While shopping around for a new set of technical cams (i.e., small) to supplement my eight or so year old run of Metolius TCU's 00-3 the question, 'whose technical cams reign supreme', came to mind. I primarily climb in Eldorado Canyon and Front Range areas. Initially, I leaned towards the new Metolius Master Cam as much out of brand loyalty as wanting the latest in single stem technology. I bought a 1-Blue to test drive and liked it, but in the mean time a voice in my head keeps telling me these are good cams, but something else might be better.

To appease the nerd in me I dumped the raw available numbers (i.e., range, strength, weight) into an Excel spreadsheet and started calculating. BD C3s are the clear winner on weight and CCH Aliens hold the upper hand for both strength and range.





Note: I wasn't able to figure out how to use Excel to come up with a nice looking cam min/max range floating bar chart so if someone could pave the way great! Download the Excel spreadsheet if you wanna give it a go.

I couldn't find any numbers for head width to gauge how deeply cams need to be placed for all lobes to engage. Further, I don't have a clue about cam physics. How does cam lobe shape and design impact holding power in sub optimal placements (e.g., tipped out vs. over camed)?

Enlighten me. I am more interested in hard numbers then nieve allegiance/bias towards a particular product. Granted CCH has had QC issues, but their base numbers on paper look good from a non scientific view point.

For small gear I always carry a set of TCU's but since the new C3's came out those accompany me on my rack. especially for places like eldo. They work great.
I personally think there is a place for both. So I would vote to get a set of both and then pick n choose for sizes and areas.

That's the problem Marc. Not all CCH cams are to be trusted.

The more and more I mess with friends' new Master Cams though, the more I'm inclined to just get more aliens and bounce test them. Those master cams are way less of a replacement than I thought they'd be.

The two smaller sizes are narrower than aliens, as are C3's. Both are better because of this. Green-Orange aliens are without peer from what I've seen.

Also Joe, don't forget the WC Zero's. I have one and don't hate it (though the alien is better).

my vote is for CCH hybrid aliens for most granite. micro-camalots for the desert.

besides the raw data on strength and weight, you have to consider how it feels in your hand. When your sketched and struggling to get the thing positioned in that tiny crack, feel and handling matter.

This is pure personal preference, but I prefer the trigger feel on the BD C3's over the TCU model. I've never fooled with Aliens.

I own the 3 smallest Master cams and can't seem to fall in love with them. I carried them up D7 with John a few days ago and we both usually had them hanging on our gear sling at the end of a pitch. They will never replace aliens in my opinion. Most of my regular partners have aliens and I really like the way they feel and place. I will probably buy some in the near future and don't really care about what others think of them. There is no substitute for an alien.
Yeah, CCH had a bad batch some 4 years ago now because they were outsourcing the process where the cable is brazed into the head. That's in the past as far as I'm concerned.

Like I said in my OP, I don't really care what other people think of them.

The f'n alien debate, lets not go there with this post, by arguing we aren't going to change peoples opinions about CCH.

I'll try to get a graph using minitab for you.

Every time you fall on an alien, Healyje punches an orphan.

Rob, Geir, anyone...
Would you go to the shop tomorrow, buy an assortment of Aliens, and without qualification or hesitation use them on your rack?

Unfortunately usable range can be hard to quantify.

I know that I touted the Master Cams in my initial post, but I forgot one important thing: I have a major gripe with the larger sizes (#5 & #6). In my limited experience, the cables on the #5 (and by extension but not experience, #6) are not stiff enough for the amount of pull required to retract the lobes. That is, when I pull the trigger on my #5, it often (but not always) bends the entire cam instead of retracting the lobes; it takes a very deliberate pull to retract the cams without bending the cam 90 degrees. Of course when you're all puckered up and in desperate need of a placement, this could be a very unpleasant circumstance to find yourself in.

I believe this is a significant flaw in an otherwise very well made camming device that I hope Metolius puts some more R & D into. Although it probably only needs a thicker, stiffer main cable.

--Marc

marc, mine do't do that at all, call metolius and talk to them about it either the springs are too strong or the lobes aren't rotating freely enough. That wouldnt' have anything to do with the cord they use for trigger wires and master cams use a stiffer cable even than CCH. Pluss they are very stiff up near the head do to the side wires.

unless you were talking about the two wire cables running where CCH puts tubing then I will say that they don't retract real well when bent and pulling on it causes them to straighten out.

It doesn't matter if you test or who tests your Aliens or what they are rated - they are still crap manufactured in an out of control process by a bunch of meth heads. 3 sigma is more than a statistical rating, it's a method of testing and process control during manufacturing - that's where the 99 or whatever % certainty comes from - the process control, not some math QC performs on some numbers after all has been done. CCH has no such process control. Testing them to below their breaking strength post process doesn't mean squat. As far as some isolated incident 4 years ago and all is okay and wonderful now, maybe you've missed the dozens of pictures and incidents of broken cams posted here and elsewhere since the recall.

That said, I've been very happy with my Master Cams. I have Blue-Red. I use Camalots above, and C3's below. I think the tiniest cams need to be narrower, so C3's work well. The smallest Master Cams and Aliens are too wide - it's rare to find a crack that thin that is also parallel for long enough to accommodate the wider heads.