First set of cams?

So my family (4 sons, wife and I) have been sport climbing/top roping for a couple years, and are just starting to do some trad. Looking for advice on first set of cams to purchase. Brand, model, sizes, etc... We are from Southern IL, and climb a lot at Jackson Falls, Giant city, Fern Cliff. Have made a couple trips to Moab and New River Gorge.

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Get a set of c4's

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anything smaller than the purple I would do master cams.

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I'm sure the x4's are awesome but I'm not willing to drop the extra dollars on them.

I've had good luck with the DMM wall nuts.

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I would say unless you are going to double up on the hand size cams you will need some hexs', but if you plan on going with double cams in the hand range I would look at the helium friends.

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Then don't forget your alpine draws, pick your favorite beaner and pick up 10 60cm slings, and 1 or 2 120 slings. I would suggest dyneema because it's lighter and takes up less room which is nice when fishing for a piece to plug into the wall.

If you do a search here you'll find thread after thread on the pros and cons of different cams.

You might have missed the 4th of July sales, but I'd either go with a set of BD C4's which everyone has, OR a set of metolious power cams if you are looking to save money.

I started on the power cams and they can do anything you want with a low price point. BD's are pretty much on everyone's rack.

I'd also probably recommend buying some cams here off MP. I've found that everyone is very descriptive about what you are getting in regards to wires, slings and falls. Hardware is much more transferable.

Or here.
geartrade.com/browse/protec…

I'm a new trad climber as well, with most of my experience being in Southern Illinois (Jackson and Cedar).

I agree with the C4s (0.5 through 3).

I've also gotten a fair bit of use out of my tricam evos, given how many pockets there are in Southern IL sandstone.

I love my DMM Wallnuts and Alloy Offsets, but don't find myself placing them very often in Southern Illinois.

Thanks for the responses. I was thinking a set of C4's to start, but it never hurts to get some first hand reviews.

For my first set of cams I got WC Heliums from size zero to 3.5. Really nice, and light. They've caught my falls perfectly, and I love them. Oh, and I never have to worry about mixing up gear with friends who all have C4's! I recently got a set of X4's to double up on the small sizes. Haven't had them for as long but they complement the heliums perfectly (the corresponding sizes of both fit in slightly different placements, which is handy.)

Dont get sucked into drinking the BD Koolaid. C4s are phenomenal (you can't go wrong) but I just got a set of WC Heliums and I absolutely love them (sizes 1-3.5)! I love having six cams for one set rather than the 5 from BD. I have two sets of BD C4s and I now always rack with Heliums with couple BDs to fill gap.

Pros
Balance
Cam Angle
Longer stem for deeper placement (really love this feature)
Great cam range (not as big as BD)
Often find them on sale cuz everyone wants BDs

Cons
Sling is slung tight (already loosening up with use)

This is very subjective/opinion but they just seem more complete and fit in more spots. Often times with C4s I will be in between two sizes where one size is too small and another is no big and the WC Heliums just fit perfectly.

Whatever you do dont get anything smaller than a BD C4 0.5 Purple or WC Helium 1.0 Gold. Get smaller more flexible cams for that (totem, aliens, master, x4s).

Congrads, you cant go wrong.

Josh Allred wrote:Dont get sucked into drinking the BD Koolaid. C4s are phenomenal (you can't go wrong) but I just got a set of WC Heliums and I absolutely love them (sizes 1-3.5)! I love having six cams for one set rather than the 5 from BD. I have two sets of BD C4s and I now always rack with Heliums with couple BDs to fill gap. Pros Balance Cam Angle Longer stem for deeper placement (really love this feature) Great cam range (not as big as BD) Often find them on sale cuz everyone wants BDs Cons Sling is slung tight (already loosening up with use) This is very subjective/opinion but they just seem more complete and fit in more spots. Often times with C4s I will be in between two sizes where one size is too small and another is no big and the WC Heliums just fit perfectly. Whatever you do dont get anything smaller than a BD C4 0.5 Purple or WC Helium 1.0 Gold. Get smaller more flexible cams for that (totem, aliens, master, x4s). Congrads, you cant go wrong.

