Packs

What is the best pack for climbing. I need a pack in the 30L ranges that can be used for everything but mainly trad and sport. Needs to be durable obviously have lots of places to lash things on and be strippable.

Cilogear

Cold Cold World
coldcoldworldpacks.com
Handmade in USA
Reasonable Price
Bomber
(I own a few)

Patagonia Ascentionist 35 (weight, simplicity, functionality)

IMO
Hyperlite: too expensive
Cilogear: too expensive, I don't get the strap system
CCW: no experience w/ these, don't they come in heavy?
Arcteryx FL: too expensive, not enough lash options
Wild Things: wish I had one to test, think its too small for me 26L

mmm what else?
Dane probably has some good shit to say:
coldthistle.blogspot.com/20…

+1 for CCW. My Valdez is bomber, and not really any heavier than other comparable options. It's pretty comfortable and at 40L has plenty of space for just about any kind of mission I could go on.

yukonjack wrote:Cold Cold World coldcoldworldpacks.com Handmade in USA Reasonable Price Bomber (I own a few)

No doubt,,really good stuff.

Check out Mountainsmith from Colorado. Their new line looks pretty sweet, particularly the Approach for climbing.

I've been really pleased with my CCW Ozone. I had Randy do some modifications-rope strap, overflow collar, and extendable/removable lid. So far it's holding up to the Vedauwoo granite and it carries well. It gets a little less comfortable when over stuffed, but that's to be expected. I occasionally wish it were a tad bigger, but that's only the case if I'm packing big cams.

The Cilo strap system works well and the packs strip down well but the suspension isn't for everyone. I like a few more pockets on my packs too. If you want a simple tube and aren't going to carry more than ~20 pounds in it then the 30:30 looks like a decent pack. Get it in the GS (guide service) addition if you're rough on stuff.

Andrew Blease wrote:+1 for CCW. My Valdez is bomber, and not really any heavier than other comparable options. It's pretty comfortable and at 40L has plenty of space for just about any kind of mission I could go on.

Another +1 for CCW. The Chaos a.k.a. Load Monster is much lighter than other 65L+ packs I have tried, and carries ~50lbs much better than my (heavier, smaller) Osprey 52L pack I've been using for a while. Good fit is key, though; since the CCW packs are frameless, if you get the back size wrong you're even more hosed than you are with frame packs. So measure your back correctly when Randy asks for it!

Another note: the ski straps/holsters are designed with conservative ski mountaineering/touring skis in mind, i.e. they are probably too short to accommodate modern fat backcountry skis. If have skis with tails fatter than ~110mm, you might want Randy to sew some longer straps. This will not be a problem for most people.

How is the suspension on the Valdez, Andrew? I have been thinking about getting one for winter day climbs, but I should probably sell a few packs first....

+1 for CCW. I have the Chernobyl and the Ozone. Love them both.

Another +1 for Randy and CCW. My crag pack is an Ozone, my ice pack is a Valdez with tool holder mods and for long days out / overnight it's a Chernobyl. They're all great, totally functional with what's neede and bomber.

Seems to be a regular question.
Somewhere a month ago this topic was
Covered in depth. There are so many choices.
If you are like so many of us
and like to up grade every few years,
almost any pack will do. If your looking for longevity ?

STAY AWAY FROM BLACK DIAMOND/ Patagucci is better

Then will you be hauling ? Or carrying for days?
Or just car camping cragging
twenty miles there and back tops?

Get the cheapest best used pack
Then up grade,
4 days ago C,C,W, Chernobyl sold in a few hours

From the MP forsale thread, For $105 shipped! U
I missed that.

To be clear I bought a BD Stone 45
, brand new, with tags, second hand, just over $100
the thing is weak!
Nothing on the pack is full strength.
Black Diamond packs once were great I was replacing a 30 year old Son Of Crag.
The Stone 45 , and the smaller Acentionist. ! the tube Creek 50L. All have
Glaring deficiencies.
Some so seriously weak that they will not hold up to weekends at the Gunks,
Never mind anything more real. I am talking grab loops and tool loops and shoulder harness attachment points. Seams that will wear out fast and fill with dirt .

