Best climbing and Ski Touring Pack?

As I am getting increasingly involved in both multipitch rock and alpine climbing while also getting into backcountry skiing, I was wondering if anyone knew of a pack compact enough to use while climbing but also sturdy enough to carry skis and avy gear.
Thanks,
Luke

I like the Deuter Guide. Couple different sizes to choose from

There is no perfect pack, only a compromise between the features you want and the features that are available.

Most good alpine packs are OK at skimo. However, don't underestimate the importance and convenience of back-panel access - especially on an A-frame only pack. Removing skis and digging down the bottom of a top-loader on a steep snow slope != fun.

Most great ski packs are heavy and bulky with limited ice tool carry options and poor gear carrying options but are great for skiing.

With that said, the Gregory Targhee looks like it may fire on most cylinders although I've heard the diagonal carry system is terrible. IMO Black Diamond packs (in general) have been disappointing.

Cilo Gear also makes a pretty spiffy looking skimo pack, but for the same price you could get a dedicated alpine pack AND a dedicated skimo pack, both of which hit all the requirements.

Like NickO, I have one of these and I like it. I've used it for Alpine and Skimo (multi-day) - but never on a multi-pitch climb, it's too big for that. I tend to go light on multi-pitch rock climbs. The pack is great if you're doing a three-day backpacking trip which has a single day alpine climb involved, as you can double duty it for both backpacking and the climb, if you go light, and then you won't have to carry an extra day-pay (like the one below).

So, I agree, you'll need two packs. I continue to use this for my multi-pitch climbs, it's also excellent for single day alpine routes car-to-car.

Both of these packs have what I would consider to be core requirements:

1 - Comfortable (I don't even know I have Deuter on)
2 - Top removable lid.
3 - Extendable bivi sleeve.
4 - Straps for 2 axes, and crampons (plus multple ski-carry options for the Deuter)
5 - Back panel access (ski-pack only).
6 - Removable sitting pad.
7 - Side compression/carry straps.
8 - Tough.

People seem to like the Osprey Kode series quite a bit

One of my climbing partners has the Osprey Mutant 28. It looks pretty nice as a single pack that could cross into both worlds. I would use it as a cragging pack, alpine pack, and skimo/backcountry ski pack, but as others have said would look for something lighter and smaller for multipitch sunny day style trad climbing.

The Camp X3 Backdoor looked interesting as well.

I have a Cilo 40B Worksack and the Cilo Shovel Pocket attachment. With that setup, I feel I have a good option for everything from cragging (brain, framesheet, and hipbelt removed) all the way through multi-day mountaineering (great ax and crampon carry, plenty of room with brain and extendable collar, framesheet for support depending on weight) with and without skis (solid A-frame carry with shovel and probe in pocket).

There is none.

Yes, there are many packs that CAN be used for both but there are virtually always compromises.

For me, a separate avy tools compartment is absolutely mandatory on any ski pack. That means virtually all packs designed for climbing are out. Backpanel access, helmet carry, goggle pocket, and diagonal ski carry are all very useful features that I use nearly every time I tour.

For climbing, top loading, with a strap to carry a rope are usually my main requirements. Add ice axe loops to the list for alpine climbing (most ski packs do have this).

If I had to pick only one pack for both, it would be the Mammut Spindrift Guide. It's heavy and unnecessarily complex for climbing but does have nearly all the features I want for both sports. For two packs, I like a Mammut Nirvana Pro (I carry the airbag version, personally) and an Osprey Variant. YMMV.

That's going to be a tough order, but I think there are some Mammut Packs up to the task. I used the 35L Spindrift for skiing, but never climbed with it. Seems like it would work okay. On the flip side, I have a 28L Mammut Trion Light I got for climbing, that can carry skis. I would not recommend this, however, as the pack definitely sacrifices some durability for weight.

I went to a Mammut Pro RAS 35L for skiing and I am very happy with it. I am currently searching for a durable alpine pack myself. I am thinking CiloGear. Their packs have a good reputation and look like they can carry skis and climb well.

I'd take a look at Mammut and CiloGear.

Much thanks to everybody, it was a shot in the dark for one pack to do it all but I appreciate all of the options I now have.

