Preventing the sling from unclipping from the biner

Scott McMahon wrote: A locker on every draw on a 50+ meter pitch? I think safety is important, but who is really going to do this?

I think Steve was suggesting to use a locker only on pieces of gear (or bolts) that are critical to keeping you off the deck in the event of a fall; that might only be the first two or three bolts of a typical sport route around these parts and maybe the same number of pieces of gear on a gear route. It depends, of course, on the difficulty of the moves, the spacing of the gear, and how likely it is that you might fall.

Dave Holliday wrote: I think Steve was suggesting to use a locker only on pieces of gear (or bolts) that are critical to keeping you off the deck in the event of a fall; that might only be the first two or three bolts of a typical sport route around these parts and maybe the same number of pieces of gear on a gear route. It depends, of course, on the difficulty of the moves, the spacing of the gear, and how likely it is that you might fall.

Thanks for the clarification Dave. Yeah that's something that I practice, although not all the time. I've used lockers or opposed two draws when I have etc.

Joan Lee wrote:What about auto locking lockers? Does anybody make a small one of those?

Edelrid pure slider. At 42g it is light too.

Expensive though.

Greg D wrote: Also, do the laws of physics change when doing multi pitch vs cragging? Hmm.

The laws of physics don't change, but the maximum fall factor does. In single pitch climbing (cragging) it is (usually *) impossible to get a fall-factor that exceeds one. This can occur in multi-pitch climbing, and the possibility is present in most cases when the leader sets out from the belay on the 2nd (and later) pitches. (And, dealing with this possibility should be a consideration when engaged in multi-pitch climbing.)

(* usually: there are occasional single-pitch climbs that start from a ledge, in some such cases, a fall-factor greater than one may be possible. Usually, though, a leader would hit the ground before a FF > 1 could be achieved. )

Wow the sliders look sweet! At 18 bucks a piece surely steep but if you only need about 6 of them still not such a bad deal. I'm getting those! In the meantime I have some huge auto locking biners I will experiment with in the next few weeks for clipping. I'm also replacing my first 3 sport draw rope side biners with small lockers too. It's worth to spend some time with tightening the gate and get into the habit of it.

Be careful with those sliders…

I have been testing one out for awhile now, and the gate can stay open!
If you clip something and let the gate snap shut it usually works just fine.
If you slowly clip something, or another words let the locking mechanism
go to the locked position before the gate closes… You have a problem.

Look at the "sweet gate" photo. Hold the gate open, and take thumb off of lock.
If this happens you can simply open the gate up wide, and let it snap shut.
That solution always seems to work for the most part.

Anyway point is: Pay attention!

PS: They are real easy to clip! Rope or bolt..

I've experienced the same issue with the Omega Pacific Jake Auto Locker.

Well ye we all are supposed to pay attention period. I relate it to my job a lot. When I'm passing meds it's not about how fast and how easy it's about how redundant and safe to avoid swiss cheese effect. We have a saying " you can always give more but you can never take it away" (talking about meds). Critical thinking is huge. In climbing (even cragging) top mental agility is a must. We can get hurt, others can get hurt. Take your time and be a nerd to wear that helmet, check that draw , tie that knot and lock that biner. Break that complacency not that bone!

Joan Lee wrote:Wow the sliders look sweet! At 18 bucks a piece surely steep but if you only need about 6 of them still not such a bad deal. I'm getting those! In the meantime I have some huge auto locking biners I will experiment with in the next few weeks for clipping. I'm also replacing my first 3 sport draw rope side biners with small lockers too. It's worth to spend some time with tightening the gate and get into the habit of it.

Do you mind posting a detailed review after you use one for a while? I'm thinking about getting these too, but like 10 of those and you can buy an entire rack!

Plus they do add some weight. No worse than any solid gates out there but at this point I'm all wire gates already.

I sure will. I will post my opinion and comparison review. I rack up for a pitch so weight is not a huge problem. Those days are gone when I brought my entire rack to use for a 50 ft pitch. ;)

I second what Joan says about mental agility... I've climbed stoned once(alone of course) and I almost shit my pants out of fear (would that be a brown point or just a red point?).. Never climb while intoxicated or even sleepy, you very well may die or at least shit yourself

David Gibbs wrote: The laws of physics don't change, but the maximum fall factor does. In single pitch climbing (cragging) it is (usually *) impossible to get a fall-factor that exceeds one. This can occur in multi-pitch climbing, and the possibility is present in most cases when the leader sets out from the belay on the 2nd (and later) pitches. (And, dealing with this possibility should be a consideration when engaged in multi-pitch climbing.) (* usually: there are occasional single-pitch climbs that start from a ledge, in some such cases, a fall-factor greater than one may be possible. Usually, though, a leader would hit the ground before a FF > 1 could be achieved. )

Thanks for the elementary explanation of fall factors. That was cute.

Now back to the regularly scheduled program: preventing a rope or sling from unclipping inadvertently where fall factor may not be a factor.

I can't decide if this thread is a joke or not.

eli poss wrote:I second what Joan says about mental agility... I've climbed stoned once(alone of course) and I almost shit my pants out of fear (would that be a brown point or just a red point?).. Never climb while intoxicated or even sleepy, you very well may die or at least shit yourself

Considering your age and climbing skills the word "stoned" should not even be in your vocabulary. But I like the fact that you recognize paranoia as a side effect of marijuana and are able to put two and two together. 90 % of people on this site are recreational marijuana users and tend to glorify it quite a bit. Take it with a grain of salt and keep on the right track.

Joan Lee wrote:Well ye...When I'm passing meds it's not about how fast and how easy it's about how redundant and safe to avoid swiss cheese effect.

Uhhmm, WTF??

I would suggest further mastication when popping your Flintstones chewables. This will aid in digestion and help produce firmer stools.

Ryan-G wrote:I can't decide if this thread is a joke or not.

Ugh it's doing the typical 4 page slide into nonsense, bickering and Joan's anti-marijuana crusade which is found in like 3 other threads.

Thanks everyone for the input on the sling dilemma.

Locker wrote:"Never tie an overhand in a dyneema sling as it reduces strength" ALL knots reduce strength on ropes, cord, webbing, etc...

Just because it's you locker...Couldn't resist :o)

Saw this new product in another thread on MP - looks like it's designed to prevent the very issue discussed in this thread. I couldn't find any info on pricing, but it looks like they're supposed to be available now

gearjunkie.com/best-in-show…