Buy used

There are only a few companies making forever packs.
Small firms that stand behind the products they sell.

Black Diamond is NOT one of these -
BD has a very weak warranty only one year and only original owner ?
The pack that I have from thirty years ago, from BD, the Son Of Crag, is still bomber,
so I bought a new Stone 45 Rope Bag -
the pack has only very weak (only cosmetic ?)tool loops

and the grab straps are so weak that they are criminally negligent.

Ribbons of rolled three mil and barely stitched there is no full strength anything to clip the pack into.

My world is not all flat sandy approaches. While I like the idea of no straps to get caught in branches I can not trust this pos to last one good tug on the shoe string grab loop and I can see the pack back at the bottom of the cone.
The idea of a zipper to get to the bottom of the pack should get you to the bottom of the pack
No storm flap protecting the zipper? That is weak sauce too over time gear and rough trails and rocks will make that zipper leak.
The pack is not double walled but it is still a bit on the heavy side.
I called Black diamond to ask about the pack that was listed as "the Stone45 Rope bag! And was told it was not meant as a climbing pack ?! I blew my top yours truly can unleash and I did .
The result was I was blocked from leaving a review of the pack and a week later the "Rope Bag"
Description was erased from the black diamond description, it is still described that way at some web sites.

As I said the size is good but the pack is weak and in no way up to the old black diamond old reputation.

If you want one pack that you can count on there are three or four companies
I have spoken with or have used/owned and so can recommend:

1. TOE
toegear.com/TECHNICAL%20PAC…

2. Cold Cold World
coldcoldworldpacks.com

3. FISH (Atom Smasher Deluxe w/pocket)
fishproducts.com/catalog/ha…

4. Mountain Tools
mtntools.com/cat/mt/packs/1…

5. Metolius
metoliusclimbing.com/packs-…

All of these are reasonably priced.
I think that they are All made in the US .
All burly as hell - unless ordered in specialty lightweight fabrics,
for alpinism etc.

These are top quality no-bullshit designs made by climbers, for climbers.

Both Randy Raykliff of CCW, and TOE to a greater extent, will make you a custom sack.
Tuttle knows what he's doing .

I mean, seriously. Look at what you can get for under $150:

Crag:
toegear.com/CLIMBING.html
coldcoldworldpacks.com/ozon…

Alpine:
toegear.com/LOGAN%20PACK.html
coldcoldworldpacks.com/vald…

FISH products!
The Atom smasher deluxe - with a an extra pocket - the thing will out live you if you never haul it but it is a mini haul bag and meant to be hauled and will survive walls for ten years and hundreds of miles.

The three packs that Cold Cold World - turns out the best life time warranty and a custom shop.
They and

Mystery Ranch
( original Dana of Dana designs bomb pack )will make a pack with your choice of extras.

Then from Texas :
Range Ready

Also the classic Alpinist is still made by WILD THINGS but you have to look in the military or tactical
Department. So it is big $$, I think,

Yeah I'm pack obsessed!

I also bought a used DOLT pack from a vintage gear sight.
A totally soft bag that has a thin removable Ensolite type back pad to sit on It is bigger than the BD Stone 45, which is to bad because I had hoped to use it as a stuff sac to protect the zipper from my gear and hopefully delay the zipper from leaking. It is the exact same design as the muira 45L by Arc'Teryx; a full zipper clam shell. . . .but lighter weight and 40 years old !
The thing is mint and cost 12 bucks, shipping included.

The lack of a double lining and a fully Velcro lined storm flap protecting the zipper like a 20 yr old North Face that is the exact same design - single layer but with an exterior storm flap, that goes to the bottom of the pack and stops stuff from oozing spilling out makes it superior to the BD ST 45.

