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Can't choose a bivi bag for the Alps

Clint Helander · · Anchorage, AK · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 612

I always just sleep with the HELP side down if there are other people around.

Pine Sap · · Estes Park, CO · Joined Feb 2007 · Points: 7,190

Just curious - what 1 person tent weighs a kg. Thanks!

Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5
clint helander wrote:I always just sleep with the HELP side down if there are other people around.
I assumed that the HELP side was somewhat breathable while the bottom was not, as some bivybags are made. But it looks like that one uses the same fabric on both sides.

My one person tent weights one kilogram and I always wake up covered in condensation all around in it. I really dream of something breathable. :)

Here's is it from my latest adventure two nights ago:

It was quite cold outside.
Ray Pinpillage · · West Egg · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 180
Pine Sap wrote:Just curious - what 1 person tent weighs a kg. Thanks!
Firstlight and Direkt are pretty close.
Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5
Ray Pinpillage wrote: Firstlight and Direct are pretty close.
That's why I specified that I am looking for something that is AT MOST 600 grams.

I am now considering these two that should provide a great breathability:

Exped eVent bivy bag

outdoorfair.de/p-en-2132-ex… (t
565 grams but I'd probably need an extra 70 grams of foam pad to protect it)

And borah gear:

borahgear.com/eventbivy.html (600 grams)

Also the rab Alpine, that's less than 500 grams!
Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5

Uhm.

I am starting to wonder what I would do in case of heavy massive rain if I only have a bivy bag.
Even in a ultra waterproof one I would have the issue of entering it when already wet.
It would be perfect - I think - if I enter the bivy when it's not raining, zip it, and then who gives a fu*k if a storm begins, I'm gonna to stay dry.

But what if it is raining and raining and raining and I have to set up for the night?

Perhaps, I am wondering, an ultralightweight tarp along with a light bivy bag - not necessarily waterproof this time, I would just need it to be breathable and wind proof - could serve me better?

Clint Helander · · Anchorage, AK · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 612

That's the issue with bivy bags. Let me reiterate...there is almost no such thing as a waterproof bivy bag. The problem is that you have immediate contact with the fabric so you get a kind of contact soak. You will get wet if it rains, no way around it. Maybe not immediately, but you will.

Check out this superlight bivy, not waterproof on the top, but only weighs 5.6 ounces. zpacks.com/shelter/bivy.shtml

They also make tarps. You'l want a silnylon tarp. Think about it though...you're talking about the Alps. It can blow, rain and snow in any direction. A sil-tarp will provide some shelter, but this is still sub-par in the "real shit!"

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065
mec.ca/product/5022-263/int…



160 dollahs and event top, durable 70d bottom, ~500g, NOT sealed by zippering

in any serious rain you are somewhat screwed in any of these light bivy without a tarp

your best bet should you encounter that situation is to turn over on your side/stomach and let the generally more waterproof bottom take the brunt of the storm

with heavier "bomber" bivies (full zip, bomber WPB fabrics, hoops) you may not have to do this, but youll still get wet in a continuos downpour as you eventually need to enter and exit ... and the condensation

;)
Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5

What about this?

hyperlitemountaingear.com/h…

it's expensive as fu*k, but if it's going to very effective and to last for about a lifetime I may spend that money.

Ashort · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Apr 2014 · Points: 56

It's like you are trying to drive a nail with a screwdriver.

Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5
Ashort wrote:It's like you are trying to drive a nail with a screwdriver.
I guess I should just get a cheap one and give it a try.
Ray Pinpillage · · West Egg · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 180
Febs wrote: I guess I should just get a cheap one and give it a try.
But then you'd have to actually go outside.
Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5
Ray Pinpillage wrote: But then you'd have to actually go outside.
Yeah, but I could do that in the park and starting to have a feel for it. Not the very same thing as the real one, I know, but still.

In the while I got this e-book.
amazon.com/The-Book-Bivvy-R…

Hope to learn something from it.
Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5

So, I'll go for a rab tarp + quantum bivy solution. Thanks all for the inputs.

I was wondering if there is any tarp setup that would protect against winds that are strong and could change direction during the night.

Just in case the weather forecast did foresee only a light rain and no wind and so you still chose to go the tarp way rather than the tent one.

Thanks.

Pine Sap · · Estes Park, CO · Joined Feb 2007 · Points: 7,190

Peg it down all the way around and use a trekking pole in the center or a little offset.

jktinst · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 55

Are you sure that with the need to peg the tarp nice and tight for treeless alpine camping, you're not going to end up with a sleeping system that is heavier, has a larger footprint and is harder to set up than your tent?

When I started thinking of small tarp designs specifically meant to go with the bivy, I felt that they would have to work with 3-4 pegs max. Any more than that would be defeating the purpose and I'm really only looking at that option because I already own the bivy and I'm too cheap to buy a good LW 1-person tent for once-in-a-while use.

Typically for UL camping, you either use just the bivy or just the tarp or just the hammock, etc., depending on the terrain, weather, etc. but you're talking full-size tarp + bivy...

Regarding the frost issue. I would suspect that it was more an issue of venting the tent. However, if you did set up the tent for maximum venting and still got all that frost, then I'm pretty sure that those same damp+cold conditions would also have produced frost and/or condensation inside a bivy, except that in that case, it would have been in direct contact with your sleeping bag instead of being away from it on the fly.

Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5
jktinst wrote: However, if you did set up the tent for maximum venting and still got all that frost, then I'm pretty sure that those same damp+cold conditions would also have produced frost and/or condensation inside a bivy, except that in that case, it would have been in direct contact with your sleeping bag instead of being away from it on the fly.
I don't think so. Some humidity comes from perspiration, but most of it comes from the sleeper's breath. I would not breath *into* the bivy bag.
The siltarp 2 weights 378 g / 13 oz unpacked (and I would stuff it unpacked) and the breathable bivy it's about 200 more grams - that's a weight that is hard to beat.
For what matters the comfort/discomfort, I'll let ya know.

Yeah: I'M GONNA DIE
Phil Tatti · · Saratoga Springs · Joined Apr 2011 · Points: 5

You might want to check out Borah gear for the silnylon tarp. They have some simple designs that I think would benefit a Bivy very well.

Borah Tarps

Borahgami Tarp (Tarp with several setup options)

Febs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 5

Thank you.

I ended up following the above advice and getting a tarp (a poncho tarp actually) and a cheap bivy from Alpkit so to start with something on the cheap side.
Worked well so far (in not too intense weather condition, that means light raind and wind).

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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