Climber falls in Eldorado Canyon

bearbreeder wrote: thanks for the vid note that this can be prevented with cloving the rope end biner to the dyneema sling while impractical for those make extendable draws, if you carry your single/double length slings over your shoulder with a single biner it works fine even if one strands goes through the gate itll still hold one could also make their own snake cord or use a rabbit runner from metolius/yates ... these are much less likely fail in the mode shown my example is made with 7mm cord, but you can easily use ~5mm tech cord for a ~15+ kn rating after knots and to keep it light and less bulky metoliusclimbing.com/rabbit… yatesgear.com/climbing/slin…

yeah.... this makes me think back to a forum I posted on the death of that young Italian climber last year (I had misunderstood the nature of the accident at the time) and posted this mountainproject.com/v/trad-….
Contained within are the general backlash to the clove idea because of convenience mostly.

I was swayed that cloving the biner on an extender was a bad idea at the time by all the replies, but this was not considering this new failure mode. now this makes me rethink again! Maybe clove the biner and have it over the shoulder in cases where if the pro failed it'd be catastrophic. But if you're extending anyway its likely to be the case.

All the best in the recovery of the injured climber.

I believe the movement is random.

More photos of Wayne can be seen HERE!
(They are positive happy photos!)

When you see him, you think of him… Energy flows!

Great news Ben, thanks

Wayne, you are in my thoughts and prayers. Recover quickly!

Heal up Wayne!

We're all sending love & healing vibes Wayne, you're one of the most positive & resilient people I've ever met. You can get through this. There was a huge gathering of the tribe/pack at the Monday meeting last night sending Strength & Love. Praying for you & all those close to you. C'mon Wayne!

I'd like to respectfully suggest the tribe brainstorm the best way to create and promote a charitable fund for the Crill's. Much love and support to Kaiden, Tessie and Wayne.

This is Steve DeLaney, Tess's brother. You guys are such a wonderful and supportive community.

We are working on putting together a donation fund for them, and we would love to coordinate it with anyone to make it the easiest for them.

Please email me with any ideas or thoughts. sdelane22003@yahoo.com
Thanks again...

Ted Angus wrote: yeah.... this makes me think back to a forum I posted on the death of that young Italian climber last year (I had misunderstood the nature of the accident at the time) and posted this mountainproject.com/v/trad-…. Contained within are the general backlash to the clove idea because of convenience mostly. I was swayed that cloving the biner on an extender was a bad idea at the time by all the replies, but this was not considering this new failure mode. now this makes me rethink again! Maybe clove the biner and have it over the shoulder in cases where if the pro failed it'd be catastrophic. But if you're extending anyway its likely to be the case. All the best in the recovery of the injured climber.

I've been trying to get more into trad climbing in the last year and often wondered if this could happen with a long extension. Its always given me a bit of anxiety clipping an extension when it seems that there is nothing keeping the draw in the correct position.

I think from now on, I'm going to use the clove hitch method. Like you said, theres really no cons to it other than connivence, and unless your climbing above your limit whats an extra couple seconds to make sure your good placement isn't for nothing.

Even if its 1 in 1000 (or 10000) chance of this happening, it seems too easily preventable to risk.

Fundraising. Depends on the scale of the effort required. Also on what insurance/medicaid/medicare options exist. One option is for a person to open a bank account dedicated for the fundraising effort. This worked well for raising funds toward Steve Dieckhoff's end-of-life living expenses (over and above his medical expenses). This works for a close-knit group where everyone knows each other. Trouble can arise if things become larger, more complex and the various accounting/collecting issues grow hard for one person to manage. A lot of trust is required in the person responsible.

Another option for fundraising is to use YouCaring.com. They take a small cut of money raised but it's entirely open, transparent and can reach many more people; does not require any one person to be responsible for stashing/collecting/accounting for/disbursing all the money. Here, the Layton Kor page is still up (though it closed a year ago):

youcaring.com/memorial-fund…

Maybe this was all covered already? If so, sorry, just trying to help.

Prayers and good vibes to Wayne and Tess !

Wayne at baloon

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Wayne Crille in baloon

Seneca April 2014

Charlie Jonas wrote:I think from now on, I'm going to use the clove hitch method. Like you said, theres really no cons to it other than connivence

Well, you would need to come up with a different way to store your long draws, that's for sure. Having double length slings free-hanging off your harness isn't really safe.

Sad to hear and best wishes on a speedy recovery.

So I see how this accident happened, but what can you do? clove hitch every draw or put a locker on each one? I think you can only mitigate and prepare for so much. I'm sure there is alot of one in a million things that can happen in climbing but that's part of the risk.

So sure if you have a sketchy place where you can pull off a clove or throw a locker on risky first clip go for it. Awesome, safety first. You have 12-20 alpine draws though and you are going to wear them all over your shoulder or lock them all?

Let's be realistic. How much could Wayne have REALLY prevented this?

Do wiregate/non-locking gridlock biners exist? I've only ever seen lockers with the gridlock feature, which is overkill for 99.99% of the time. If such a piece existed, it would prevent this failure mechanism while still being lightweight and practical.

Scott McMahon wrote:Sad to hear and best wishes on a speedy recovery. So I see how this accident happened, but what can you do? clove hitch every draw or put a locker on each one? I think you can only mitigate and prepare for so much. I'm sure there is alot of one in a million things that can happen in climbing but that's part of the risk. So sure if you have a sketchy place where you can pull off a clove or throw a locker on risky first clip go for it. Awesome, safety first. You have 12-20 alpine draws though and you are going to wear them all over your shoulder or lock them all? Let's be realistic. How much could Wayne have REALLY prevented this?

this really should be a separate thread ...

but there is something to be said for long draws/rabbit runners/snake cord



ill start another thread about it to leave this about the climber and best wishes

Thinking about you Wayne.

Patrick Shyvers wrote: Well, you would need to come up with a different way to store your long draws, that's for sure. Having double length slings free-hanging off your harness isn't really safe.

The way I currently rack my double lengths over the shoulder will work well with an added clove hitch.

Clove the sling to a single biner, then wrap the sling over the shoulder, bring the cloved binder back to meet the other part if the sling and clip it. You have a closed loop that crosses basically shoulder to opposite hip. An added benefit to racking this way is to access the sling, unclip the biner from the end that is not cloved and pull.

JeffL wrote: The way I currently rack my double lengths over the shoulder will work well with an added clove hitch. Clove the sling to a single biner, then wrap the sling over the shoulder, bring the cloved binder back to meet the other part if the sling and clip it. You have a closed loop that crosses basically shoulder to opposite hip. An added benefit to racking this way is to access the sling, unclip the biner from the end that is not cloved and pull.

Interesting, that is a thought provoking idea. I usually wear slings bandoleer-style, which gets absolutely unmanageable with more than 4-8 slings.