I agree with what has been posted that a good alpine climbing pack and a good ski touring pack have features that are a bit mutually exclusive. In my climbing packs I prefer things to be simple, give me a big tube with a pull closure at the top.

For my touring pack I want a separate organized compartment for my avy tools, if I ever need them I need to be able to get to them FAST. It's also nice to have this as a wet pocket if I happen to dig a snow pit and for storing skins. I used the first generation Osprey kode packs for 5 years and really liked them. Last year I switched to a dead bird quintic and found it carried so well it's not noticeable riding and had better organization/layout. Of course it's also expensive at retail, but not quite as crazy as some of their prices.

I have used my climbing packs (BD speed series) for overnight and multi-day tours and with the narrow and taller bodies they don't carry as well riding/skiing, tending to put more weight up high. If you're doing laps at all the lack of organization is actually pretty annoying. Good luck keeping a down coat dry with your skins in there. Usually if I'm doing an overnight trip it is for one long objective though, so I just use a climbing pack still.

BD Avalung packs are good ski packs. I have the Anthem Avalung which has a diagonal ski carry not A-frame, one ice tool loop, a helmet strap, top and back panel access, a second large compartment(top access only), and full hight compression cords. the only reason I don't use it for multipitch climbing is that the Avalung is not easily removable. I like the "swing arm" cable connecting the shoulder straps so the straps don't interfere with your range of motion, and think it would be a good climbing pack if it didn't have an Avalung.

my do all pack is the Cilo Gear 30L Worksack . It's great for everything. Overall it lacks a little bit of structure for carrying skis A-frame style, but I get along just fine anyways.

Highly recommended it as I climb 100+ days a year, and ski tour 50-60 days a year in the Wasatch. My pack is 4 years old, and crushing it.

Another vote for CiloGear ; bulletproof build, avi gear neatly packs in, great for rock climbing, and you are supporting a young independent company with great customer service. Takes a few weeks to make a pack, but worth it.

I was lucky enough to get a Wookey Couloir pack while they were still being made... in the US of A no less. See if you can find one on Ebay etc. You will not be disappointed. Cheers, Glen

Checkout the gregory alpinisto 35L. I recently started using this pack and like it a lot for rock, ice and skiing.
Note that the ski straps on the bottom do not fit wide skis. Only small tails like smaller mid waist skis.

I've been really happy with my Deuter Guide Lite 32 the last 2 seasons. A few minor places to improve (lower compression straps, removable brain, crampon patch, rope strap, better ice tool buckle access) but those are just quibbles - the thing is just about perfect.

Deuter Guide Lite 32+ is amazing. I don't use it for skiing but it has stood up to abuse 2-3 times a week for the last two years, including everything from trad cragging to alpine ice routes. After all I've put it through, it still has no signs of wear except for some dirt.

Alpine Threadworks Selkirk, regular or light.

This applies:
Buy used

There are only a few companies making forever packs.
Small firms that stand behind the products they sell.

Black Diamond is NOT one of these -
BD has a very weak warranty only one year and only original owner ?
The pack that I have from thirty years ago, from BD, the Son Of Crag, is still bomber,
so I bought a new Stone 45 Rope Bag -
the pack has only very weak (only cosmetic ?)tool loops

and the grab straps are so weak that they are criminally negligent.

Ribbons of rolled three mil and barely stitched there is no full strength anything to clip the pack into.

My world is not all flat sandy approaches. While I like the idea of no straps to get caught in branches I can not trust this pos to last one good tug on the shoe string grab loop and I can see the pack back at the bottom of the cone.
The idea of a zipper to get to the bottom of the pack should get you to the bottom of the pack
No storm flap protecting the zipper? That is weak sauce too over time gear and rough trails and rocks will make that zipper leak.
The pack is not double walled but it is still a bit on the heavy side.
I called Black diamond to ask about the pack that was listed as "the Stone45 Rope bag! And was told it was not meant as a climbing pack ?! I blew my top yours truly can unleash and I did .
The result was I was blocked from leaving a review of the pack and a week later the "Rope Bag"
Description was erased from the black diamond description, it is still described that way at some web sites.

As I said the size is good but the pack is weak and in no way up to the old black diamond old reputation.

