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Multi-pitch anchor and belay methods

Original Post
lukeweiss · · St. Johnsbury, VT · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 30

I was studying up on multi-pitch methods and looking for cool ice routes for next season, and I came upon this video of Roaring Brook Falls:
youtube.com/watch?v=XF3MBt8…

Aside from the route looking awesome, and the filming providing ridiculously good beta, it raised a few questions, which I now pass onward to the collective wisdom of the MP 'verse.

The first belay station seemed tenuous to me. The leader was belaying off his harness and it looked like breaking would be really difficult in case of a fall by his follower. Maybe it is perfectly solid, which is why I am asking.
Was this a tenuous setup?
Is there no good place to set up a higher anchor to belay off of with a reverso/Guide style ATC?

Second - what about the belay by the other team? What is going on there? Looks sketchy to me. (I only ask because I am trying to learn here! I am equally happy with learning either that it is sketchy or it isn't)

Lastly, those leashes...

Luc-514 · · Montreal, QC · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 12,536

You're on flat ground for the first belay, basically a pool where you'll have to walk 20 feet to the next "angled" ice.
1. you have the choice to stick a couple screws in the ice, girth hitch your rope(s) to them and belay off your harness or
2. Just behind the leader when he sits down is this large boulder, walk around, figure 8 or butterfly the rope to your tie-in loop and belay off your harness.

Last time I just stuck both tools in the ice, tied into them, sat down with my crampons in the ice and just body belayed my second.

The top of the second pitch is the fun part, especially when the ice is thin. the belay on the second pitch is off of trees.

lukeweiss · · St. Johnsbury, VT · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 30

I guess this is where I am confused, if you setup a screw anchor back at the start of the next pitch, why not belay off the anchor?

Luc-514 · · Montreal, QC · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 12,536

A picture is worth 1000 words:

RBF
there's 20-30 feet of flat ground between both pitches.

Derek DeBruin · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 1,039

Both parties appear to be belaying directly off the waist. This is fine if the anchor they are attached to is secure and they maintain a brake hand. However, this is definitely an old school method of belaying that isn't often the best application on steep routes. (Not to mention in the case of the party doing the filming, it leads to a very cold butt, though that would likely be preferable to standing in this case as it would be more secure.)

When belaying with this method, you'll note that the braking plane is up and back. In other words, the hand pulls up toward the shoulder, and often the belayer leans back. The challenge is that it can be very awkward to belay this way and the braking plane change is typically underappreciated. I'd also be thinking about either stacking my rope on the same side as my brake hand or belaying left-handed.

If possible, I'd be looking for a place to build a belay where I could belay directly off the anchor. Much more comfortable.

I've never done this climb, so I'm not sure about communication issues or pitch length, but in general yes, you could build a 2-screw anchor at the base of the second pitch and just belay directly off the anchor from that location. The rope drag over the ice shouldn't be a problem as long as it's not too wet (if the second takes a long time the rope could freeze in place then). Alternately, you can belay some place near where they belayed in the video and then just move the belay for the start of pitch 2. Finally, you could build an anchor at the base of pitch 2 and extend the masterpoint to the lip at the top of pitch 1 if that helps communication and rope is available.

As for leashes, they're definitely not in style any more. Doesn't mean you can't use them.

nathanael · · Riverside, CA · Joined May 2011 · Points: 525

Belaying off your harness is fine, especially on easier ground where a fall is less likely. There is much less drag in the system so pulling up slack can be easier. To brake a fall you need to pull up instead of down, but it's not too difficult to stop the fall or hold someone as they hang on the rope. It's a convenient method when your anchor is low to the ground and you can sit on the ledge.

mailforwil · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2010 · Points: 0

Haha, Derek, I started shifting between your voice and Ron's in my head as I read your response, without even seeing your name by it for the first paragraph. All good points. Hope you're doing well out there buddy!

Wil

Brandonian · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2015 · Points: 35

There is a belay station at the top of the first pitch, its on the right bolted into the rock about chest high right at the edge of the step. The word I got was it was set up for a rescue that occured during the 2014 summer and still remains as of last spring.

Bill Kirby · · Keene New York · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 480

I use the tree off to the right immediately after the first steep bit. I split RBF into three pitches. The second pitch would be about 40 feet. There's always a line for the last pitch anyway.

Did anyone else notice the leader below the one with the Go Pro? Yikes! Didn't see anything wrong with the anchors. How you like this RBF anchor?

RBF anchor

Luc-514 · · Montreal, QC · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 12,536
Bill Kirby wrote: How you like this RBF anchor?
Looks bomber!
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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