50L for alpine flexibility and for the new longer ropes plus food first aid kit, a head lamp liquids, and layers, even a bivy sac if the top expands. The ability if not the need to take everything every time you go out is a nice thing to grow out of as you get your kit dialed in you can start to pack less, and have the room to spare.
full strength loops and grab straps, removable useable back supports that allow one to strip the pack down in weight and size ( a removable top pocket that the BD does have)
Fully lined with a bright interior to help see the contents in low light.

All things that are found on many older packs.
This generation of packs seems to be about churning New climbers.
Leading you with flashy marketing to buy a two year pack.
The term Planned obsolescence, the built-in, low quality that will make you spend more money.

Ranting

yes

but I have never been so disappointed in a pack made by a climbing company.
That has had a reputation of high quality service and performance.

I am still trying to make it work but was told it is not a "climbing pack" by black diamond.

While I'm sure all your black diamond packs - the duffel and. . . .there are others
the BD company makes a lot of packs!
The Creek 50 hybrid haul bag ? that has no compression straps on the sides?,
These back packs look good in the flashy video
but suck at the crag compared to all of the other choices.
In my opinion. (I have been climbing from the age of four! Almost 40 years )
I did not want or need a FISH ATOM SMASHER DELUXE . . .
and was going with THE name brand .
what I thought was top of the line under 2 bills.
but I was so wrong that it has me going to extremes.
I have a company that will do after market work for $$ so in a few months, when I need an alpine sized pack, I hope to have the BD Stone 45 fixed with a full strength grab loop -
TOOL TUBES that sinch down to reduce wear from sharp tools
and crampon patches on the hood and between the tubes, all that and an interior Velcro lined three inch wide storm flap (although the zipper only goes 3/4 of the needed length) will cost what a pack from Fish or Cold Cold World would .

There you go! Good luck!

BD speed 30, Mammut Trion Guide 30. Both bags are awesome, work for everything.

Mystery Ranch

BANG!
Ther yo have it !
Thank you for that link !

Michael, MR's stuff are great, just a bit too pricey for most people.

Bang wrote:Michael, MR's stuff are great, just a bit too pricey for most people.

I use to work at Mystery Ranch and I made myself a X-17 and X-40 off some prototype patterns with a few changes.

They're stuff is absolutely bomber and will last you forever.

IMO the X-17 is too stiff as a leader pack but certainly carries well.

If you're looking to do long approaches with a load the X-40 is absolutely brilliant. The MR Futura harnessing is the best out there for the approach in. The X-40 doesn't compress as well as I'd like but it climbs just as well as any other 40L climbing pack. Loads super easily and is versatile from Rock to Ice.

+1 for MR and +1 on the X-40

Josh Kornish wrote: I use to work at Mystery Ranch and I made myself a X-17 and X-40 off some prototype patterns with a few changes. They're stuff is absolutely bomber and will last you forever. IMO the X-17 is too stiff as a leader pack but certainly carries well. If you're looking to do long approaches with a load the X-40 is absolutely brilliant. The MR Futura harnessing is the best out there for the approach in. The X-40 doesn't compress as well as I'd like but it climbs just as well as any other 40L climbing pack. Loads super easily and is versatile from Rock to Ice. +1 for MR and +1 on the X-40

TOEGEAR??
Then I also had this wrong the Texas company is etsy.com/shop/RoamReadyTX

Roam Ready not Range ~ Bang ~ that's funny I caught my mistake, because of your avatar/name.

Josh thanx
And
Bang
, yes and they will do custom work!
Price is relative to many .
If you have NO income,
Then it is the deciding factor.
I love to get new used toys.
I have a collection that goes back to many years to admit.
Think Dolt. . .
I have a purple Karimore from the uk the Dugould Haston(spelling is not rite)
78L full strength everything -center zipper/Velcro'd Storm flapp
At 45+ years old it is still a champ!
But kids think it's. . . .?? . . . what ? To old?

I had hoped to get past my
OCD pack thing but. .. .

Piling on with CCW. I have three of them in various sizes/configurations and probably will be old and out of shape before any of them ever come even close to wearing out.

I'm a fan of my BD Speed 30 pack. You can pretty often find it for less than $100 online too, which is a nice bonus.