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Adding Bolts between runouts
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By NC Rock Climber
From The Oven, AKA Phoenix
Feb 5, 2014
tanuki

chills wrote:
Paul Ross is the man. Any one who thinks otherwise can piss off!


LOL! chilis brings his "a-game" to the discussion! Go MENSA!


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By chills
From Boulder, Colorado
Feb 5, 2014

That's all that needs to be said.
If you don't know that already do some homework.


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By The Rope Gun
Feb 6, 2014
Me

Jared Moore wrote:
So, I am wondering...what are the ethics of adding a bolt in between large runouts? Is it a bad thing to make a route safer for someone to try, so that the risk of taking a bad whipper or even decking isn't as high? I realize that some climbs are so easy and putting bolts there can sometimes be silly, however, why have runouts on 10s or harder? I would appreciate only serious constructive comments...

After scrolling through all the blabbering, here is my shpeal on it: If the run out can be protected with gear, or is 2 grades below the stated route grade, DON'T retrobolt. If the run out is blank, cruxy and could potentially result in a decking, then be my guest and add that bolt. Do it from ground up though.


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By Tavis Ricksecker
From Bishop, ca
Feb 6, 2014
Church of the Lost and Found, Left. Summer 2013

The Rope Gun wrote:
After scrolling through all the blabbering, here is my shpeal on it: If the run out can be protected with gear, or is 2 grades below the stated route grade, DON'T retrobolt. If the run out is blank, cruxy and could potentially result in a decking, then be my guest and add that bolt. Do it from ground up though.


Now it's set in stone. We can all rest easier. Wait... is that two letter grades or two number grades?


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By Tavis Ricksecker
From Bishop, ca
Feb 6, 2014
Church of the Lost and Found, Left. Summer 2013

CDC wrote:
Maybe take up golf !


Too dangerous.


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By Ronin
From Petersburg, WV
Feb 6, 2014
Almost Heaven nothing... this IS Heaven.  Climbing parallel to my young friend Andreas on a perfect fall day.

Bolts added to my runouts will be happily accepted as gear donations. Can always use another bolt hanger or three... even pro deal isn't free. You have the right to add, I have the right to subtract.

Funny that I rarely (as in "never") hear any hard persons saying "This route has too many bolts... think I'll throw in a run-out here on this 5.5 section."

Cheers!


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Feb 6, 2014
...

"You have the right to add, I have the right to subtract."


Something to consider:



JTNP...

Indian Cove...

You can hand drill bolts/hangers (Of course you do need the Skippers approval)...

Legal to leave the hardware in the rock...

ILLLEGAL to remove it as it is now the property of JTNP...


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By Boissal
From Small Lake, UT
Feb 6, 2014

Locker wrote:
"hey Brit, got any tips on how sporto, grade-chasin posers can be as awesome as you are? I'm in for a crusty old man sac competition. I first put on rock shoes 30 years ago. Your move." ~~~ David S. "David- you do realize USBRIT did the "fissure brown" in 1959, in boots, with a pack, and worthless pro right? he first put his shoes on 60(plus) years ago." ~~~ cieneguita LMAO! Perfect!

I'm just going to quote this for posterity.
I imagine David's mouth had to stretch to cavernous proportions to accommodate his foot (feet at this point). I doubt his asshole is faring any better after getting pounded so hard.
Now y'all carry on telling us that you're scared of slabs.


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Feb 6, 2014
...

I didn't write this.

NOT MY QUOTE.

""hey Brit, got any tips on how sporto, grade-chasin posers can be as awesome as you are? I'm in for a crusty old man sac competition. I first put on rock shoes 30 years ago. Your move." ~~~ David S. "David- you do realize USBRIT did the "fissure brown" in 1959, in boots, with a pack, and worthless pro right? he first put his shoes on 60(plus) years ago." ~~~ cieneguita LMAO! Perfect!"


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By David Sahalie
From on the road again
Feb 6, 2014

Boissal wrote:
I'm just going to quote this for posterity. I image David's mouth had to stretch to cavernous proportions to accommodate his foot (feet at this point). I doubt his asshole is faring any better after getting pounded so hard. Now y'all carry on telling us that you're scared of slabs.



I'm basking in the irony of USBRIT's flaming ANON posters while being an ANON poster. Would I have written what I wrote if his name was Famous OG Paul Ross? No... I didn't know because (wait for it...) he was ANONymous!

