Plastic vs Leather Boots

Bill, I wrote "If you find a plastic boot that fits well..." Maybe I should have written it "IF you find a plastic boot that fits well, you'll get the maximum performance it can deliver." If you say leather outperforms plastic, I bow to your experience - I have only done steep ice climbing in plastic boots, and have no idea how leather performs.

Bill Kirby wrote: William, You're not going to know what fits until spend some time trying on boots!

I figured, just trying to narrow down choices, I live 2 hours from the nearest retailer for any boots so have to preplan it. Also trying to get pointers on what to look for, what to avoid, which everyone has made great comments, thanks.

Ray Pinpillage wrote: I think you may be using Single/Double interchangeably with Leather/Plastic. Plastic boots are all but dead in North America.

Agreed. I think the better comparison is leather boots to say, La Sportiva Nepal Evo or further, say, La Sportiva Nepal Evo to a Baruntse/Spantik type boot.

There are a lot of routes/mountains between a good old fashioned pair of leather boots and double plastics. If your feet get cold, get the Baruntse/Spantik type boot instead of the Koflac Arctis/Scarpa Inverno. They are (i) practically the same price, (ii) can do more things, and (iii) are viewed by many as more comfortable.

As a side note, i'm pretty sure they don't make the Koflac's anymore and even Scarpa is trying to switch you to a 6,000-7,000m boot when you look for Inverno's on their website (difficult to find off the bat).

As far as leather boots are concerned, I think if you are an avid hiker with a semi reasonable pack on (say less than 40 lbs), trail runners should suffice unless you see yourself putting crampons/spikes on at some point (in that case you'll want a 3/4 / full shank available in most leather boots). Simply put, I find myself not using my leather boots much anymore aside from a long Sierra backpack with a big load (extra ankle support is appreciated after a few days on the trail).

caribouman1052 wrote:Bill, I wrote "If you find a plastic boot that fits well..." Maybe I should have written it "IF you find a plastic boot that fits well, you'll get the maximum performance it can deliver." If you say leather outperforms plastic, I bow to your experience - I have only done steep ice climbing in plastic boots, and have no idea how leather performs.

Haha.. Hey man, I'm keeping it respectful like i said before. Don't bow to my experience. I'm the one climbing in fancy pants boots. You're the one out there getting it done in plastics. I should be bowing to you! You should check out some of the current boots on the market if you haven't already. I'll let you try out my collection if you live in the NE and are a size 45.5.

William, You're missing my point big time! Don't cross any boot off the list until you try that boot on. Don't listen me, your friends, MPers, your guide, the homeless guy outside the bar last night. Nobody except the guy at a reputable climning shop when it comes to boot fit advice. I'll tell you again.. Try on every boot you can. Try two sizes of every boot you can. After you spend hours trying on boots only then make a decision based on what fits best. I spent three hours in the Mountaineer choosing my first pair of ice climbing boots. I tried on different sizes of every boot in the shop. That's the best way to get the right boots for you. Don't buy them online after listening some BS on MP.

Bill Kirby wrote: William, You're missing my point big time! Don't cross any boot off the list until you try that boot on.

I am planning on it, not set on anything yet, actually like the Lowa Weisshorn, but that means it probably won't fit well. What I have taken away from the comments is that it's just like rock, different shoes for different situations, but all the comments have at least given me things to look for and to think about from people that have used them, so again, thanks

I agree you should try every boot on you can find. The problem is very few climbing shops stock many models. I think the most I've seen in one place is the shop in Ouray, which also lets you rent boots. Ice festivals can sometimes have a good selection as well. They at least usually have Scarpa and Sportiva so you can see which one fits best. In general Sportiva is narrow/low volume and Scarpa is wider/high volume.

If you want to go to plastic boots, I would suggest going to the modern light ski touring boots like the Dynafit TLT5 or TLT6. They are lighter than even most single boots and are more versatile since you can use skis to approach, plus they climb well and ski great. They can also be custom fitted more readily than most climbing boots.

It really all depends on what your aspirations and uses will be and where you plan on going and what kind of climbing you want to do.

