Dirtbag existence vs. educated and employed

I would add that an education, career, etc. is where almost everyone (not including those who pass before their time) ends up, even the freest spirits. If not education or a conventional 9-5, they plug in somewhere, they got to serve somebody as the saying goes. Why is this? Did they suddenly just 'give up' on the lifestyle? No - the answer is simple. Money is agency, freedom if you will, in our culture. Eventually folks get tired of not having authority over their own lives, not having a world. People get weary of being marginalized just for an activity and they want to call the shots in how they live. That takes money, actually :/.

So - my vote is go for it since you're really young. But not to make it open ended. Have a hard stop date in a few years in which you go on to find a passion that earns a buck and is useful to others, even if it's not that lucrative or grandiose.

If you are so inclined , working in education is a good way to have a career and still have plenty of time to 'dirtbag' . As a third grade teacher I work 189 days a year , and will never ever work a Christmas, thanksgiving, or a day in July .

Dirt bagging is fun , but a gratifying career that contributes to the greater good of others is pretty nice ... How old are you BTW?

As a guy who just graduated with a degree in Civil Engineering, I'd say go to school where you can dirt on the weekends and breaks. Figure out what you're passionate about and try to make a career out of it. If you can't, find a place to live where you can carry out you're passionate about while supporting yourself.

I'll also bite in this one, as a recent Aerospace Engineering graduate. I decided to go ahead and take my time in college and do it in 6 years vs. 4 years. This allowed for more summer and winter trips.

I also decided I didn't want to leave the academic setting yet because of the free time it gives you over a standard "career." So I am currently working on my Master's now in an education-related field so that I can eventually teach and continue to enjoy the time off. I am not interested in sitting in a cubicle crunching numbers, nor do I care about making money either. (For the record I don't plan on even using my degree except for aiding me in the general context of trying to get any job if I need it.)

If I had to do it all over again, I'd do my best to take a break between high school and college for about a year to two years to travel, relax, figure things out, and work some. Figure out the best way to achieve a degree without taking on too much, if any, student loan debt. (FYI Higher level education is basically free in Germany and in other parts of Europe and most classes are taught In english too!) That way I didn't feel so pressured to try to finish as soon as possible originally.

It's all just shenanigans bro, but in the end future-you will thank present-you if you end up with a degree of some sort. I've noticed it just helps people (and maybe yourself?) respect you more as a person, which then usually makes it easier to get part-time work. The kicker here is find what drives you and something you are truly motivated about. That will make the academics go by a lot smoother and help you get over hurtles as you come to them, in respect to your education.

Cheers and best of luck!
Mac

Yeah I'll throw in my 2c.

Worked and studied as a civil engineer (oxymoron?) through uni and for a year after graduation then bailed.

Moved to Canada to climb, ski, hike, wait tables and wash windows and I've never been happier.

Having a career that makes a shit-ton of money is great, but I never had a spare minute to spend my hard earned cash. I could have invested and whatnot, but there's no little beeans in the near future to consider so I decided to experience new things with my coin.

BUT. I recommend getting that degree AND experience before deciding to leave your career. Every bloke and his dog has a degree these days, you need experience for a foot in the door in your later years.

I don't think it is an either/or question. Check out Fossana's posts...she seems to have done well doing both.

Also, as others have mentioned, a really good plan is to take time off after being accepted to the school of your choice by deferring enrollment for a year. You can do this between high school and college, as well as between undergrad and graduate school. This has all the upside of dirtbagging for a year without many of the uncertainty issues. Of course this might not work for you, but if you have the option, go this route...I wish I had.

Xam wrote:I don't think it is an either/or question.

I agree. I have a full time job, climb on real rock 100+ days a year, don't live near a world class destination, and take numerous trips a year.

Jake Jones wrote:Wear condoms, lest you have a baby Ried make your choice for you. The fact that you are even in a position to consider one alternative to the other underlines what a lucky young man you already are. Crank hard and be adventurous while you can but plan for a future when this is no longer a viable option. Making a career from a passion- especially this one, is the exception, not the rule.

