Hammerless Ice Tools?

I don't understand the proliferation of ice tools that have no hammers.

Particularly with the modern emphasis on mixed climbing, it seems like having a functioning hammer to pound pins on occasion is still relevant.

And yet, I see tons of pictures of bad ass climbers doing long alpine-ish mixed routes with Nomics and other hammerless tools.

Does nobody pound pins in the alpine any more?

I just bought a pair of the Cassin X-Dream tools. The ice pick has a (tiny) hammer, but the mixed pick has none. Does that seem backwards to anyone else? I'm more likely to be placing pins on a mixed route than a pure ice route.

I'm psyched to try the new tools this season. Not so psyched to forego having a hammer and a couple of pins on my rack.

I bet 99% of the hammerless tools never go beyond pre-bolted sport/mixed routes. The 1% out there going ground-up FA probably have a proper hammer tool in their holster.

I place pins with my nomics.

There are still a couple of people out there who pound pins in the alpine. One of the biggest considerations in my tool purchasing decisions is the tool's ability to properly pound a pin. Some new tools still come with an ok hammer, like the DMM Apex. After market picks also tend to have more options. The reality is that most ice climbers these days don't like doing the "crazy sketchy shit" that requires things like pins and specters.

most people are pussies.

Kai Larson wrote:I don't understand the proliferation of ice tools that have no hammers. Particularly with the modern emphasis on mixed climbing, it seems like having a functioning hammer to pound pins on occasion is still relevant. And yet, I see tons of pictures of bad ass climbers doing long alpine-ish mixed routes with Nomics and other hammerless tools. Does nobody pound pins in the alpine any more? I just bought a pair of the Cassin X-Dream tools. The ice pick has a (tiny) hammer, but the mixed pick has none. Does that seem backwards to anyone else? I'm more likely to be placing pins on a mixed route than a pure ice route. I'm psyched to try the new tools this season. Not so psyched to forego having a hammer and a couple of pins on my rack.

The intent of ice tools with offset grips is not to bang pins. The Petzl hammer and the tiny hammer on the X-Dream is the manufacturer's way of throwing you a bone. To answer your question directly, most climbers don't carry pins anymore so No. Ethics and technology changed.

It's almost impossible to drive a solid pin with a radically curved tool even if it has a hammer. It can be done in a pinch, but if a lot of pitons are anticipated, it's worth the effort to bring a lightweight alpine hammer. I even carry one on occasion alongside my Vipers. It makes placing good pins easy especially in tight chimneys.

thebmc.co.uk/is-there-a-fut…

It's worth keeping "myth 3" in mind when you're awkwardly tapping away with your new lightweight ice tool. Any real hammer will give you a stronger placement.

All the climbers I know around here who place pins — and there are quite a few — carry a separate hammer for pounding pins. Easier, quicker, safer.

The hubby uses first gen Fusions and when ice climbing or tradition mixed climbing has a set of hammers on them. This adds weight to the head to improve the swing and he pounds pins quite well with them.

I use Nomics and the times I've tried placing even a specter into turf has made me want to cry.

The fact of the matter there are advantages and disadvantages to every ice tool. It's not a bad idea to have different types of tools if you're doing different styles of climbing.

Turn tool sideways and wail away. Not ideal, but it works and modern gear is so good these days that pins are rarely necessary.

I use the Cold Thistle hammers on my Nomics and they work fine for placing pitons. Not as good as a real piton hammer but good enough for placing pins on practically every mixed route that I've done for the past three years in the Andes.

Keenan Waeschle wrote:I place pins with my nomics.

Keenan, I placed a pin this weekend with my buddies Nomics..so hard!

I've also wondered the same thing, but then again the first generation Nomics also had no "spike" for plunging. That's pretty much a declaration that the tool wasn't initially designed for mountain routes.

I've got a smallish hammer (Cassin Orion) with a pick.

I guess I can start taking it with me as a third tool on mixed routes where I'm using my X-Dream.

Seems silly that I can't get a proper hammer on these tools.

I've got coldthistle hammers. It's not as great as a wall hammer (clearly), but pounding in a spectre or pecker is fine as long as the placement isn't overly constricted.
I use my nomics in the big mountains and they are fantastic. I use the mixed picks and plunge the head of the tool as a spike. I think the nomics are a fantastic alpine tool. That being said, if there's a way to fit a hammer to the new BD fuels (and they climb ice as well as the nomics) I'll probably make the switch, as having a real spike would be a step up.

Still don't really love BD picks though. Petzl or Grivel should release hot forged picks that are compatible with BD tools.