Doubles: 8mm x 60 or 70?

I'm having trouble deciding whether I want 60 or 70 meter double ropes. Basically, I'm torn between weight, volume and cash savings (which is a concern where I'd bring doubles) and linking pitches/ 70 meter raps. That being said, has anybody ever NEEDED double 70s for a rap route? None come to mind. I can see the added benefit of long pitches but again, I rarely run into a 60m+ pitch I could finagle with some simul climbing. Opinions, comments, advice?....swing me.

Hi Don,

I have owned many pairs at both lengths. I have settled on 70's because the inconvenience of the added weight and rope management is pretty minimal when compared to the number of times that I have been able to either outrun a storm by stretching pitches together and/or have had the option of better and safer belay ledges/stances (I regularly climb with partners where I don't want to simul-climb). Truth be told its probably not a big deal either way, but on balance I prefer the 70s.

Interesting, I have been on thin 60's all summer, and can't ever recall wishing I'd had 70's. I don't think the rope management or weight would really be an issue, I just never felt like 60m was a limiting factor.

The whole reason I own doubles is for situations where I may need two ropes to get down, ie a single 70 won't do it. Since i need to carry two ropes, I want them as light as possible, therefore I have 2x60m ropes. I've never come across raps longer than 60m, and usually my climbs are adequately done with 60m or shorter pitch lengths. YMMV.

Don Ferris wrote:I'm having trouble deciding whether I want 60 or 70 meter double ropes. Basically, I'm torn between weight, volume and cash savings (which is a concern where I'd bring doubles) and linking pitches/ 70 meter raps. That being said, has anybody ever NEEDED double 70s for a rap route? None come to mind. I can see the added benefit of long pitches but again, I rarely run into a 60m+ pitch I could finagle with some simul climbing. Opinions, comments, advice?....swing me.

My 2 cents-it is going to dictate where you climb on what length rope you need. For me when I am alpine and ice climbing double 70m ropes have meant the difference between getting to a good rap/belay station and having to settle on a marginal location. However I am also looking for trees, rocks and other things I can anchor off of; there are not necessarily fixed anchors in the mountains where I am using doubles. I find that 70m for the decent really can make a faster and safer decent.
But if you are climbing at designated crag where there are fixed anchors than get the rope that will be best for what you will be climbing. There is no need to be packing an extra 10 meters of rope (x2 for doubles) if you do not need to.

If yr linking pitches and using rope anchors the extra length with 70s help

Remember that you might need to chop em sometime

And if yr doing "no fall" climbs a single 70 half gives you a bit more to work with when rapping

If you also have a 70 single then a 70 half works well as a tag line

;)

I'm not sure what your preferred style of climbing is, but there are many ice climbs where a 70m pitch will get you to a nice stance. Then again, that's probably true with 80m, 90m, etc...

I got a screaming deal on a set of 60m twins and expect them to meet my needs well. I rarely string pitches together.

I've definitely wished my 60m doubles were 70's at least a few times.

Book Of Saturdays on Notch Peak is an example where double 70s will get you down way quicker than double 60s. Either way really, but I'd go with 70s if they weren't too much more expensive. I'd also consider the brand - Sterling ropes run long and Petzl tend to be short.

I've got 7.1 60's that I use for ice climbing and despite being attentive with rope management they can become a huge mess. I'd hate to untangle 70's, especially if they get frozen. Rarely have I wished I'd had 70's. I'm mostly climbing up to WI4, when feeling strong 4+.

Ive never felt limited by 60's but ive been glad a couple times that my wife accidentally bought 70's

Jeff J wrote:There is no need to be packing an extra 10 meters of rope (x2 for doubles) if you do not need to.

This. if YOU foresee a legitimate benefit/use for 70s in the areas YOU like/plan to use these ropes, then go for the 70s. otherwise 60s are cheaper, lighter, less rope to manage at belays, etc.

I am happy with my 60m half/twins. only a few times have I wished I had 70s

70m is nice for ice climbing! apart from that, 60m will do everything on the east coast, even though the 70 may save you a rap once in a while.

And 70m, that can take a lot of pro depending on the difficulty your getting into. So you'd bring more gear or do more run-outs if you wanted to use up the whole length.

Depends also on your partner(s), I had one that would regularly create these massive clusterfucks with 60m, I'd be afraid to add an extra 20m of spaghetti in there...

I dont think I have ever climbed a route in my life that absolutely required double 70s to rap unless it was some mostly uncharted, rarely climbed route with no boltes anchors. If a route has 240' between anchors and it's actually climbed often, eventually someone is going to retrobolt it (and rightfully so).

I would go with the double 60s for sure. Double 70s is totally unnecessary unless you link pitches together all the time, and even then 60m can link a lot of stuff. Also, if your sole purpose in double ropes is full length raps, consider a light single and a tag line. For example, double 70 8.0s are about 5,740g total and probably around $600 MSRP. A single 60m 9.4 is about 3,200g, you can have the second carry the 6mm tag, and you'll spend maybe $400 MSRP. Half the weight and almost half the cost.

I ended up with double 70s just because they were on sale/cheaper than 60m ropes at the time.

Although I have never needed the extra length, it has let me link some pitches at Whitehorse that could not be linked with 60s and also combine some raps that were probably bolted with a single 50 in mind.

At Poke-O-Moonshine in the Dacks, the central rappel route is 2 full 70 meter raps. If you have 2x60 you need to do 4 raps. A single 70 takes 6 raps.

Double 70's are amazing for ice but for rock it really depends where you climb.

Double 60's will get you up and down anything. Most of the time you're just going to have a pile of left-over rope to tangle, as well as the extra weight of not only the ropes themselves but the larger rack you'll need if you are really going to run together long pitches. (And if you aren't going to link pitches, why on earth would you have 70m doubles?)

I might add that extra-long pitches frequently put the leader and second out of communication, which can slow things down a lot if something arises that requires discussion, but which is also, at least for me, a lot less fun.

Don, do not have the time to read all the above, but see you posted within the past 24hrs...so will offer some advice in case it is not covered. I am a full time climber and the only pair of 70's I have ever owned were twins for ice routes in the Canadian Rockies. . In the lower 48 I have two single 70m ropes and one pair of double 60's that can be used as twins (7.9) as well. One of those 70's is also rated as a single, double and twin (8.9). These rope configurations give me maximum flexibility depending on taking two folks up, grade V climbs, double rope descents, etc. I really do not see the need whatsoever for double 70's outside of the big ice climbs north of the border...for 99.9% of all climbers. Good Luck.