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Counterfeit Petzl Products
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Feb 11, 2011
Fake Petzl Stuff?

Does anyone else know anything about this and if its true?
bwalt822
Joined Aug 20, 2010
0 points
Feb 11, 2011
Dreamweaver
Good thing BD stuff is already made in China so we don't have to worry about the Chinese knock-offs. JonnyC
From Fort Collins, CO
Joined Mar 11, 2010
60 points
Feb 11, 2011
JonnyC wrote:
Good thing BD stuff is already made in China so we don't have to worry about the Chinese knock-offs.


That is exactly why you have to worry about Chinese knockoffs. The manufacturing capability and designs are all set up there. One factory manager could shoot off a run after hours or sell the designs to some nonname brand.
DannyUncanny
From Vancouver
Joined Aug 27, 2010
78 points
Feb 11, 2011
Grande Grotto
DannyUncanny wrote:
That is exactly why you have to worry about Chinese knockoffs. The manufacturing capability and designs are all set up there. One factory manager could shoot off a run after hours or sell the designs to some nonname brand.


False. It's a BD factory. They don't outsource this to a 3rd party. It's THEIR building.

So if worker were to do such a thing it would be a BD worker at the BD plant - something I don't see occurring.

This is NOT the same as a clothing company who makes stuff for Marmot, Patagonia ETC.

The Petzl thing is a bit worrisome - So buy from legit dealers.

BD China Tour
mattm
From TX
Joined Jun 2, 2006
1,238 points
Feb 11, 2011
A fine day at Reeds- Ejesta!
wow- big concerns indeed squiddo
From Mountain View, CA
Joined Jul 28, 2008
63 points
Feb 11, 2011
I still haven't actually seen anything from Petzl so don't get too excited yet. bwalt822
Joined Aug 20, 2010
0 points
Feb 11, 2011
I can't say I'm surprised...if anything I'm surprised it hasn't been more of an issue. If you can buy a knock off iPod, which still requires a decent amount of engineering to make, why wouldn't they want to steal a carabiner design and sell 40g of aluminum for $15us? I bet they could sell them for $0.40 and still make a profit. Ian Stewart
Joined May 17, 2010
166 points
Feb 11, 2011
Staying Warm on South Face of Washington Column
Ian Stewart wrote:
I can't say I'm surprised...if anything I'm surprised it hasn't been more of an issue. If you can buy a knock off iPod, which still requires a decent amount of engineering to make, why wouldn't they want to steal a carabiner design and sell 40g of aluminum for $15us? I bet they could sell them for $0.40 and still make a profit.


Maybe, but this doesn't make sense. Why would a counterfeiting operation do this...I mean the retail climbing market is miniature compared to the Ipod market, especially for something like the Petzel P50 Rescue Pulley, for example (which was listed as one of the counterfeit products). Is it really profitable to devote such a huge amount of time, effort, manufacturing equipment, etc to produce something that can only be differentiated by "an in-depth analysis" for such a small market?

I smell conspiracy theory! I'm only half kidding...
aaron hope
From Walnut Creek, CA
Joined Nov 15, 2009
219 points
Feb 11, 2011
Where? Wouldn't you like to know. You have to buy ...
Nothing is sacred anymore.
Thanks for the info.
Very scary. We trust our lives to those little metal trinkets.
PTZ
From Chicago/Colorado
Joined Jul 27, 2010
523 points
Feb 11, 2011
Rock Wars, RRG, 2008
One reason I still keep and trust my old Chouinard ovals and other hardware purchased throughout the 90's. With little wear and stored indoors, I think most of my Petzl and BD gear on hand will last me for another decade without an 'upgrade'. Yeah, I'm of another generation that doesn't see the purpose of 'improving' or upgrading to the newest iPod, iPhone or even carabiner that comes out just for the sake of being up with the latest tech or design. If it works, don't fix it I still say. (goes for my 40mpg car too which the dealer insists must go through a needless but expensive 35,000 mile 'check up'.) Woodchuck ATC
Joined Nov 29, 2007
3,090 points
Feb 11, 2011
bwalt822 wrote:
I still haven't actually seen anything from Petzl so don't get too excited yet.


Confirmed:

petzl.com/us/outdoor/news-2/20...
DStaley
Joined Mar 24, 2007
0 points
Administrator
Feb 11, 2011
This problem haunted my dreams for 6 years after f...
I changed your title to be a statement and not a question, and made it sticky for now. Scary. Chris treggE
From Madison, WI
Joined May 25, 2007
9,080 points
Feb 11, 2011
Don't everybody freak out, at least not if one has walked around Thamel...... coldfinger
Joined Oct 23, 2010
62 points
Feb 11, 2011
TDog wrote:
You don't read so well. At the top is says "Attention: Petzl warns for fake Chinese reproductions " You were the one to start the thread. Are you calling yourself out for "The ski is falling", "Crying wolf", "Fire (in the theater)". Yes, china is destroying the world.


