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cleaning a wall
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By Doug Wolfe
From NJ
Sep 24, 2012
I found a nice little crag to climb close to work and it needs some love..... is it ok to clean moss an ivy off a wall to make a route climbable.. im assuming that's a violation of LNT..

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By Cor
Sep 24, 2012
black nasty
pack it out, leave no trace. ;D

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By Adam Leedy
From Austin, TX
Sep 24, 2012
climbing isn't exactly an LNT sport.

Clean the moss. Just don't comfortize any holds and you won't be violating any ethics of any climbers I know.

The one thing that does bug me that goes down here in Austin a lot is the use of massive amounts of herbicide on poison ivy. People don't seem to realize that that shit is going to seep down to the ground the first time it rains and kill things that aren't poison ivy.

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By Dan Felix
Sep 24, 2012
Not sure what is being sprayed, but if it's Round-up/glyphosate herbicide, it doesn't leach. While the possibility is there in general, some herbicides are a lot safer than others.

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By Doug Wolfe
From NJ
Sep 24, 2012
There will be no spraying I'm one of the lucky people who have no reaction to poison ivy, an as far as the lichen an moss go I plan on bringing a hard bristle brush and dry scrubbing the shit out of it.

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By johnthethird
Sep 24, 2012
what type of rock?

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By Andy Novak
From Golden, Co
Sep 24, 2012
Living the High Life.
Leave it alone. Climb somewhere else. Leave No Trace.

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By Cultivating Mass
Sep 25, 2012
Leading on the only "fair means" rack.
Some of the best routes I've put up required a degree in horticulture to even fathom.

If it's obviously worth it, go for it. If it'll re-grow in six months and no one, including yourself, gives a shit, why not skip the effort and enjoy yourself elsewhere?

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By Addison
From Boulder, CO
Sep 26, 2012
me at eldo
Don't leave it alone. Climb it!

It is a violation of of LNT but again, climbing in most cases is not a LNT sport. When cleaning moss and weeds on routes I like to use a paint scraper. it's got a hole in the handle already to clip to a biner and it works like a charm.

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By mountainlion
Sep 26, 2012
How often will the route be climbed by you and others?
Is the route a quality route or do you just feel the need to put up a route?

If the answers are the route will be enjoyed by many, and if not climbed by you alot.

If the route is high quality then put it up. If it is forgetable then forget it leave it as is.

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By M Sprague
Administrator
From New England
Sep 26, 2012
Lichen head. Me, with my usual weatherbeaten, lich...
You haven't said who owns the land and what their policies are. Is it an area frequented by others, especially naturalist/birder types who will get upset if it is cleaned? If it is going to freak a bunch of people out, than it is not worth it. If it wont, and the potential routes are really good and will be climbed, go for it and clean it well. Use a wire brush and scraper if the rock is not soft, and yes, comfortise the holds a little if they are stupidly sharp and are just going to slice the crap out of you unless it gives character to the route (Use your best judgement. It is a grey area). Also, dull any sharp edges that look like they are likely to slice someone's rope.

The brush to use for initial cleaning of new routes unless on soft rock: Wooster Longneck brush with scraper(Hand)&gclid=CJDMg63J07ICFYyPPAodL3AApA

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By Andy Novak
From Golden, Co
Sep 26, 2012
Living the High Life.
Addison wrote:
It is a violation of LNT but again, climbing in most cases is not a LNT sport.


Lame argument. Thats like saying "this highway is already trashed so I will just throw this bottle out the window".

Carefully consider how many other people will enjoy this area. Consider who owns the land. How many times will you climb at this cliff? 10 times? 100 times?

Unless its a true gem with multiple routes that MANY other people will enjoy, LEAVE IT ALONE.


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By Eric Engberg
Sep 26, 2012
Andy Novak wrote:
Lame argument. Thats like saying "this highway is already trashed so I will just throw this bottle out the window".


Ever read the "Monkey Wrench Gang"?

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By Doug Wolfe
From NJ
Sep 26, 2012
All Killer No Filler wrote:
Some of the best routes I've put up required a degree in horticulture to even fathom. If it's obviously worth it, go for it. If it'll re-grow in six months and no one, including yourself, gives a shit, why not skip the effort and enjoy yourself elsewhere?


Well cause I live in Jersey and choices are extremely limited..

The area is mills reservation its in the Nj guide book and sees very little traffic the route I'm working on is a 5.7 from what the book say's and so far it has been a good project for me an its super close to my job...

The guide book has the rock listed as trap rock

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By M Sprague
Administrator
From New England
Sep 26, 2012
Lichen head. Me, with my usual weatherbeaten, lich...
I think most of us thought you were working on putting up a new route. In the case of a pre-existing one you will want to be more circumspect about altering the rock unless something loose is clearly dangerous or ready to come off anyway. As far as the vegetation, in the NE stuff grows back really quickly, so assuming there are no rare or particularly beautiful plants, have at it.

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By Doug Wolfe
From NJ
Sep 26, 2012
Nothing rare just little ivy, lichen and moss

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By MAKB
From Sydney, AUS
Sep 27, 2012
Metrosexual (7a+)
Depends a lot on local ethics too. People are gonna tell you a bunch of different things and they might all be right depedning on the area. Does anyone care about this spot? is it popular for other activities?
I would do it.

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