tying in direct at mid rope with this type of fig 8
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So I want to be able to tie into the middle of an 8mm twin and half rated rope without any carabiner. I would then be leading on twins via the two halves (every piece clipped). Belayed on both halves by a mammut smart alpine. This way I can carry just one super light rope when back packing/traveling internationally and still climb a few short single pitch routes. |
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That certainly seems fine to me. |
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WFSCOT, |
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I was going to recommend the Alpine Butterfly, but apparently it doesn't really matter "...with modern ropes.." So here you are, same principle applies to what you would like to achieve: |
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Joe Freeman wrote:WFSCOT, I will try and play around with that knot and see how easy it is to do that. seems like it would be hard to do at the anchors maybe. I am excited to try this crazy set up as it will make my pack a little smaller and 4.1 lbs lighter than using my 10.2mm rope.Yeah, untying at the anchors will likely suck a bit. You'll probably have to pull all the rope through the eye (vs trying to get yourself back out of the eye). Oh well. Still a cool party trick. |
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Google 'Alpine Girth Hitch'. Take the bite in the center of the rope, pass it up through your belay loop, pass it over your head and behind you, step through, pull tight. Sounds crazy, but it works! We use it often with '3 on a rope'. Simple, fast, strong, (relatively) foolproof, and uses little rope. |
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I too was interested in tying in the middle of a half rope for a short pitch. I figured the best place to ask was in the UK forum since the Brits climb on half ropes a lot. |
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I'm pretty sure there's a neat way to tie in with a bowline on a bight mid-rope where you 1. pull the bight thru the harness 2. Form the "eye" 3. push about 4' of rope thru the eye 4. flip the bight around your whole body. |
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Your knot is fine. You can also tie a bowling on a bight mid-rope, without having to feed 30m of rope through your belay loop first. I use the same knot tied at the end of the rope with a different method when I'm falling a lot on single pitch route. |
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I tend to tie in with this knot when tying in to the middle. |
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Larry S wrote:I'm pretty sure there's a neat way to tie in with a bowline on a bight mid-rope where you 1. pull the bight thru the harness 2. Form the "eye" 3. push about 4' of rope thru the eye 4. flip the bight around your whole body. I don't have a rope and harness here with me to try it out. In the diagram below, in step 2, you would be flipping the bight over your head and stepping thru it, then finishing the knot like in step 4.Presumably you have considered the slight awkwardness of untying this hanging from the chains at the top of a route? I just use a bowline tied on the bight of rope without a stopper and lock the end loop with a karabiner onto the knot loop. |
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figure eight on a bite or alpine butterfly. bring a carabiner rather than tying directly through your harness and life will be easier. |
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alpine butterfly. Easy to tie, easy to untie, and you can give and take slack from it (moving yourself in the line) very easily. |
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Jim Titt wrote: Presumably you have considered the slight awkwardness of untying this hanging from the chains at the top of a route? I just use a bowline tied on the bight of rope without a stopper and lock the end loop with a karabiner onto the knot loop.Yeah, you're right, I'm running on an assumption of routes that top out (that's what i typically climb), so i didn't consider having to escape the rope while hanging. Has a definite advantage over on suggestion to thread half the rope thru a figure 8 follow thru above. Lesser advantages uses minimal rope, and the knot isn't huge, but those might not be big concerns. |
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Rob D. wrote:alpine butterfly. Easy to tie, easy to untie, and you can give and take slack from it (moving yourself in the line) very easily.How're you tying in with an alpine butterfly? Only way i know hot to tie it it creates a loop, but how do you get that loop threaded thru your harness? |
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Larry S wrote: How're you tying in with an alpine butterfly? Only way i know hot to tie it it creates a loop, but how do you get that loop threaded thru your harness?You will need to connect to your belay loop with a locker. This is how guides such as RMI set up teams for glacier travel. |
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Brian Monetti wrote: You will need to connect to your belay loop with a locker. This is how guides such as RMI set up teams for glacier travel.yeah sorry i skipped that part. You can also girth hitch into the middle of the rope by stepping through, but it would be less fun to fall on that (or more specifically, to untie) |
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'Alpine Girth Hitch'!!!!! Simple, easy, cannot come lose or untied. 8's / bowlines for this senario, all a waste of time and rope by my measure. |
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Thanks for all the ideas. I will play with all of these simulating on the ground and clipped to anchors and see what suits me best. Glad to hear others have been doing this also. I prefer not to use biners on the belay loop or harness as they could load funny, but I use them on my silent partner and they seem to stay pretty well aligned there. |
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Craig Childre wrote:'Alpine Girth Hitch'!!!!! Simple, easy, cannot come lose or untied. 8's / bowlines for this senario, all a waste of time and rope by my measure.Any concern that the rope could slide on a serious whipper? |
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wfscot wrote: Any concern that the rope could slide on a serious whipper?That is my concern too. Alpine low angle okay, but if vertical leading seems like it might. |