What routes in Eldo would get more traffic with one more bolt?
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Been out of the climbing scene for awhile but have a few new projects in mind. Was reading the Stewart Green Climbing in Colorado Book and the Rossiter books and many of the classic climbs in Eldo have an S rating. |
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None needed on any mentioned. Regarding Yellow Traverse: Diffraction is a better pitch into Metamorphosis and protects fine. Metamorphosis is run out but a safe fall-I've caught a 20 footer with the second bolt as the last piece. |
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Time to arouse the nay sayers...Sidewall, Aerospace, Rain, Cest La Vie..but in keeping with tradition, you'll have to forgo those bolts and pucker up! |
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In the case of C'est la Vie the Action Committee made it very clear that this was not a standard decision in any sense. |
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I think the beauty of Eldo is that you can escape the masses by getting on routes that are runout. |
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In doing more research, the runout on the anthill is probably similar to the other runouts on the upper walls. Also, I didn't think about the idea of following most of these routes first because it always seems like I am (or was in the day) the one dragging someone else up them first. |
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The ACE website, specifically section 3.8 on what goes into approving routes and bolts is actually very interesting. |
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David Harrison 1 wrote:The ACE website, specifically section 3.8 on what goes into approving routes and bolts is actually very interesting...And section 3.8 is explicitly about approval of bolts on new routes. What you are talking about (fixed hardware on established routes) is dealt with in sections 3.2 to 3.7. |
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I'm a total wimp when it comes to runouts. I've done many of those "unsafe" climbs on your list, and felt totally fine. What you need to do is get really good at placing gear, including really small gear. Then again, there are plenty of routes at Eldo that I just wouldn't do, and that's fine. |
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Guy H. wrote:I think the beauty of Eldo is that you can escape the masses by getting on routes that are runout.I agree. I'm not crazy anti-bolt, or anti-retro-bolting. But there is so much climbing in the front range where people don't have to run it out. nevertheless, I'm curious what routes people suggest for one more bolt. |
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GabeO wrote:But to throw a little gas on the fire just for fun, if I were to add a bolt, it would be on the original finish of Yellow Spur. I've done that a couple of times, and every time it scares the pants off me. The easiest sequence I can ever find is a very insecure 5.9+ type thing involving tiny crystals and balance, about 25 feet out from the last piece. GODo you refer to the 5.8 Robbins Traverse? There is actually great footholds. Try it again and focus on your feet. Keep telling yourself this has been done in hiking boots. If there was a bolt on the first pitch of the Dub Griffith I would lead it but since there is no bolt on it, I simply won't do it at this point. Not every route has to be within my ability. Not every route has to be safe. |
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S rated routes in the older guide books are not so much so today. |
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Moritz B. wrote: If there was a bolt on the first pitch of the Dub Griffith I would lead it but since there is no bolt on it, I simply won't do it at this point. Not every route has to be within my ability. Not every route has to be safe.Wait a minute.... There is a bolt on the first pitch of the DG. You clip it just before traversing right. |
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Moritz B. wrote: Do you refer to the 5.8 Robbins Traverse? There is actually great footholds. Try it again and focus on your feet. Keep telling yourself this has been done in hiking boots.Yes there are great footholds - the traverse is fine - probably 5.6 - 5.7 IIRC. But then you need to move up to get to the seam above, and the only way I've ever found to do so is with nasty little smeary crystals. GO |
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10-12 climbs in Eldo is just barely scratching the surface of what's out there. There are plenty of G and PG climbs if that's what you're looking for on any given day. I will also say that I've done some of the climbs you mentioned and not felt they were unsafe or needed bolts, and I'm not what anyone would consider a bold risky climber. If you're just going off guidebook ratings, I would second the suggestion to make sure you are looking at the most current guidebook. ACE has a pretty conservative yet rational process for approving new bolts, and I think it works well. It's nice to have a variety of grades in both difficulty and protection so you can choose your adventure on any given day. |
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When I first started trad climbing (not long ago at all) Eldo was the place I went more often than anywhere else. So when people with more experience made comments like "Eldo scares me." I couldn't understand. Now that I've climbed in other areas a bit more, I get why. But I think rather than put bolts in places people have done without for so long, it's better to just add bolts when fixed pins come up missing. If all the pins from the pin ladder on The Yellow Spur came out, it'd be a much more intimidating lead (and belay) unless the fixed pro were replaced. |
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You can give a protection rating on Mountain Project. When you rate the route, there is also a drop down menu for safety. |
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To sum it up: |
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Interesting question. Having climbed a fair amount in Eldo my thought was... "shit, for most of the routes I'd like to do one bolt really wouldn't make a difference in the grand scheme of the route." |
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Bolting routes down to a lower common denominator is an entirely flawed premise - raise yourself up, don't bring the climbs down - and there aren't a lot of routes originally done with a bunch of pins which are no longer there today. If anything, the older routes as originally put up were a bit burlier due to having all been done on passive pro before cams hit the scene. |
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Healyje wrote:Maybe more what's needed is a first 'National Cam-less Weekend' to lend some real insight into those old classics which are often taken for granted these days.This is going off on a bit of a tangent, but since the original issue has been dealt with forward backwards and sideways, I suppose I don't mind chiming in. I love doing routes on all passive gear as an added challenge. Truth be told, I'll almost always reach for a nut before a cam, if I think I can use it. I recently met a couple who seemed to treat passive pro as "specialty gear" that they only bring up climbs if they know in advance that a key placement requires it. And I'm talking about in the Northeast, not the desert southwest. It's bizarre. Then again, they may not be the only ones. There was this guy who posted to ask about what cams he needed to lead a popular short finger crack. He seemed incredulous that it might be possible to use nuts. GO |