But, thanks for being concerned about the state of my a$$ and how far my mouth can open. These fine folks welcome newcomers: homoclimbtastic.com/
.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Feb 6, 2014
Thumbtastic

Guideline #1 says don't be a jerk. Dave, it's not your logic that people dislike, you have experience and value to contribute to the site and these dicussions. It's your chest-beating, condescension, and general rudeness.

You bitch unendingly about how caught up in themselves these mythical Norse Ancient Crusters are, but I see zero difference in your approach. Your outlook is right, it's the only one, urrybotty bein stoopit up in heah, except Erudite Dave.

Face it. You're stoned, have time on your hands you'd benefit from using to climb more, but instead are indulging in fruitless ego jousts with near or total strangers online.

I know this because you are a 30 year climber, and are Patient Zero of a new pathology only known as "Internet forum clash addiction." I recommend immediate cold turkey, take a couple of months off and see if your family, your friends, and you r ticklist don't all benefit from the sudden bounty of free time you'll have now that you're not busy telling Paul Ross and anyone else with a chuff handle how lame they are.

We know they're lame, so are you and I, we're posting on effing mountainproject. The two are synonomous. I'm learning about the Alpine Up and how to stretch out my shoes on here, there is actual, measurable benefit to my life and my climbing from these interactions, at least some of them. Spraying as you tend to does nothing but reinforce the stereotype us tiddlywink placing high top wearers tend to hold of bolt clippers. Participate in the discussion, fine. When you start trying to see if your dick measures up against British senior citizens and find suddenly that it doesn't and won't, perhaps there is a lesson to be learned about more valuable ways to spend your time.

Seriously, champ. Why don't you sit out the next few rounds, calm down, just stop talking for a while, ok?


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By David Sahalie
From on the road again
Feb 6, 2014

Yawn... wake me up when the psychobabble ends. I made a miscalculation and subsequently apologized to Mr Ross, but the flaming by other posters who want a fight continues. Whatever entertains the masses.

I'm just another weekend warrior bored in cubicle world like most others on this site.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Feb 6, 2014
Thumbtastic

David Sahalie wrote:
I'm just another weekend warrior bored in cubicle world like most others on this site.


The first step is admitting you have a problem.


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Feb 6, 2014
modern man

VaGenius wrote:
Guideline #1 says don't be a jerk. Dave, it's not your logic that people dislike, you have experience and value to contribute to the site and these dicussions. It's your chest-beating, condescension, and general rudeness. You bitch unendingly about how caught up in themselves these mythical Norse Ancient Crusters are, but I see zero difference in your approach. Your outlook is right, it's the only one, urrybotty bein stoopit up in heah, except Erudite Dave. Face it. You're stoned, have time on your hands you'd benefit from using to climb more, but instead are indulging in fruitless ego jousts with near or total strangers online. I know this because you are a 30 year climber, and are Patient Zero of a new pathology only known as "Internet forum clash addiction." I recommend immediate cold turkey, take a couple of months off and see if your family, your friends, and you r ticklist don't all benefit from the sudden bounty of free time you'll have now that you're not busy telling Paul Ross and anyone else with a chuff handle how lame they are. We know they're lame, so are you and I, we're posting on effing mountainproject. The two are synonomous. I'm learning about the Alpine Up and how to stretch out my shoes on here, there is actual, measurable benefit to my life and my climbing from these interactions, at least some of them. Spraying as you tend to does nothing but reinforce the stereotype us tiddlywink placing high top wearers tend to hold of bolt clippers. Participate in the discussion, fine. When you start trying to see if your dick measures up against British senior citizens and find suddenly that it doesn't and won't, perhaps there is a lesson to be learned about more valuable ways to spend your time. Seriously, champ. Why don't you sit out the next few rounds, calm down, just stop talking for a while, ok?


Let me condense this long winded Killis post - Dave, youre a dick and it takes one to know one.


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By don'tchuffonme
Feb 6, 2014
urrr

My post. I'm amazed it's still there. There are at least two or three others that were snarky but not really offensive to anyone in particular that had the words "ball cupping" in them and were immediately removed. Not that I mind. I mean, we NEED moderation, or else threads just turn into dick measuring shitshows, you know?

MJMobes wrote:
Let me condense this long winded Killis post - Dave, youre a dick and it takes one to know one.


Nice shootin', Tex! Yeee hawww!!


