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Cordelette knots
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There was a post somewhere a while back that advocated for just tying figure 8's into each end of the cordelette. Then, if you want a shorter system, you can just clip both ends into one piece; or if your placements are farther apart, you can have an effectively longer cord to work with since it's not in a loop. |
Jake T wrote:Djh Why don't you consider clove hitches to be acceptable? Climbers have been building anchors with them, tying in with them and even self belaying with them for longer than either of us has been alive. If you just don't like them then that's fine, but I would hate to see a newer climber discouraged from using such a versatile knot because of a post like yours. To the op, I like using an open cord with figure eights on a bight as well. The fisherman knots are a pain to untie so if you want a loop I'd probably just go with a edk.It's hard to find good data to back this up, but it should be noted that static cord like accessory cord does behave differently in a clove hitch compared to a dynamic climbing rope. Many sources note that the static cord will slip whereas a dynamic rope generally will slip a small amount before tightening down and then breaking at the knot. I think there is enough evidence to trust a well dressed clove hitch in dynamic rope ( geir.com/mythbuster.html) but with accessory cord the results will likely be different. There's some discussion here ( supertopo.com/climbing/thre…). Also worth noting is that nylon/polyester accessory cord is fine with any number of knots but Spectra cords are more sensitive to the type of knot and the breaking strength can be compromised by the knot (thus the recommendation for triple vs double fishermans). |
Truck13 wrote: Starting with closed cordelette limits the options for the anchor. If you need to untie the closed cordelette, untying the knot that closed it is miserable. That knot often has been in place for as long as the cordelette has been in use and loaded repeatedly.Which is precisely why people who want to be able to untie the loop are doing so happily with the knots mentioned above. Pretty much anything other than a Fisherman's knot. |
Nathanael wrote: It's hard to find good data to back this up, but it should be noted that static cord like accessory cord does behave differently in a clove hitch compared to a dynamic climbing rope. Many sources note that the static cord will slip whereas a dynamic rope generally will slip a small amount before tightening down and then breaking at the knot. I think there is enough evidence to trust a well dressed clove hitch in dynamic rope ( geir.com/mythbuster.html) but with accessory cord the results will likely be different. There's some discussion here ( supertopo.com/climbing/thre…). Also worth noting is that nylon/polyester accessory cord is fine with any number of knots but Spectra cords are more sensitive to the type of knot and the breaking strength can be compromised by the knot (thus the recommendation for triple vs double fishermans).    ;) |
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As mentioned by Truck13, arguably the best knot is no knot. |
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Hey Bearbreeder, I can't make it out from the photo or google translate, what's a paketknoten?  |
mountainhick wrote:Hey Bearbreeder, I can't make it out from the photo or google translate, what's a paketknoten?A paketknoten is different than a mastwurf. Everybody knows that. Duh. :) A paketknoten looks like a flat overhand. An EDK. |
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Looks to me more like Sackstitch tropenform is the EDK, and the paketknoten has something extra, but I can't make them out with the poor photo resolution. |
mountainhick wrote:Looks to me more like Sackstitch tropenform is the EDK, and the paketknoten has something extra, but I can't make them out with the poor photo resolution. Mastwurf is a clove hitchQuite right; you may have a better view of it here: de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paket…(Alpenverein) Edit: This PDF has much better images of it (third page, right-hand column). Looks like an EDK only using a double-overhand. vdbs.de/wp-content/uploads/… |
Jeremy B. wrote: This PDF has much better images of it (third page, right-hand column). Looks like an EDK only using a double-overhand. vdbs.de/wp-content/uploads/…Got it, thanks a ton. |
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The paketnoten appears to be a double overhand with 2 strands. Double EDK. |
mountainhick wrote:Hey Bearbreeder, I can't make it out from the photo or google translate, what's a paketknoten?As others have indicated it appears to be a double overhand ;) |
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Phhbbbt! As someone upstream mentioned, tie no knot at all ... |
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BearBreader, I can't find my glasses, could you post the link for you data, sorry, getting old sucks. |
Dallas R wrote:BearBreader, I can't find my glasses, could you post the link for you data, sorry, getting old sucks.http://vdbs.de/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Panorama-2007-4-Knotenfestigkeiten.pdf |
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Hmm, I wonder if this would be better than the EDK |
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Even better question, does it really matter? |
rgold wrote:As mentioned by Truck13, arguably the best knot is no knot. youtube.com/watch?v=qF4A85C…Hm... he clips into the shelf before there's anything in the power-point. I think, properly, you shouldn't use the shelf without something in the power-point. Otherwise, looks good. |
Bill Lawry wrote:Phhbbbt! As someone upstream mentioned, tie no knot at all ... An Improved Way to Tie a Cordelettedigging this up... hey guys, i was wandering if the method shown in the video has any safety related downsides you can think off? after trying this a few times in the field I conclude for myself: + no knots in the legs + adjustable length / adjustable masterpoint (big plus in my book) - longer cord needed - slightly more difficult in dessing the knot properly what i do not get is why the guy in the video says it's important to close the system with an overhand knot. imo the system seems pretty closed already since all the strands are tied off in the big masterpoint overhand (or figure 8). from what it looks like to me the overhand in the ends does not do anything. (I mean how is this entire masterpoint knot going to undo itself and what are the tied off ends going to change about it) in the comments of the video it says somewhere that you could still have your cordelette tied in a loop (with double fishermens) and still do it the improved way shown in the film. this is certaily true but i'd much rather keep it untied since an untied long cord can come in handy in a few situations. some feedback would be much appreciated, cheers from germany |
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quote and the video doesn't seem to work properly. heres the link again |
