Clove-hitch yourself into anchor or not

When on a multi-pitch climb and building anchors I have seen multiple ways in how to go indirect into the anchor.

I have learned clove-hitch the climbing rope directly into the master point of the cordelette or anchor system.

I have also seen fellow climbers just clip themselves directly into the master point through a locking carabiner to their belay loop.

How do you go indirect into a multi-pitch anchor? I feel using the climbing rope to go indirect helps reduce loads since it stretches. Which is how I learned and have been doing for a while.

Thank you and climb on!

animatedknots.com/clovehalf…..

As stated in the warnings - it can slip and sometimes bind. None the less, it is what I have been using for years as it is adjustable on the fly and I always use two tie points of contact. This one and usually a daisy of some sort. The the daisy always has to be taut(can never be shock loaded), which is why this is so useful as it can be adjusted perfectly to match the daisy.

Clove hitch into a master point , plus a daisy into a separate piece, and belay off your harness... Sometimes multiple clove hitches into separate pieces ...

I have also seen fellow climbers just clip themselves directly into the master point through a locking carabiner to their belay loop.


This seems risky as you can create a pull in two different directions on your harness belay loop , if your second falls your belay loop is being pulled down by your belay device , and up or sideways where you are tied into an anchor...I would at least be daisied in somehow separate of the belay loop in that scenario ....

i usually clove hitch into the shelf with a locking biner and belay the follower from the masterpoint in guide mode

I use the clove hitch to clipped to the masterpoint to attach myself without any other form of attachment. I see no need to add more stuff into the system. The only time I do not do this is when I am transitioning from going up to rappelling down.

vincent L. wrote:Clove hitch into a master point , plus a daisy into a separate piece, and belay off your harness... Sometimes multiple clove hitches into separate pieces ... I have also seen fellow climbers just clip themselves directly into the master point through a locking carabiner to their belay loop. This seems risky as you can create a pull in two different directions on your harness belay loop , if your second falls your belay loop is being pulled down by your belay device , and up or sideways where you are tied into an anchor...I would at least be daisied in somehow separate of the belay loop in that scenario ....

Your second falls and explodes your belay..wtf?

Sounds like you have bigger problems

Kevin Bradford wrote:i usually clove hitch into the shelf with a locking biner and belay the follower from the masterpoint in guide mode

That's how I roll

vincent L. wrote: This seems risky as you can create a pull in two different directions on your harness belay loop , if your second falls your belay loop is being pulled down by your belay device , and up or sideways where you are tied into an anchor...

Because tri-axial loading can cause your belay loop to fail?

I think you're a bit confused on this.

This exploding belay has really become an issue recently. Just yesterday my buddy fell with like 6 inches of slack out, and my belay just simply exploded wtf?!? This is now another case of exploding belay...???? has anyone else experienced this? Any older timers? How did you deal with the follower falling and you belay exploding?

John Marsella wrote:I had 3 belays explode at the gym in the past week.

I probably will know after someone explains but what is an exploding belay?

climbing2man wrote: I probably will know after someone explains but what is an exploding belay?

For that matter, what the hell does "going indirect" mean?

Yah....I've been climbing trad, sport, ice, and now (gulp!) bouldering for twenty years. Never once heard of an "exploding" belay. Sounds like bodies would be flying off 700 ft up or else belayers with a REAL bad bowl of linguini. Think I would hear about this kinda thing.

Can anyone offer a detailed, comprehensive definition of what an exploding belay is supposed to be?

Marc801 wrote: For that matter, what the hell does "going indirect" mean?

Indirect is defined as being attached directly to an anchor, bolt or anything else in which you are no longer under the weight of the rope and if the belayer goes off belay, you will be safe, since your indirect into the anchor.

Several top level scientologists have linked exploding belays to the use of vaccines. Did you know that OSHA knew about this FOR TEN YEARS and intenionally under reported this type of equipment failure??

If you vaccinate, you can explode your belay.

If not for me, do it for the future pseudo-science of the country, nay...the world...

climbing2man wrote: Indirect is defined as being attached directly to an anchor, bolt or anything else in which you are no longer under the weight of the rope and if the belayer goes off belay, you will be safe, since your indirect into the anchor.

I think you mean "in directly". You seem to be confused about "you're" and "your" as well.

in·di·rect
ˌindəˈrekt/
adjective
adjective: indirect

1.not directly caused by or resulting from something.
"full employment would have an indirect effect on wage levels"
synonyms: incidental, accidental, unintended, unintentional, secondary, subordinate, ancillary, concomitant
"an indirect effect"
not done directly; conducted through intermediaries.
"the nature of the threat can be pieced together only from indirect evidence"
(of costs) deriving from overhead charges or subsidiary work.
(of taxation) levied on goods and services rather than income or profits.

2.(of a route) not straight; not following the shortest way.
synonyms: roundabout, circuitous, wandering, meandering, serpentine, winding, tortuous, zigzag
"the indirect route"

Shit! I kneeeeew the Communists were behind this! Probably in cahoots with retro-bolters, too!

What is belay?

Seriously guys, what is cancer?

Does going indirect in the OP's comment mean building the anchor/master point and then anchoring himself to this? OP can answer this.

Kevin Bradford explained the method I usually go to.

This keeps the belay clean, easy to inspect the master point/belay device, and your direct link to the anchor individually. This also allows the use of the shelf carabiner as a pulley for lowering the second.

Depends on the situation.

I would advise learning multiple ways to get the job done in a safe manner so that you have a versatile knowledge of how to overcome different problems you may come to find.

Edit:
You guys are hilarious. I did not see the previous posts. :)

Use bottled water and you shouldn't have any more exploding belays

Use a PAS if you don't wanna use the rope.

I have primarily used an anchor built with the rope clove hitched into pieces and back to a locking biner on my belay loop for years. All of this concern over the clove hitch is unwarranted IMHO. And, three way loading on the belay loop is 100% OK.