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By Ronin
From Petersburg, WV
Feb 6, 2014
Almost Heaven nothing... this IS Heaven.  Climbing parallel to my young friend Andreas on a perfect fall day.

Locker wrote:
"You have the right to add, I have the right to subtract." Something to consider: JTNP... Indian Cove... You can hand drill bolts/hangers (Of course you do need the Skippers approval)... Legal to leave the hardware in the rock... ILLLEGAL to remove it as it is now the property of JTNP...



Soon as I can find the gas to drive 2,400+ miles to get there, and as soon as I bolt a line of any kind there (instead of leaving it to Todd and the crew), this will be a problem.

As of now, I'm back here on all that tame rock the people from "God's Rock" country don't cotton to much (aka "West Virginia crags outside the New River Gorge") and here if you add bolts to our routes, we WILL treat them as donations.

And, like so many others, there is a long walk from the rules made up by folks at the NPS/NFS to what they can actually enforce...


Just sayin'


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Feb 6, 2014
...

"there is a long walk from the rules made up by folks at the NPS/NFS to what they can actually enforce..."

Amen!


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By David Coley
From UK
Feb 7, 2014

Jared Moore wrote:
So, I am wondering...what are the ethics of adding a bolt in between large runouts? Is it a bad thing to make a route safer for someone to try, so that the risk of taking a bad whipper or even decking isn't as high? I realize that some climbs are so easy and putting bolts there can sometimes be silly, however, why have runouts on 10s or harder? I would appreciate only serious constructive comments...


Why would you want to waste drill time putting bolts into a pre-existing climb? If you have a drill and think bolt protected routes good, why not just use the drill time to put up some new routes and leave the community with something new.


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Feb 9, 2014
modern man

David Coley wrote:
Why would you want to waste drill time putting bolts into a pre-existing climb? If you have a drill and think bolt protected routes good, why not just use the drill time to put up some new routes and leave the community with something new.


some of us think of it as being similar to fixing up an old house or a car, sometimes they get so run down and beat up they have absolutely no value anymore. Whats the use of a house that nobody can live in or a car that cant be driven?

when you live in a place that has a ton of routes that either havent been led in 25 years or never were and were just claimed by someone who toproped it first you might understand. some of us consider it unlocking the potential.

I wonder why this thread keeps getting buried on page 3?


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Feb 9, 2014
...

"some of us think of it as being similar to fixing up an old house or a car, sometimes they get so run down and beat up they have absolutely no value anymore. Whats the use of a house that nobody can live in or a car that cant be driven?"


From what I can see, more of us think of it as fucking up someone else's FA.


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By MJMobes
From The land of steady habits
Feb 9, 2014
modern man

Locker wrote:
From what I can see, more of us think of it as fucking up someone else's FA.


hmm, from what I have got out of this thread is that most of us agree that a route that hasnt been touched in X amount of years is fair game.

it is confusing with all deletions going on I'll admit.


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By Locker
From Yucca Valley, CA
Feb 9, 2014
...

"hmm, from what I have got out of this thread is that most of us agree that a route that hasnt been touched in X amount of years is fair game."


My "from what I can see" is overall, and not just related to this thread. This subject has gotten pretty old by now and the majority of climbers appear to lean more towards leaving things as they are. Again, this is my observation. I have not OCD'd and done any actual counting. There are very few here on this thread. Not IMO representational of the "Climbing community" as a whole.


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Feb 9, 2014
Thumbtastic

MJMobes wrote:
what I have got out of this thread is that most of us agree that a route that hasnt been touched in X amount of years is fair game.


W-R-O-N-G


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By SexPanther aka Kiedis
Feb 9, 2014
Thumbtastic

And stalker was her name-o. Not even five minutes. Proud.


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By Mark E Dixon
From Sprezzatura, Someday
Feb 9, 2014
Sure, I can belay

"hmm, from what I have got out of this thread is that most of us agree that a route that hasnt been touched in X amount of years is fair game." said Mobes

Locker replied- My "from what I can see" is overall, and not just related to this thread. This subject has gotten pretty old by now and the majority of climbers appear to lean more towards leaving things as they are. Again, this is my observation. I have not OCD'd and done any actual counting. There are very few here on this thread. Not IMO representational of the "Climbing community" as a whole.



Don't get me wrong, I like adventure climbing and would like to see the opportunity preserved. But unless adventure climbers stop falling back on "tradition" and threats and start convincing the tsunami of new climbers of the value of boldness, the future is with Mobes and retrobolting.


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