William Kramer wrote: I am planning on it, not set on anything yet, actually like the Lowa Weisshorn, but that means it probably won't fit well. What I have taken away from the comments is that it's just like rock, different shoes for different situations, but all the comments have at least given me things to look for and to think about from people that have used them, so again, thanks

A friend of mine that i climbed with yesterday has a pair of Weisshorns. He told me that Lowa boots fit him really well. No other boot came close. He was wearing the Triolet yesterday when i was rocking Guide Tennies. Matt's my hero.

Wyatt, that's the opposite of what i think of when i dream about living in the Rockies. North Conway NH and Keene Valley with a drive to Lake Placid has shops that would get you in every pair of boots on the market. I just assumed there would spots like that up and down the Rockies. I understand there would be a drive involved but what a way to spend a day or weekend! Another idea would be to take a trip to a city. Lots of friends take vacations in major cities that live in the mountains. Wish i could visit Washington DC once a year. Haha..

I use scarpa omegas (those bright red ones) and I find them less clunky, lighter, and more comfortable than just about every double leather boot out there. Another plus: they're cheap!

Bill - I bought a pair of barely used Scarpa Charmoz last year, which seem to fit pretty well, better than the LS Silver Bullets. I have yet to get out on them, but maybe this will be the year. Seems like they'll need a little tweaking to perfection.

I (reluctantly) let go of my Kastingers, when I started thinking about the new breathable boots vs. a boot that might, after 20 years of climbing and 10 years of getting rammed through breakable crust, be developing stress fractures. The tongues had given up the ghost, and been replaced with siliconized leather, but still... in comparison to my NNN BC boots, just not comfy.

William - Wyatt mentioned ski boots. Interesting idea I'd like to pass along to you: My Kastingers had a middle amount of 'heel bump', the amount the heel sticks back behind the Achilles. It wasn't enough for me, and, when I got my backcountry tour set up, the ski shop added some heel spacer thingies, gray plastic "loops" that went under the forward part of the heel, and looped up and back above my heel and behind the Achilles. The had inward bumps in the arc that filled the hollow between the sides of my Achilles and the boot. They prevented heel lift, almost completely, and were a big reason I could use those boots effectively on steep ice. I apologize, I just don't know the vocabulary the ski shops use when they fit boots; my experience is that they do a better job than the climbing/ hiking boots shops.

Caribouman1052, No toe welts on your new boots? Guess you have clip pons? That's hardcore! I would like to try that setup some time.

As far as the Trangos go, people love them or hate them it seems. Those boots either fit or they don't fit at all. I tried a pair for a day once and thought they were coolest thing since curved picks. The boots i tried that day were great. I really liked all the mobility in the ankle but were uncomfortable too. I bought a pair of 46s, a half size up thinking those would fit perfect.. Nope i traded them for a coat because of heel lift. I fit better in Scarpa boots. I have a pair of Jorasses and a pair of Rebel GTXs.

You're thinking of heel wraps. I shop at the Mountaineer in Keene Valley and IME in North Conwway. Those are climbing and ski shops. Maybe that's why i get a good fit! Haha..

Heel wraps... well, further proof that I haven't climbed ice in so long that my vocabulary is gone. Hang on - quick trip to the closet - you're right, no toe welt or divot for the front toe bail. Yeesh, I noticed that when I bought 'em. What was I thinking? Oh, right...

"Boots have evolved. Time for new crampons."

I sold my good crampons (Lowe Footfangs. They were cutting edge a while back, eh?) when I junked my plastic boots. Looks like I'm stuck with hybrid/ semi-step in crampons.

I'm not sure what you mean by clip crampons - bails front & back?

You haven't skiied much either. Heel wraps are that heel spacer thingy you were talking about.

Scroll down the link below to "Types of crampons"

blackdiamondequipment.com/e…

You could have bought boots with a toe welt to use your Foot Fangs. You can also buy a rigid crampon to fit those Charmoz.

mountaingear.com/webstore//…

Might need a second mortgage or a credit card!