unexpected foot move for barn-dooring
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I was working on a 5.11 route a couple of days ago, and ran into a problem with swinging off sideways -- Then my partner gave me a non-intuitive move for preventing it. |
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kenr wrote:I was working on a 5.11 route a couple of days ago, and ran into a problem with swinging off sideways -- Then my partner gave me a non-intuitive move for preventing it. So now I'm wondering if there's a special name for this foot move. And what other situations I should be thinking about using it for. How it happened ... Slightly overhanging. Start with my left hand low on a positive diagonal undercling. Reach my right hand way up + out diagonally to a positive hold. Next step my left foot up to a higher foothold, but about 12 inches to the Right of my right foot. So I stepped my left leg across in front of my right leg -- with the outside edge of my left foot onto the higher foothold (which is the obvious easy way). Next I needed to reach high with my left hand, so I released the undercling -- and immediately swung off, falling to my right. Tried it again, trying to keep my body as quiet and close to the rock as I could -- and unmistakably barn-doored off again. Not even close to holding in balance. My partner said: "Oh you need to use your _inside_ edge on that foothold." Since I'm not a ballet dancer, I did not have the flexibility to simply just do that. The closest I could get was to place the tip of my left foot on the hold, pointing straight in. Then as I released my left hand, I pivoted my left foot so the heel rotated toward the right side, so then the inside edge on the foothold. Remarkably I was now easily in balance, and successfully made the high reach with my left hand. Not a hint of barn-door swing. Unexpected because it's such a strange way to step across. Unexpected because just changing the direction of my foot made such a big obvious difference for balance against swinging off barn-door. Unexpected because I had been told by lots of good sources (and so I've practiced it lots and lots) that to get better balance for reaching up with my left hand, I should be stepping on the outside edge of my left foot. Is there a special name for this "step up across and pivot onto inside edge" move? Why does it work? How do I know when I should consider using it? KenA picture would help. I think what you are doing is called "pulling with your toes." |
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So, when you step across, what did you do with your right foot? Keep it on the hold or flag point to the right? |
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photos ... |
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My guess is that the route wasn't standard overhang. There was some type of bulge preventing a traditional step and flag from working and keeping your body tight. Opening your foot allowed you to use compression to stay tight around the bulge. (Could be some other shape than a bulge.) |
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Looks like an inside flag. Which I honestly can't say that I use all that often. Inside flags seem to work in situations where you are almost fully extended on the leg that's on the foothold... but there are always exceptions. |
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Definitely done that a few times on steep routes. Not a common move, but certainly in the book of tricks! |
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................How do I know when I should consider using it? Ken |
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Just flagging, but flagging backward across your leg. Do it all the time not but never heard of a special name for it. |
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ViperScale wrote:Just flagging, but flagging backward across your leg. Do it all the time not but never heard of a special name for it. I think I have used it alot more doing boulder problems than on normal rope route though. I know of a few V5-V6 problems that it is used including a toe hook going behind the leg.Unusual flagging but still flagging, not an inside flag either. A subtle shift of your weight to the left. Very likely not a steep overhang, a move left around a bulge or arête, perhaps? I have done this on roped climbs, including a toe hook/scum with the right foot, as ViperScale mentioned. Definitely subtle and not good enough to think of it and pull it off during onsight. Edit to add: instead of flagging your right leg behind your left (and possibly creating a nasty rope sandwiched between legs situation on lead), is it perhaps possible to do a heel hook with your right to create a three point in contact situation? |
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Thanks for the pictures, very helpful.. |
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It's amazing how minor body positioning can make such a huge difference. There have been several times when I've found rotating my foot or moving it a few inches in one direction unlocks a move. |
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S. Neoh wrote: Unusual flagging but still flagging, not an inside flag either.Correct, the black pants confused me. Couldn't clearly see the position of the flagged leg. |
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kenr wrote:Unexpected because I had been told by lots of good sources (and so I've practiced it lots and lots) that to get better balance for reaching up with my left hand, I should be stepping on the outside edge of my left foot.Thats not always true. It depends on a lot of factors, one of which is body position. To me, what you have sounds like more of a balance issue than any specific technique issue. According to your description, the whole problem should be solved if you simply do a normal flag with your right foot (flagging it to the right). Picture of the actual route would help. Looking at the picture you posted, it does not look like youre stable. If you analysis your body position by drawing a triangle between your right hand and both feet, your center of gravity (generally centered in the hip area) falls outside of that triangle. Thats an unstable position. Youre doing a reversed outside flag (flagging the right leg behind your left leg), which doesnt make sense in this position (right hand on, left foot on the inside edge, reaching with the left hand). It looks extremely awkward and unbalanced to me. A normal flag would put your body in a much more balanced position whether you use the inside edge or your outside edge. Thats why an actual picture of the route may help in looking at it, maybe its just a really weird move. In general, you use the outside edge (backstep and dropknee) not because you get better balance, but because it is more energy efficient. Your balance depends on the relationship between your center of gravity and the triangle (or line) formed by your points of contact. Outside edge is usually used in conjunction with twist lock, allow you to pull minimally with your arm while reaching with your other hand. Inside edge is usually used in conjunction with lock-offs (in your picture example, your right arm is locked-off), which is more strenuous and best avoided if possible. BUT lock-off does allow you to keep your body closer to the rock (because your shoulders, chest, and hip are square to the wall), while twist-locking bring your center of gravity just a couple of inches away from the rock by the turning of the body. The angle of your hand also changes subtly, with lock-offs you can keep your wrist closer to the wall, while in a twist-lock your wrist has to be a little further from the wall to accommodate the width of your body. This subtle change in the center of gravity and wrist angle can make a huge difference when the hold is really small, or when the move is really balancy. But in your case, since you said the right hand hold is really positive, I think your balance is off, otherwise you wouldnt swing off from the outside edge. Check out Neil's video for more on inside edge, outside edge, normal flags and reverse flags. youtube.com/watch?v=Usee0F_… |