BD Camalot Generation Differences

Anyone have a strong opinion on the difference of 5-6 year old Camalots and new ones? They certainly look different, but I haven't ever felt the older ones in my hand.

The two differences that I notice and care about most are the thumb loop, or lack thereof, and the weight. The thumb loop on the new ones is something I appreciate a lot when I'm pumped. It makes the cam quicker to handle and easier to place and extract. I have any easier time removing the c4s, especially when they are deeper or tight. Secondly, the c4s are lighter, especially noticeable in the bigger sizes. As for other differences, the range is difference, the old 5 is not as big as the new 6, there is greater overlap in sizes in the older camalots but slightly less overall range. The old ones are stronger I believe, but it's not like the c4s are weaker in some way that I'm concerned about them failing on account of their strength ratings, so I done see this as particularly relevant. Also, the thumb loop makes for a significantly higher clip-in point for aid. In terms of owning them, if you can get a good price on the older ones, especially in the hand sizes, I'd buy them.

In sizes 1, 2, and 3 I have both a C4 and the previous generation Camalot. I use them identically and for all intents and purposes they behave identically.

C4s with thumb loop in general fit my hand better and are easier all around to handle and place. Not as important to me for the really large sizes > #4. Larger size C4s however are lighter weight.

Sizes above #3 are also somewhat different.
-old #3.5 to me is the most useful tweener size compared to C4s, size is between #3 and and C4 #4
-old #4 is slightly larger than C4 #4,
-old 4.5 very close to C4 #5,
-old #5 is slightly smaller than C4 #6

Some more info here:

mountainproject.com/v/old-c…

The figure comparing old to new weights and ranges is interesting.

old and new .3's are slightly different size. for the bigger units, i like the old sizing better. would have been better to keep the old sizing and add a bigger unit (ie a bit bigger than the current #6).

Thanks for all the responses. They old ones definitely look heavier. It seems like some of the old ones even have double stems????

I find that the weight is one thing on the harness and another in the hand. In the hand is more significant. The c4s feel way better balanced. I think the thumb loop helps a lot, but the older style feel very "head-heavy" versus the c4s. This seems to contribute to the easier placement and extraction.

So, the #3.5 camalot was about the same as a new #4, and about the same as a #4 friend. I don't miss it. The old #4 has no equivalent from any brand. I really miss it.

The earlier ones were heavier and i think one generation (gen 2?) had examples where cracks would develop where the axle went through the stem.. will have to find the reference..

What people consider previous-generation Camalots are actually two different generations. The major differences are a rounded vs non-rounded thumb-loop, as well as slightly different paint/anodization colors. For example the 3.5 has either a gray or black color, depending upon generation.

The main difference between the previous generation Camalots and the new C4 camalots is the thumb-loop. The C4s also weigh quite a bit less. The previous generation had, in addition to all the usual sizes, also .1 and .2, which are now fairly obsolete due to the tremendous offerings of micro-cams available. More importantly, the previous generation had sizes 3.5, 4, 4.5, and 5. Not one of these sizes is duplicated perfectly by the C4s. This is generally not a big deal, except for certain climbs that for whatever reason will not accept a #3 or a #4 C4 and for whatever reason demand a 3.5. Of the previous generation Camalots, the 3.5 and 4.5 are certainly the most useful and desirable.

I personally keep a set of previous-generation Camalots in sizes 3.5, 4, 4.5, and 5, in addition to my assortment of larger size C4 Camalots. If I'm casually climbing, I'll always choose to take the C4s in the larger sizes over the previous-generation Camalots. Every once in a while though, the previous generation Camalots prove their worth.

John Wilder wrote:many people (myself included) mourn the loss of the #3.5 especially. .

J. Albers wrote: Damn, no doubt. The 3.5 has always been my favorite alpine "big cam"....not too small, but not too big either. Sigh, the new 4 just isn't the same.

Another advantage of the new c4s: if the cam gets stuck in a crack, the thumb loop can be clipped by other climbers for long time after the webbing has deteriorated!

nothing worse than an ugly-ass fixed cam you don't even want to clip

Love my 3.5!

So much good info. My camalots are from the mid 90s when the .5 and .75 were dual stem and had the thumb post (no loop) is this the generation everyone is raving about? I think it was before half sizes though.