Hexes...why all the hate?

Consider hand carved wooden chair vs a CNC milled production carved chair. Is one superior... to some yes... those who notice the finer points of the hand carved product, it's imperfections, traits they cherish. Others recognize the exact precision with few flaws produced in a fraction of the time. In the end they both get the job done... one might be faster, but better? Matter of perspective. Swing the bells proudly, and next time, just smile and tell em they are just to scare off the snakes. Ignore the rest... ;)

Probably more a generational thing. It seems any climber that was born after I started climbing doesn't want anything to do with Hexes. Maybe Hexes aren't high tech enough for them or maybe its the sound. I associate the sound of hexes to climbing as much as hearing "Whoop Whoop" at Devils lake during the 80s.

I was taught to trad lead almost exclusively on passive pro,(I'm 25) I love my hexes. The next best use for them is whopping A**hats upside their head. Makes a very satisfying bonging sound with the larger sizes.

I love passive pro, I feel better on it and I like how versatile it can be... I think you need to mix it all up... plugging a cam is cool but the feeling I get running a pitch all on passive pro.makes me feel Like im climbing like our for fathers and mothers...

Great thread!

I've been climbing less than a year and I'm 32. I love passive pro so I don't know if it's a generational thing. I think it's more of what the Brits call "Cam Culture". I've read more than once on MP about gym climbers getting into sport and then eventually trad, and so wanting to lead trad above the knowledge of how to protect themselves. Well a cam is easier to place than nut (not well, not safely, just place so that it " looks" good), so I can see why those inexperienced with trad gravitate to cams. Add in all those "just get a set of nut and cams" replies to people asking how to build their first rack, and that's what you see. If I hadn't had the British influence to buy some Torque Nuts, or the Gunks influence to use tricams, I'd just have cams and a set of nuts too.

As it is, I've got a wide range of DMM passive pro including Torque Nuts. When people look at them as an alternative to cams, they fall far short of the mark in most respects, but they have advantages (as do tricams) that are unseen to those who have never used them. When you think of hexes as big nuts that have a slight camming ability, rather than a cam alternative, they make much more sense. But to those who seek cam placements before nut placements, even that concept is lost.

I don't care what anyone thinks of me carrying hexes. I use them, and I like them. I don't try to set them when I'm in a tough spot and getting pumped because I have cams for that. But if I can set one I will, because that cam I *could* place there might be highly desirable a little further along where I WILL be in a bad spot. The only time I've used my rack and didn't place a hex is the only time I didn't take them. What's worse is I really could have used one in roof crack that just didn't seem to want a cam. The sides were far from ideal for a can, but I could have swung one of those torque nuts up and over and just slotted it right down in there. I had a similar experience with tricams; didn't take them and wished I'd had them.

Maybe next time you should challenge that young climber to place one, and then scoff at them in turn when they can't do it.

It is in part generational in that old-schoolers were used to placing hexes.

But, a major difference is the difficulty of the climbing. You'll see plenty of hexes at a moderate trad area like Seneca Rocks. On a moderate climb you can afford to mess around trying to plug a hex. But, go to a hard trad crag and you'll see pretty much no hexes.

Eric D wrote:It is in part generational in that old-schoolers were used to placing hexes. But, a major difference is the difficulty of the climbing. You'll see plenty of hexes at a moderate trad area like Seneca Rocks. On a moderate climb you can afford to mess around trying to plug a hex. But, go to a hard trad crag and you'll see pretty much no hexes.

This makes sense if you are talking about sustained pitches with nowhere to rest and at the edge of the climber's leading ability. But the cruxes of many climbs at MY limit might be considered good rests to someone leading 5.12s. I can see, however, that if someone is leading 5.12 trad routes, they're probably serious enough about climbing hard that they're not looking to spend any more time with gear than is absolutely necessary.

Eric D wrote:It is in part generational in that old-schoolers were used to placing hexes. But, a major difference is the difficulty of the climbing. You'll see plenty of hexes at a moderate trad area like Seneca Rocks. On a moderate climb you can afford to mess around trying to plug a hex. But, go to a hard trad crag and you'll see pretty much no hexes.

So does this mean there were no hard climbs before cams?

I grew up climbing in Bellefonte Quarry. Cams simply weren't reliable in the calcite filled cracks of that limestone so we carried hexes. Even for the hand cracks they were the best option. Once you learned how to be efficient with them, they're the bomb. That said, outside of one purple torque nut, I have none on my rack.