If you want one pack that you can count on there are three or four companies
I have spoken with or have used/owned and so can recommend:

1. TOE
toegear.com/TECHNICAL%20PAC…

2. Cold Cold World
coldcoldworldpacks.com

3. FISH (Atom Smasher Deluxe w/pocket)
fishproducts.com/catalog/ha…

4. Mountain Tools
mtntools.com/cat/mt/packs/1…

5. Metolius
metoliusclimbing.com/packs-…

All of these are reasonably priced.
I think that they are All made in the US .
All burly as hell - unless ordered in specialty lightweight fabrics,
for alpinism etc.

These are top quality no-bullshit designs made by climbers, for climbers.

Both Randy Raykliff of CCW, and TOE to a greater extent, will make you a custom sack.
Tuttle knows what he's doing .

I mean, seriously. Look at what you can get for under $150:

Crag:
toegear.com/CLIMBING.html
coldcoldworldpacks.com/ozon…

Alpine:
toegear.com/LOGAN%20PACK.html
coldcoldworldpacks.com/vald…

FISH products!
The Atom smasher deluxe - with a an extra pocket - the thing will out live you if you never haul it but it is a mini haul bag and meant to be hauled and will survive walls for ten years and hundreds of miles.

The three packs that Cold Cold World - turns out the best life time warranty and a custom shop.
They and

Mystery Ranch
( original Dana of Dana designs bomb pack )will make a pack with your choice of extras.

Then from Texas :
Range Ready

Also the classic Alpinist is still made by WILD THINGS but you have to look in the military or tactical
Department. So it is big $$, I think,

Yeah I'm pack obsessed!

I also bought a used DOLT pack from a vintage gear sight.
A totally soft bag that has a thin removable Ensolite type back pad to sit on It is bigger than the BD Stone 45, which is to bad because I had hoped to use it as a stuff sac to protect the zipper from my gear and hopefully delay the zipper from leaking. It is the exact same design as the muira 45L by Arc'Teryx; a full zipper clam shell. . . .but lighter weight and 40 years old !
The thing is mint and cost 12 bucks, shipping included.

The lack of a double lining and a fully Velcro lined storm flap protecting the zipper like a 20 yr old North Face that is the exact same design - single layer but with an exterior storm flap, that goes to the bottom of the pack and stops stuff from oozing spilling out makes it superior to the BD ST 45.

50L for alpine flexibility and for the new longer ropes plus food first aid kit, a head lamp liquids, and layers, even a bivy sac if the top expands. The ability if not the need to take everything every time you go out is a nice thing to grow out of as you get your kit dialed in you can start to pack less, and have the room to spare.
full strength loops and grab straps, removable useable back supports that allow one to strip the pack down in weight and size ( a removable top pocket that the BD does have)
Fully lined with a bright interior to help see the contents in low light.

All things that are found on many older packs.
This generation of packs seems to be about churning New climbers.
Leading you with flashy marketing to buy a two year pack.
The term Planned obsolescence, the built-in, low quality that will make you spend more money.

Ranting

yes

but I have never been so disappointed in a pack made by a climbing company.
That has had a reputation of high quality service and performance.

I am still trying to make it work but was told it is not a "climbing pack" by black diamond.

While I'm sure all your black diamond packs - the duffel and. . . .there are others
the BD company makes a lot of packs!
The Creek 50 hybrid haul bag ? that has no compression straps on the sides?,
These back packs look good in the flashy video
but suck at the crag compared to all of the other choices.
In my opinion. (I have been climbing from the age of four! Almost 40 years )
I did not want or need a FISH ATOM SMASHER DELUXE . . .
and was going with THE name brand .
what I thought was top of the line under 2 bills.
but I was so wrong that it has me going to extremes.
I have a company that will do after market work for $$ so in a few months, when I need an alpine sized pack, I hope to have the BD Stone 45 fixed with a full strength grab loop -
TOOL TUBES that sinch down to reduce wear from sharp tools
and crampon patches on the hood and between the tubes, all that and an interior Velcro lined three inch wide storm flap (although the zipper only goes 3/4 of the needed length) will cost what a pack from Fish or Cold Cold World would .