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Edelrid Mega Jul
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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Mar 30, 2013
Cleo's Needle

bearbreeder wrote:
i was thinking of buying it, but the two key features is the "near" autolocking of the smart (it really isnt 100% of the time, but its better than nothing) and the ease of the autoblock i want the first due to the possibility of rock fall knocking out the belayer the second because 12-20 pitches of pulling a rope in autoblock, its worth a bit of extra weight to save your arms IMO so this has helped me save some moola ;)


The lock-up inconsistency has been bothering me since I first tried it. I tried six different ropes and was able to replicate the problem with all but twins. I believe the issue is the diameter of the caribiner. I was using a Metolius Element and it would not lock up without a hand on the brake on every rope from 10.5 to 9.0. I switched out the caribiner to a BD Rock-Lock and the issue went away completely. I tried a number of different lockers and the smaller the spine the better. I tried a OP Jake-Lock and it was the opposite, worse. The Jake-Lock would not lock in the Smart either.

Also, the lock up on 8mm twins is flawless on all caribiners but the OP Jake. The larger Alpine Smart, which is not sized for 8mm twins, lets rope slip through without holding the rope. Holding the rope and the Alipne Smart works better with 8mm twins.

The Mega Jul is clearly better for smaller ropes and smaller spine'd caribiners than bigger ropes (the Smart too really). I have a Smart and the Mega Jul, they each have their strengths. For a 20 pitch wall with 10mm-9mm singles I'd pick the Smart. Everything else I'd pick the Mega Jul.

And, as I said before, your hand should be on the brake strand anyway.


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By WillamR
Mar 30, 2013

Just pointing out neither of these devices are made to lock without a hand on the brake end. It seems like one can get lucky and they will at times, though.


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By bearbreeder
Mar 30, 2013

WillamR wrote:
Just pointing out neither of these devices are made to lock without a hand on the brake end. It seems like one can get lucky and they will at times, though.


You should always have a hand on the brake

But reality is that in a rockfall, yr belayer may be konked out

The smart is fairly reliable in locking up ... Nothing is 100% though

Thanks for the review ... I think ill stick with my smart

For multi the smooth as butter autobloc is just too useful ;)


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Mar 30, 2013
Cleo's Needle

WillamR wrote:
Just pointing out neither of these devices are made to lock without a hand on the brake end. It seems like one can get lucky and they will at times, though.


All the "auto" devices on the market are "assisted", welcome to 1995.


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By rgold
From Poughkeepsie, NY
Mar 30, 2013
The traverse out to the Yellow Ridge on the Dogstick Ridge link-up.  Photo by Myriam Bouchard

Ray Pinpillage wrote:
All the "auto" devices on the market are "assisted", welcome to 1995.


Yeah, but in 2013 you're the one writing [emphasis mine] "The lock-up inconsistency has been bothering me since I first tried it. I tried six different ropes and was able to replicate the problem with all but twins...I was using a Metolius Element and it would not lock up without a hand on the brake...I switched out the carabiner...and the issue went away completely.

Something the device isn't intended to do isn't a "problem," an "inconsistency," or an "issue." Those terms can, however, be applied to types of usage that are specifically excluded by the manufacturer, and what your observations illustrate is the manufacturer's warning about the device not being an autolocker are accurate and not just legal boilerplate. Although interesting, some of those observations are potentially dangerous, since you suggest that "the [unassisted] lock up on 8mm twins is flawless on all carabiners but the OP Jake." Let's hope no one actually believes that!

You haven't said anything about the repeatability of any of your observations, including the one about the "flawless" behavior of 8mm twins.

Whether or not an assisted locking device actually locks without a hand on the brake stand(s) probably depends on a host of factors, including the magnitude and orientation of the impact load, the rope type, diameter, and number of ropes, sheath wear, carabiner type, how much rope weight there is on the brake strand side, and who knows what other subtleties. The only thing that is certain is that autolocking isn't certain.

Don't get me wrong---I'm a fan of the assisted locking concept and use such a device myself (Alpine Up).


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Mar 31, 2013
Cleo's Needle

rgold wrote:
Let's hope no one actually believes that!


Let's hope no one actually believes anything they read on the internet. This is a lame gear review on a forum, sorry you took it as anything else. I'll add a warning to the OP.

With that out of the way, I did a 60m overhung rap on 10'something ropes using the locking function without extending and it sucked. The ropes were fat and they hung directly down off the Mega Jul. The tuber side with a prusik would have been easier. The Smart is pretty awful in the same situation.


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By bearbreeder
Mar 31, 2013

Ray Pinpillage wrote:
The tuber side with a prusik would have been easier. The Smart is pretty awful in the same situation.


ive rapped many a time in the same situation with the smart ... and i found it fine ...

what biner/rope combo are you using with the smart?


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Apr 1, 2013
Cleo's Needle

Two supersafes with a rock-lock. Slow and pumpy.