I'm also 47, am often heckled by kids (cause I teach for a living), and learned to climb with hexes (here's to the last generation of the old school!). Because cams are largely more versatile, that's mostly what I carry. But I have a #9 on my rack for sentimental purposes (saved me many a time when I was learning at Turkey Perch). And I love placing it. I also bring hexes along when I think I might need to retreat or am facing weird flares (e.g., Lumpy). In the end, I ask my wife. She usually has an opinion :).

There are some routes at City of Rocks where hexes are perfect, and due to the irregular shape of the crack it would be difficult to get a good cam placement.
It's good to know how to use many different types of protection. At Saxon, Switzerland for example, cams and nuts (and hexes) are "prohibited". Just large knots in slings, along with the occasional bolt.

beensandbagged wrote: So does this mean there were no hard climbs before cams?

Define "hard climbs".

beensandbagged wrote: So does this mean there were no hard climbs before cams?

There were fewer obviously.

In general, as you move up through the trad grades you see much fewer hexes. There are exceptions of course but this is almost always the case.

Orphaned wrote:I have more confidence in a well placed hex than any cam.

+ 1
Kids often think they know everything because they really have no idea what they don't know.

Orphaned wrote:Am I an anachronism, or was he out of line?

Come and play on this route:

coldmountainkit.com/knowled…

you would be mad to try it without hexes and big nuts. Many of the placements are deep voids where cams would open right out. Cams also place larger forces on the rock when you fall, so the rock would blow. This is often the case on limestone, and hence often limestone NEEDS cams.

coldfinger wrote:Hexes rock for: Anchors! Pretty hard to take a cam over a solid nut in a belay anchor, and yes there are many situations (especially a horizontal placement) where a nut is fine with a load in any direction (provided you build the anchor right). Plus..... You can save your cams for leading. Alpine: light weight for sure but also much more compact than a cam, especially when slung with cord or dyneema. And oy yeah since they rely on constriction, I tend to trust them more in slime, dirt and/or icy cracks. Have heard of folks pounding them in with a hammer when a bomber placement is 100% needed and hard to find. Bailing/rappelling: guess I'd rather leave a $10 or $15 piece over a cam. Plus given the potential for changing loads as one goes down or even a bit sideways, that hex ain't no way gonna walk if set well. DMM Torque Nuts are a significant hex upgrade and have advantages any other hex does not offer. Hexes are bomber offset pieces when placed endwise!!!!!! That open cavity and slight offset taper really open up the possibilities. An endwise placed hex is going to be WAY lighter than that size cam. No surprise folks don't see the uses as tons of folks seem to keep the blinders on for all sorts of climbing and non climbing things anyway. As for JLP--way to go MODS! The spray here is often just stoopid, but I do enjoy listening to all the whining when their pointless, rude and/or off topic post gets cut.

I agree with the alpine posts. However, this was a young J Tree climber, he prob doesn't understand that not every climb doesn't have fat rap bolts. I remember having to set up my first natural rap anchor at 14.....I was horrified as every climb I had been on prior was bolted. Also, +1 for slung hexes fitting in a pack better.....however I'm still partial to wires for ease of clipping. :)

Marc801 wrote: Define "hard climbs".

A 5.9 / 5.10 done in 1910 with weird shoes, hemp rope and knotted slings.

beensandbagged wrote: A 5.9 / 5.10 done in 1910 with weird shoes, hemp rope and noted slings.

Which means a modern grade of 13b!

While we are on the topic of passive gear like hexes, let me take the opportunity to invite all you "old school" folks(and even you new school tools) to the first ever Sundance-Devils Tower Climbing Festival to be held from 6-12 Sept., 2015, where the whole emphasis will be on passive trad gear like they used in the 1970s. Fun activities, local legend speaker(s) and a beer festival on the last day of the event.

RUDIMENTARY website was just brought online, but all info and updates will be added here : sundancebeerfestival.com. Look for the climbing festival link.

Or PM me here for more info if you want it now.

TomCaldwell wrote:No hexes because tricams are better because they are more versatile. The new EVO's allow for one-handed placements as well.

im glad i have my hexes considering i got a set of 4-10 for like $5 but any time i would take a hex rather than a cam (alpine or otherwise long ass hike) i'd be better off taking a tricam. in fact, the only time ive taken a hex since i got my set of cams is on a long hike and i decided to take a hex instead of a #3 C4. that being said, if i had a tri-cam in that size i would've taken it instead.
i do love hearing their clank, though, and i always give props whenever i hear the sweet sound of somebody using hexes. a lot of climbs in chattanooga also eat hexes so the area probably makes a difference as well.