Wow, the posts on this page are the distillate of some very well spoken and competent CLIMBERS!
It is almost intimidating to respond after them. All of the things that have been said here are valid.
Snark time,
Live hard die young,
Live long die hard.
Earn enough to have regrets
Or regret not earning more to
Have old age be comfortable.
Find a balance find a life, get on with it.
You never stop learning.
You do sadly stop climbing.
If you put $5 k away every two years in a good investment plan.
The result will be that balanced thing
As you age, Climbing,
Provides little by way of a sustainable life style,
There is some statement about diminished capacity
And the diminishing returns of the results of a life well lived but poorly planned.
It is very good that you are thinking about it but as most here have said stay in school ( someone pointed out you can do school forever and climb as much as possible.
Then 'Jon Clark chimed in, and I had to too.
Some people are mutants are you? Climbing .12's into your forties?!
Not everyone can do that. If he is, and lives low budget? In Philadelphia.
That would be a role model.
So given my refusal to grow up. Or use The common rules of grammar correctly
I think you have your answer
Find balance. . .good luck ware a brain bucket and have fun

Can't think of a worse place for life advice than a fuckin internet forum hahahaha

good luck kid.

vincent L. wrote:If you are so inclined , working in education is a good way to have a career and still have plenty of time to 'dirtbag' . As a third grade teacher I work 189 days a year , and will never ever work a Christmas, thanksgiving, or a day in July . Dirt bagging is fun , but a gratifying career that contributes to the greater good of others is pretty nice ... How old are you BTW?

+1. I teach 7th grade. It's a really rewarding, creative job. I probably work 50 hours / week during the school year, but I set myself up to be wild and free on my breaks. I'm about to start my 4th year and I'm still into it.

Luc, do I remember you correctly? About 16 years old and climb sport in the 14a range?

If that's you (or even if it's not I suppose) there are a few things I'd tell you.

First and foremost, you're young. You can go to college and figure out what to do later. Some caveats to that though, you really should begin educating yourself before the dirtbag life. Get an associate (useless but a building block) before the roadtrip, better yet, if you're smart and into AP classes, get your BS or BA done with. Lots of people graduate at 21, you can do that and be way ahead of the typical dirtbag when it comes to reassimilating.

Careful about the guys who mention teaching. What they didn't mention is that they love it. If they were only there for the schedule, they'd have split ages ago. It's got an OK schedule but the work fucking sucks. The entire profession is stuck in an appeasement phase where you have to cradle the balls of every parent, student, and administrator out there. The breaks are getting shorter and shorter, especially summer. Also, many nights you'll be at school or home doing work for hours. Same with the weekends. Same with your breaks. A teacher will work 55-70 hours a week depending on specific units and class supplies etc. This will not increase your pay or give you a bonus, it will only serve to keep you employed. To make matters worse, teachers PRIDE themselves on this sick overworking and underpaying high stress model. It's actually getting worse, more unpaid hours and more ball cupping.

It's crazy competitive to get a job. There are so many new graduates that it's crazy competitive to keep a job. Remember, your principal whom you may get along with (he hired you after all) typically will only stay at a school 3-4 years. After that, consider yourself a new hire on probation again.

Keep in mind that many teachers only make it for a short time and switch professions. I can think of about a dozen friends of mine who are all "teachers", they all quit. One is a housewife, another a park ranger, 5 became nurses, one is a dynamiter, several more are in school for another degree. It's the extreme minority of teachers that make it past 5 years.

The time off you do get is always the crowded, hot, and most expensive times to travel. Forget about the perfect spring and fall.

I don't know what you should choose but unless teaching is already your calling and you can't imagine doing anything but teaching, don't do it.

Decide what you're talented at, pursue that. Don't be idealistic. Look up real numbers of the average pay of those professions and the average employability as well as student debt. Think of college as expensive high stakes job training, not fucking guitars under a tree and frisbee.

highaltitudeflatulentexpulsion wrote:Think of college as expensive high stakes job training, not fucking guitars under a tree and frisbee.

I know we're done harping on grammar, but the absence of commas really changes the way this sentence is read.
I'm prepared to admit that I might've done college wrong though. Who knows, maybe fucking a guitar under both a tree and a frisbee is the right way to go.

But seriously, if you're in college (and even if you're not), try to work a lot of different jobs, with very different duties. Find the kind of work you actually enjoy, then look for that kind of work with the setting/hours/coworkers that fit your other goals. Even 3 months on with a job you hate will suck enough to negatively affect your ability to climb during the 9 months you climb. When you finally outgrow dirtbagging (and you will; I've met nobody who wasn't mentally ill that did the dirtbag thing for more than a couple of years) the entirety of your resume is jobs you hate, so you'll most likely get hired into another job you hate.

Wanting to climb a lot is laudable. And definitely a worthy short-term goal. But I can't imagine choosing a life where, because of the economics of my situation, I can have only one hobby (and that's what climbing is, let's not kid ourselves). Can you?

If you end up quitting a job to go climb, make sure to really play up what a heroic and brave decision it is to sacrifice your cushy job for the unknown.

I mean, it takes a lot of balls to give up soul-crushing work to go play everyday.

Dave Bn wrote:If you end up quitting a job to go climb, make sure to really play up what a heroic and brave decision it is to sacrifice your cushy job for the unknown. I mean, it takes a lot of balls to give up soul-crushing work to go play everyday.

Funny stuff!