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By bearbreeder
Apr 1, 2013

Ray Pinpillage wrote:
Two supersafes with a rock-lock. Slow and pumpy.


mammuts (ironic) and maxims 10mm+ are bad ropes to use with the smart as they tend to be stiffer, especially when they get fuzzy and older

the rocklock is also a poor choice for the alpine smart ... the petzl william and DMM boa work pretty smoothly for rapping ... many climbers i know had issues with the rocklock or other biners until i got them to switch out to the boa/william

that said i rapped down a maxim glider very quickly over the weekend off a multi ... alot of it has to do with how you hold open the rap device .... there is a certain method ...

the alpine smart is very biner and rope dependent for smooth operation ... but once you find a combo that works, its quite smooth ... the gri gri is still the smoothest device on lead belaying with 10mm gyms ropes for me, but the alpine smart aint that far behind, the ATC guide which ive used for years is less smooth IMO

i think one of the issues about the use of the alpine smart is that many people i know come from an ATC background to it (lets face it if yr a sport weenie whose used a gri gri for a decade, you arent switching) ....

i see people not stacking out the ropes properly, not using a hand to shake out the rope occasionally, and other such habits that you can get away with an ATC ... with a gri gri/smart you need to do these things to insure the rope feeds smoothly ... not just belay from a thrown down mess of ropes ...

the gri gri also has issues wth thick stiff ropes IMO ...

all this is worth it for the smooth as butter autoblock of the smart IMO ... especially if you are taking up 2 cute girls ;)


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By Moritz B.
Apr 1, 2013
Profile Pic

Hi! I would like to chime in on this, too.
Please keep in mind that I work for Edelrid North America. On the one hand you might think Iīm biased, of course, but I can also provide very good first hand info regarding the MegaJul (or any other Edelrid product).
Regarding availability, right now your safest bet is mountaingear.com. They have the device in stock. Other vendors will follow shortly and the MegaJul will be widely available within April.

It also works very well when using it with half-ropes. You donīt need to have your thumb on the loop the entire time to feed out rope. You only use the loop to get the device out of the locked-mode. You can feed in the rope "from-above" (steep angle) without the device locking up. To do so you will need some practice but I do it all the time and it works great for me.

I hope I could clear some things up. Happy climbing!


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Apr 1, 2013
Cleo's Needle

bearbreeder wrote:
mammuts (ironic) and maxims 10mm+ are bad ropes to use with the smart as they tend to be stiffer, especially when they get fuzzy and older the rocklock is also a poor choice for the alpine smart ... the petzl william and DMM boa work pretty smoothly for rapping ... many climbers i know had issues with the rocklock or other biners until i got them to switch out to the boa/william that said i rapped down a maxim glider very quickly over the weekend off a multi ... alot of it has to do with how you hold open the rap device .... there is a certain method ... the alpine smart is very biner and rope dependent for smooth operation ... but once you find a combo that works, its quite smooth ... the gri gri is still the smoothest device on lead belaying with 10mm gyms ropes for me, but the alpine smart aint that far behind, the ATC guide which ive used for years is less smooth IMO i think one of the issues about the use of the alpine smart is that many people i know come from an ATC background to it (lets face it if yr a sport weenie whose used a gri gri for a decade, you arent switching) .... i see people not stacking out the ropes properly, not using a hand to shake out the rope occasionally, and other such habits that you can get away with an ATC ... with a gri gri/smart you need to do these things to insure the rope feeds smoothly ... not just belay from a thrown down mess of ropes ... the gri gri also has issues wth thick stiff ropes IMO ... all this is worth it for the smooth as butter autoblock of the smart IMO ... especially if you are taking up 2 cute girls ;)


You're probably right and I'd bet the same goes for the Mega Jul as well. I think both devices function better with thinner ropes. Maybe I'll buy a william, I was thinking about an Atache 3D for the Mega Jul.


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By Aaron Slaven
From Fresno, CA
Apr 2, 2013
South Crack - Stately Pleasure Dome

Davis Stevenson wrote:
Thanks! My gym is an Edelrid dealer, too... I'll see what kind of timeframe it'll be before they have them here.



www.mountaingear.com/webstore/Gear/Climbing/Belay-descent/Ed>>>


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By Tavis
From ca
Apr 10, 2013

Here is my video review :



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By bearbreeder
Apr 10, 2013

i found that quite hilarious actually !!!


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By Brad M
Apr 11, 2013

"Mamoot" always cracks me up.


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Apr 12, 2013
Cleo's Needle

He said AUTOBLOCK!!11!111!!11!


