Lost Rope - Crimson Chrysalis

Got a rappel line stuck on Crimson yesterday and had to abandon it due to the late hour. If you retrieve it, please, contact David Sweet through this forum or 303-589-9494. Thanks

I can put you in touch with the guy who has your rope (he's not on mountain project), but you should really buy him some beer...

That's my plan, Dude. But I was hoping to offer it as a reward and not submit to it as extortion. Of all the lost gear I've returned to people through this forum I've never demanded nor expected a reward for doing the right thing but I guess that's not cool behavior anymore. So, if I agree to how much and what kind of beer as ransom, are you willing to reveal the identity of the person you expect to benefit form my misfortune?

It's not misfortune David; it's laziness and wrong expectations. I'm sure you're a great guy and I'm sure we'd probably hit it off in person, but even if we were close friends I would have advised you to consider the rope no longer yours the moment you decided to abandon it and if you wanted any chance of getting it back you should post on Mountain Project offering a reward or at the very least a big thank you.

Two weeks ago I bootied a 0.5 Camalot and 'biner and went out of my way to return it to it's owner (who would have never known the difference if I'd kept it). Not even a word of thanks. So can you blame me for looking out for my friend? After all, he unstuck it, coiled it, and carried it out (in addition to the two ropes he himself brought in to climb the route).

On the other hand, all I know about you is you posted asking for your rope but actually didn't offer any sort of reward. That, and that you couldn't be bothered to re-lead the pitch or go back the next day for it. All of which tells me something, which, I hate to say it, seems to be reinforced by your second post... And the 303 area code.

Tell you what, at this point, if you get the rope back, you can thank my friend. If you don't, you can blame me. I'm OK with that.

David's problem was admitting that he "abandoned" the rope.
As readers of these types of threads may know, "abandonment" is the kiss of death of from an ownership perspective.
He should have said only that he became temporarily separated from his rope, but never intended to relinquish his ownership rights, rather, he intended to regain physical custody at the earliest opportunity (or whenever he got around to it--I'm sure he's a busy guy).
Then, Josh's "friend" (it would be interesting to know what flavor of beer the "friend" enjoys, and compare it to Josh's preferred brew!) would be legally obligated to return the rope post haste, with no right to any sort of "reward" beyond whatever gratitude David saw fit to bestow, if any.

Josh Janes tellin' it like it is!

The "303 area code". WTF Josh. Lame stereotype. Get over yourself my friend.

I would agree that beer is definitely called for here, but by Josh Janes rules D Sweet has no chance to redeem himself here by just showing up with beer. If he brings beer then it will be thought of as a forced offering at this point, and he'll always be the guy who abandoned his rope and only brought beer because he got called out on MP. Had he brought it on his own, he may have lost some gear but at least he realizes it and makes a peace offering.
I also like how the OP refers to himself in the third person. But thanks for looking out for your friend Josh, I'm sure he's having a tough time with all of this.

Dylan B. wrote:Yesterday I was walking at the dog park. The guy in front of me dropped his watch, but didn't realize it. I picked it up and gave it back to him. That's common decency. You loose something, or leave it behind, you know it might be gone for good and you accept that fact. It's just stuff. It's not that important. You find something and you know who it belongs to, you give it back, and you don't expect anything more than a "thank you." That's common decency. Someone does you a kindness, you thank them. If it cost them more than minor inconvenience, you thank them with something commensurate in value to the extent that you are able. That's manners. All these silly booty rules constitute the ethics of a mob of pre-schoolers.

This right here seems like common sense, which unfortunately many people seem to lack. But maybe that's just how Sconnies are raised, eh Dylan?

I agree. Accidental loss is unfortunate and making an effort to return property is commendable.

However, there's a difference in your watch drop scenario and 99% of the "lost" gear posts on MP.

Abandoning gear, whether due to weather, pending darkness, or inability to continue is just that. Abandonment. I might even call it littering. Work through the scenario and retrieve your gear. You'll likely appreciate the new-found competence.

Tl;dr... If it means that much to you, don't leave it behind.

Holy shit...if you keep a rope you found stuck (and know who it belongs to), you are an ass. Period.

David Sweet wrote:Got a rappel line stuck on Crimson yesterday and had to abandon it due to the late hour.

I always find the reasons for abandoning gear interesting. So the hour was late. As someone else asked why not re-lead the pitch and free the rope? Lack of knowledge of how to do so? If that was the case, then you should have used it as learning experience because what would you have done if on the first rap and not the last?

No head lamp? Learn to climb without light. Could have sewn the climb up as it is not like there are no opportunities for pro.

As for posting up asking for the gear back if found. #1. be humble #2 offer beer #3 make it easy for whomever found the gear.

Fuck Yea!

NC Rock Climber wrote: if you leave gear it is no longer yours. Others MIGHT be cool and give it back. They might not. Either way, deal with it.

I agree with "deal with it" because we all go into this knowing the score and choose to play the game anyway.

Although, I do wish we could be better to each other as a community. The booty rules aren't something I'm proud of. In other sports/hobbies I have participated in, it wouldn't fly at all. Other than this one thing (which comes up often), climbers as a whole are some of the most generous, selfless people I've come across.

I mean, the OP said please and thank you in the first post. Should he really have to beg?

Due to a series of our errors the reasonable solution at the time was for us to leave the rope. According to Josh (who seems to be the world's sole arbiter of ethical behavior) those errors and my failure to offer a reward up front has dictated that I forfeit any possibility of getting the rope back. I guess that means the Las Vegas cabbie who found $300,000. in his cab and got it to the rightful owners without demand for a reward was a jerk (he did get $10,000. after returning the money). Some friends did go up the next day and talked to the people who retrieved it and were told that the finders would get on MP and try get the rope back. Interestingly, there has been no peep from them - only from their buddy, Josh, who is explaining why it's cool for them to keep the rope. I'm OK with that. If they're that short on beer money, they should sell the rope on MP and order a keg. If you see a 60 meter 8mm Dragonfly for sale, I can vouch for its reliability.

aren't Petzl ropes not that great, anywho?

Another good reason for them to just keep it.

Allen Sanderson wrote: I always find the reasons for abandoning gear interesting. So the hour was late. As someone else asked why not re-lead the pitch and free the rope? Lack of knowledge of how to do so? If that was the case, then you should have used it as learning experience because what would you have done if on the first rap and not the last? No head lamp? Learn to climb without light. Could have sewn the climb up as it is not like there are no opportunities for pro.

The fine for being parked on the loop road after evening closure may have entered into the decision as well.

There are no excuses for littering on federal lands, period, no matter how self serving they might be, late for dinner, worried about a ticket, etc. If anything, I found JJ's comments down right diplomatic. Sorry if some of us are a bit perplexed with this relatively new sense of entitlement among the younger climbing tourist class "please whoever cleaned up my mess, return my shit".

Seems like the OP never learned a couple of critical climbing rules:
#1. Be self-reliant
#2. If you fail at #1, drop the arrogance and be polite.