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Wild Country Zero...Underrated?

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065
Aric Datesman wrote: Not sure I follow that, unless you're not pulling the trigger on the Alien? Also not quite following why you'd place a cam blind, but as you said, that's another discussion. :)
you dont pull on the trigger very much in those instances ...

just place it and push it in ... especially if the placement is at the limit of your reach

as to placing it somewhat blind ... thats your choice as to no gear or something ...

another issue with the zero is that the stem wire gets a bit kinked more easily than the aliens IME ... here you can see the gray (which has seen maybe 1 short fall) and the yellow (which has seen enough whippers) vs. the green alien (which has seen MANY whippers)

with the aliens even if the stem gets a bit kinked, its not a big deal as the lobes still pull pretty evenly due to the trigger wires being connected to the sheath

the zeros are VERY sensitive to the kinks/bends or the trigger wires getting slightly out of alignment, or just catching on the lobes when you pull it ... i need to check and possibly readjust the zeros prior to every hard climb ... theres been at least one time ive pulled the zero off the harness to go place it and noticed the cams lobes were pulling very unevenly

gray zero

yellow zero

green alien

also note than all these thumb loop cams with thinner dyneema slings ... good sized falls or repeated whippers will likely kink the thumb loop ... as you can see in the pics above

dont get me wrong ... i do like the zeros as they are the ONLY microcam with full rated stops ...

but they can be finicky ... especially compared to aliens which are considered some of the best and smoothest microcams for a reason

;)
Ryan Nevius · · Perchtoldsdorf, AT · Joined Dec 2010 · Points: 1,837
BigCountry wrote:What don't you like about the sling on thumb loop?
The sling attachment to the thumb loop is too tight. Here is an exaggerated photo of how a sling can torque a cam placement, if the sling slides over to the side of the loop. This cam is hanging by the carabiner. This is nearly impossible to recreate with a Camalot. The way it is sewn, the sling doesn't move as freely as it should about the thumb loop. I've noticed cams walk as a result of this grabbing effect the sling has on the thumb loop.

WC Helium sling attachment...issue?
slim · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2004 · Points: 1,103

this something i have also noticed, and greatly dislike about the helium cams.

Ryan Nevius · · Perchtoldsdorf, AT · Joined Dec 2010 · Points: 1,837
slim wrote:this something i have also noticed, and greatly dislike about the helium cams.
Re-slung, I'd be completely happy with them.
Justin S · · Plattsburgh, NY · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 120

So can anyone answer my question as far as the z1 and black alien go, are they meant to be aid pieces? I've seen people say they have whipped on them and people who say they will never relie on them as a single placed cam. Are they good for a single placed lead I guess is my question.

Beean · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 0
Ryan Nevius wrote: The sling attachment to the thumb loop is too tight. Here is an exaggerated photo of how a sling can torque a cam placement, if the sling slides over to the side of the loop. This cam is hanging by the carabiner. This is nearly impossible to recreate with a Camalot. The way it is sewn, the sling doesn't move as freely as it should about the thumb loop. I've noticed cams walk as a result of this grabbing effect the sling has on the thumb loop.
Yeah this bugs me on mine as well. But I don't have sport draws, only alpine draws, so they never walk.

Still prefer em to C4's though.
Beean · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 0
Ryan Nevius wrote: The sling attachment to the thumb loop is too tight. Here is an exaggerated photo of how a sling can torque a cam placement, if the sling slides over to the side of the loop. This cam is hanging by the carabiner. This is nearly impossible to recreate with a Camalot. The way it is sewn, the sling doesn't move as freely as it should about the thumb loop. I've noticed cams walk as a result of this grabbing effect the sling has on the thumb loop.
Yeah this bugs me on mine as well. But I don't have sport draws, only alpine draws, so they never walk.

Still prefer em to C4's though.
Khoi · · Vancouver, BC · Joined Oct 2009 · Points: 45
Justin. S wrote:So can anyone answer my question as far as the z1 and black alien go, are they meant to be aid pieces? I've seen people say they have whipped on them and people who say they will never relie on them as a single placed cam. Are they good for a single placed lead I guess is my question.
The Z1 and Z2 are rated aid only.
patto · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 25
Khoi wrote: The Z1 and Z2 are rated aid only.
Only in Europe. Everywhere else "rated for aid" has no meaning.

What matters is the strength rating on the side. My Z2 has been used as protection dozens of times. I haven't fallen on it, but certainly <5kN pieces such as Z2 and RPs have held falls and stopped ground falls.
bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065
Justin. S wrote:So can anyone answer my question as far as the z1 and black alien go, are they meant to be aid pieces? I've seen people say they have whipped on them and people who say they will never relie on them as a single placed cam. Are they good for a single placed lead I guess is my question.
the black and blue aliens are rated to 6KN ... theyve held falls

but NEVER trust a single small cam if you can help it ... cams pull for a variety of reasons and your margin of error is much less

as to the really tiny stuff ... better than nutting sums it up

;)
Justin S · · Plattsburgh, NY · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 120

Ha thanks for the knowledge, it's nice to hear someone else's take on certain things.

Mike · · Phoenix · Joined May 2006 · Points: 2,615

I believe they are very underrated. I regularly use the biggest 2, and occasionally use the yellow & grey.I have fallen on all of them, and even the grey held like a champ. The blue is a perfect in-between size also.

Who knows why they didn't catch on. I have had a few partners raise an eyebrow at them, and on a few occasions even take them off the rack. Also, some very experienced climbers have had no idea what they were, or that Wild Country made them.

rgold · · Poughkeepsie, NY · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 526

The Zero's heads are too wide compared to other options. Not a problem for granite splitters (maybe even an advantage?) but for irregular cracks, when there are comparable sizes available with narrower heads, it's a deal-breaker for me.

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065

The grey and yellow zero are actually narrower than the equivalent old black and blue aliens

;)

rgold · · Poughkeepsie, NY · Joined Feb 2008 · Points: 526

I believe it...I'm a fan of C3's in the micro sizes.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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