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Apr 15, 2013
Cleo's Needle

bearbreeder wrote:
mammuts (ironic) and maxims 10mm+ are bad ropes to use with the smart as they tend to be stiffer, especially when they get fuzzy and older the rocklock is also a poor choice for the alpine smart ... the petzl william and DMM boa work pretty smoothly for rapping ... many climbers i know had issues with the rocklock or other biners until i got them to switch out to the boa/william that said i rapped down a maxim glider very quickly over the weekend off a multi ... alot of it has to do with how you hold open the rap device .... there is a certain method ... the alpine smart is very biner and rope dependent for smooth operation ... but once you find a combo that works, its quite smooth ... the gri gri is still the smoothest device on lead belaying with 10mm gyms ropes for me, but the alpine smart aint that far behind, the ATC guide which ive used for years is less smooth IMO i think one of the issues about the use of the alpine smart is that many people i know come from an ATC background to it (lets face it if yr a sport weenie whose used a gri gri for a decade, you arent switching) .... i see people not stacking out the ropes properly, not using a hand to shake out the rope occasionally, and other such habits that you can get away with an ATC ... with a gri gri/smart you need to do these things to insure the rope feeds smoothly ... not just belay from a thrown down mess of ropes ... the gri gri also has issues wth thick stiff ropes IMO ... all this is worth it for the smooth as butter autoblock of the smart IMO ... especially if you are taking up 2 cute girls ;)


I used the Mega Jul and Alpine Smart for rope ascending like a GriGri. The Mega Jul ,Smart, ATC-G rig like an autoblock/Top Belay with a redirect off a pulley hung from an Ascender. Of the three only the Smart would function smoothly like a GriGri. Same reason why it is easy to pull rope through belaying from an anchor.


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By DannyUncanny
From Vancouver
Apr 15, 2013

I messed around with one at the store the other day. The 2mm width of the cast steel feature which someone's life will depend on kind of freaks me out. My gut feeling is to trust forging or machining more than casting.


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By Moritz B.
Apr 15, 2013
Profile Pic

@DannyUncanny
Thanks for bringing up this concern.
The loop for belaying the second might look thin but it fulfills the prEN norm of 8kn with ease. In internal tests it even exceeded the required strength by far. There is no reason to not trust it.


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By Joey Wolfe
Apr 15, 2013


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By Dr. Rocktopolus
From Chattanooga, TN
Apr 16, 2013
Whipping on the redpoint crux of " The Theater Of Pain " 5.13b Cooks Wall, NC

My Review Climbsoutheast


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By jktinst
Apr 27, 2013

The MEC has been selling it for several weeks. Only one buyer review on their site so far and it's pretty discouraging. Among the issues mentioned, the one that I'm most concerned about is that of wear being inflicted by the steel device on the softer belay biner. The reviewer didn't specify which biner he used. It seems unlikely that this was caused by using the device wrong (wrong handling or wrong kind of biner) because, apparently, he was able to return both the Jul and the messed-up biner (although MEC is usually pretty lenient with their return policy and they may not have checked if he used it correctly or they may have accepted the return despite incorrect use). Could it be a case again of some belay biners having the problem and others not? I certainly wouldn't want to have to try and find (let alone use) a steel belay biner to avoid this problem. Anyone else finding similar problems? The Smart has been around longer and I haven't seen this issue mentioned for it. I'm still trying to find time to take my own rope to the nearest MEC and try the Jul myself but I'm concerned that this issue of biner damage would show up only in the field and not in the store


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By John Wilder
From Las Vegas, NV
Apr 27, 2013

Yeah, when I was doing the demos for it at OR in the summer, it totally jacked our demo carabiner- we had to make sure it stayed with the device- knocked it up too much to be shown in other ways. I remember thinking it did a fair bit of damage for basically a show demo, which shouldnt even scratch anodizing on aluminum. I dont think it would damage it such that it would compromise the carabiner, but you'd definitely want to keep that carabiner dedicated and not use it for other things. I'd also expect a shorter life out of the carabiner.

The smart wouldnt do this, as its made of aluminum.


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By George Bracksieck
Apr 27, 2013

Although the body of the Smart is aluminum, which would help dissipate heat, the rope-bearing surfaces appear to be stainless steel.


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By Ray Pinpillage
From West Egg
Apr 27, 2013
Cleo's Needle

jktinst wrote:
The MEC has been selling it for several weeks. Only one buyer review on their site so far and it's pretty discouraging. Among the issues mentioned, the one that I'm most concerned about is that of wear being inflicted by the steel device on the softer belay biner. The reviewer didn't specify which biner he used. It seems unlikely that this was caused by using the device wrong (wrong handling or wrong kind of biner) because, apparently, he was able to return both the Jul and the messed-up biner (although MEC is usually pretty lenient with their return policy and they may not have checked if he used it correctly or they may have accepted the return despite incorrect use). Could it be a case again of some belay biners having the problem and others not? I certainly wouldn't want to have to try and find (let alone use) a steel belay biner to avoid this problem. Anyone else finding similar problems? The Smart has been around longer and I haven't seen this issue mentioned for it. I'm still trying to find time to take my own rope to the nearest MEC and try the Jul myself but I'm concerned that this issue of biner damage would show up only in the field and not in the store


The Mega Jul does cause some wear to the outer edge of the carabiner. It is cosmetic.


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