe" or "unsafe" way to set up anchors- unless it's too late to know the difference. I've seen plenty of janky set ups that to me were appalling but at the end of the day those who were climbing on the setups walked away just fine. Safe? Sure. The way I would do it? No.

Seeing as you have a method that works for you, stick with it. I personally don't use webbing unless I'm using it to sling a tree or boulder. I also use big fucking pieces of anchor statics and this is something I don't see a ton of people at the Lake doing but I still do it anyways.

I believe you've discovered the cumbersome qualities of webbing and thus illustrating the predominant reason why I don't use it to equalize anchors.


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By mike526
From schaumburg
Jun 22, 2011

I'm glad i provided a laugh. I guess my main thing is that the system that works for me that I was tuaght, the majority people I climb with don't use. They insist that everything be of webbing and thats its the only way to set a safe anchor at the lake. I've decided i'm going to set my anchors the way i was taught and if I feel something isn't right have no shame in asking a more experienced climber to look things over for me. At the same time if i know my anchor is bomber and they dont like it because i built it with cord well then i guess they dont have to climb on it.


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