Depends on a lot of things: Do you have family money and/or connections? Do you have the sociopathic traits that would make you a good salesman? Can you control your ego and emotions and not tell your boss to fuck off even when he fully deserves it?

If you have none of the above, the fact that any retard can get a college degree in the current A-for-effort, students-are-customers environment is certainly not gonna work in your favor.

thecmacattack wrote:Just do what makes you happy, and be happy that you're doing it. its all success if it's what you need.

What makes me happy is to drink beer, kiss gurls, climb rocks, and fart.

Can't pay the bills on THAT...

highaltitudeflatulentexpulsion wrote:Luc, do I remember you correctly? About 16 years old and climb sport in the 14a range? If that's you (or even if it's not I suppose) there are a few things I'd tell you. First and foremost, you're young. You can go to college and figure out what to do later. Some caveats to that though, you really should begin educating yourself before the dirtbag life. Get an associate (useless but a building block) before the roadtrip, better yet, if you're smart and into AP classes, get your BS or BA done with. Lots of people graduate at 21, you can do that and be way ahead of the typical dirtbag when it comes to reassimilating. Careful about the guys who mention teaching. What they didn't mention is that they love it. If they were only there for the schedule, they'd have split ages ago. It's got an OK schedule but the work fucking sucks. The entire profession is stuck in an appeasement phase where you have to cradle the balls of every parent, student, and administrator out there. The breaks are getting shorter and shorter, especially summer. Also, many nights you'll be at school or home doing work for hours. Same with the weekends. Same with your breaks. A teacher will work 55-70 hours a week depending on specific units and class supplies etc. This will not increase your pay or give you a bonus, it will only serve to keep you employed. To make matters worse, teachers PRIDE themselves on this sick overworking and underpaying high stress model. It's actually getting worse, more unpaid hours and more ball cupping. It's crazy competitive to get a job. There are so many new graduates that it's crazy competitive to keep a job. Remember, your principal whom you may get along with (he hired you after all) typically will only stay at a school 3-4 years. After that, consider yourself a new hire on probation again. Keep in mind that many teachers only make it for a short time and switch professions. I can think of about a dozen friends of mine who are all "teachers", they all quit. One is a housewife, another a park ranger, 5 became nurses, one is a dynamiter, several more are in school for another degree. It's the extreme minority of teachers that make it past 5 years. The time off you do get is always the crowded, hot, and most expensive times to travel. Forget about the perfect spring and fall. I don't know what you should choose but unless teaching is already your calling and you can't imagine doing anything but teaching, don't do it. Decide what you're talented at, pursue that. Don't be idealistic. Look up real numbers of the average pay of those professions and the average employability as well as student debt. Think of college as expensive high stakes job training, not fucking guitars under a tree and frisbee.

Yeah, I'm the same Luc, now I'm 18 though. Both my parents are in the education system, so I've seen the inside of that, and it really sucks. My dad is actually the principal, so I like him a decent amount...but I do think I will get my BS and just work to pay for trips for a few years before I try to move into a stable life, which I honestly dont look forward to. I do think college education will make it easier to find work later in life

Well, I've got egg on my face from misusing "your" in my first post. Seriously though, I'm an electrical engineer, and the good pay has allowed me the flexibility to take time off between jobs and do some great climbing. The security of having a marketable skill, and the satisfaction of having a job I enjoy are both huge. Like another commenter said, one of the biggest lifestyle choices you can make is having kids.

I've found a balance (I think!). I live to climb and travel, but i also have other things in my life that make me hesitate to dive completely 'into a dirtbag' existence.
Being an RN is an excellent compromise: I have a meaningful and rewarding career, it pays well & has good benefits, and it allows me to have a very flexible schedule! I work 3 days a week (12-13hr shifts)...I can arrange my schedule to easily have 8 days off in a row w/o using any vacation time! I
I'm not saying go be a nurse for these reasons alone---it's a very stressful career & you can't be in it just for the $.
My point is that there are compromises...life is not all black & white, that you can shape your life into whatever works for you!
Good luck :)

A couple things,

If you are good at something that you can make a decent amount of money doing, that you genuinely enjoy, then that is probably the best path to take, even if it means a lot of college now and postponing the shit-around-and-have-fun part of your life.

If, on the other hand, your ideal career is over-saturated, underpaid, and will fully expect you to offer your soul as the price of entry, pursuing it in the hope of having a decent retirement someday is idiocy.

The whole college-as-job-training thing is fine if you are going into something really specific like engineering or nursing but I think there is value in getting educated for its own sake, especially if you can manage it without too much debt. In all honestly, I know a lot of climbers who are kind of depressingly ignorant because they never got more than a high school education.

Basically, college is great no matter what, jumping right into a career for the sake of secure employment - less so.