Before you make yourself look too much like a jackass you should consider the possibility that I made that post before Petzl put it on their website. At the time of my OP the only source of this information was one blog of some unknown person halfway around the world.
bwalt822
Joined Aug 20, 2010
0 points
Feb 11, 2011
TDog wrote:
You don't read so well. At the top is says "Attention: Petzl warns for fake Chinese reproductions " You were the one to start the thread. Are you calling yourself out for "The ski is falling", "Crying wolf", "Fire (in the theater)". Yes, china is destroying the world.


Well you might write better than you hold your liquor. ;)

Personally I'm more afraid of snowboards.....
coldfinger
Joined Oct 23, 2010
62 points
Feb 12, 2011
Bocan
Any one catch this in the first notice?

"We remind you that selling PPE (personal protective Equipment) may hold the seller liable".

Sooo you think about all the selling and reselling we do of PPE...any thoughts on this? Lawyers?
Scott McMahon
From Boulder, CO
Joined Feb 15, 2006
927 points
Feb 12, 2011
Obi Wan Ryobi - Darth Vader Crag, Rumney NH
Is it just me, or am I the only one not worried about these being in LEGIT vendors? I would assume that any vendor with a repuation (REI, IME, EMS, CampMor, GearX, or anything on Dirtbag deals) would get their gear from the company that made it, therefore this is only a problem for those purchasing gear in the back holes of the internet, or those finding new gear at surprisingly low prices on eBay, Craigslist, and other classifieds.

Is this devious, immoral and downright cheap and disturbing? YES. But I don't think it affects people who buy their gear from a reputable retailer, or even direct from the manufacturer themselves.
Brendan Blanchard
From Boulder, CO
Joined Oct 18, 2010
309 points
Feb 12, 2011
Brendan Blanchard wrote:
. But I don't think it affects people who buy their gear from a reputable retailer, or even direct from the manufacturer themselves.


Brendan ... how about your climbing partners ... do you always know where their gear comes from?

i dont ... if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck ... i assume it must be a duck ... and taste just as good ...
bearbreeder
Joined Mar 1, 2009
1,886 points
Feb 12, 2011
Rock Wars, RRG, 2008
Does anyone ever worry about purchasing a 'blem' from the genuine company? Cosmetic flaws don't affect the use, just the appearances of being 'new', so the price is cut drastically. Is it possible that some of the knock offs might be closer to a genuine 'blem' product in quality? Woodchuck ATC
Joined Nov 29, 2007
3,090 points
Feb 12, 2011
Shucka Bra.
Harsh realities of the seemingly insatiable american demand for cheaper and cheaper shit. The stealing of technology and reverse engineering has been happening a lot in other industries for a long time. The funny thing is, china don't give a fuck. They see it as a legitimate business practice. And yes, I do worry aboud BD outsourcing production to china. Time to start buying DMM cams... Dustin B
From Steamboat
Joined Jan 29, 2006
1,516 points
Feb 12, 2011
KC on Fields (medium).  Photo (c) Doug Shepherd
Shumin Wu wrote:
I bet you sound just like this in real life:


So your point, Shumin, is that the government, people and companies in China have the highest regard for intellectual property protection, product safety, worker and environmental protection, and fair wages? Evidence would suggest otherwise on all counts.
Kevin Craig
Joined Mar 20, 2002
448 points
Feb 12, 2011
I don't know... In the petzl notice it shows that while the counterfeits weren't as strong as the originals- they're still pretty strong.
Anybody know how much less the knock-offs cost?
bdboulder
From Eldorado
Joined Oct 11, 2006
127 points
Feb 12, 2011
JLP wrote:
As for these knock off products, it's nothing new. It just means Petzl, like many, use China for some of their manufacturing. A tooling die gets duplicated or replaced, a production manager leaves and finds a new job across the street - or better, maybe Petzl pulls the rug out from under one company in favor of another underbidder, leaving behind a lot of IP. It's been happening for a long time. Go shopping in Bangkok sometime. IMO, stay in the dealer networks and off ebay for new equipment and you'll be fine.


But has Petzl ever had any of their products actually made in China? So far, every Petzl item I've looked at was made in either France or the USA.
Khoi
From Vancouver, BC
Joined Oct 12, 2009
13 points
Feb 12, 2011
JLP wrote:
Do Camalots say "Made in China"?


The tags say "made in china by black diamond" but the cams themselves don't.
caughtinside
From Oakland CA
Joined Nov 21, 2006
1,898 points
Feb 17, 2011
Every single day.
Bob Dergay wrote:
I don't know... In the petzl notice it shows that while the counterfeits weren't as strong as the originals- they're still pretty strong. Anybody know how much less the knock-offs cost?

Hahahaha!!
Kurt Ross
From Boulder, colorado
Joined Apr 8, 2009
302 points
Feb 17, 2011
Dustin B wrote:
Time to start buying DMM cams...


errrr..... maybe not
sthomas
Joined Apr 5, 2010
47 points


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