As far as the offsetting of cams you'll hear alot of opinions but myself in a double rack it's C4s for one rack and my complimentary second rack is metolius TCUs and WC flexible friends. That way I have different head sizes with similar camming ranges. The TCU's and smaller headed WC fit in the places that the larger 4 lobed BD's don't.

Any decent cam will work just fine ... Period

Any major good name brand makes excellent cams ... Dmm,wc,bd,metolius ... Period

If you plan to use these for leading trad later ... I suggest going to a store and playing with them to see which ones feel the bes and smoothest to your hands

One thing i do suggest is to get cams with the BD (camalots, dragons) or metolius colour scheme as 90%+ of folks in north america use one or the other (i made up that stat buts its true !!!)

That way yr partners can easily use yr cams when joining racks

For smaller cams, any decent ones will work ... Aliens,tcus, BDs, mastercams, etc

Theres advantages and disadvantages to each cam ... But as a beginner i suggest just going out and getting a set of camalot/dragons or tcu/powercams ...

;)

Don't believe all the hate on the smaller than .5 C4s.
The .4 C4 is a great piece and I use it all the time. The .3 maybe starts getting a little weird geometry, I can seen opting for a different cam for that size.

I have an entire rack of wild country technical friends I think I'm going to sell. Got them from a friend who got them new. Never fall on, probably never even weighted. I need to dig them out and take pictures.
Really good cams, they were the gold standard until the c4's came out. Still fantastic cams.

You might avoid these... the nyla-nuts on the axles tend to wear out.... ;)

Craig Childre wrote:You might avoid these... the nyla-nuts on the axles tend to wear out.... ;)

Gear4Rocks?

Morgan Patterson wrote: Gear4Rocks?

Early Camalots maybe?

a point about the small blue and grey camalot/dragons ... as well as the equivalent helium friends

those suckers are passively rated as well ... other than the WC zeros and the larger X4s, few smaller cams other than those are rated as such

IMO cams that are passively rated have an advantage, especially smaller cams ... while we are all perfect on the intrawebs and never make anything but perfect placements in absolutely parallel cracks ...

the reality is that when you are at your limit,pumped out of your mind, having used up most of your nuts down below, and need to get something in an irregular internally flaring slightly constricting crack ... youll be glad off the passive rating on those cams

of course the there are often tradeoff in therms of headwidth, flexibility, etc ... on the small blue/grey camalot/dragon over the equivalent TCU/alien/mastercam

the baby blue dragon (and before i blew the springs apart, the blue camalot) is one of my most whipped on pieces ... it works just fine in squamish

every cam has advantages and disadvantages

;)

Gear 4 Rocks... clones of the early BD's. "not pretty or trendy"

Just from personal experience, the .5-3 BD set seems to be a universal early purchase for building a trad rack. Each set of cams have their pros and their cons and I also recommend that you go into a store and play around with a few to get a feel for the camming action. Its more important that you are confident placing the cam rather than what type of cam it is. That said, here's my basic set up (I own doubles of everything in the middle ranges)

Smaller placements are all nut placements
#0 Master cam
#1 Master cam - #1 Master cam
#2 Master cam - matching totem cam
#3 Master cam - matching totem cam
.75 BD - matching totem cam
1 BD - matching totem cam
2 BD - 2 BD
3 BD
4 BD

There are a few types I tend to avoid in my experience. Some people love em, but I've found them to either be uninspiring or difficult to use.

Master cams bigger than .89 in: The stems to the larger master cams feel extraordinarily flimsy
BD C3's: Probably my most hated camming unit. not a fan.

Otherwise its all relative. My favorite cams are the Totem cams. Slightly more expensive and more interesting to use (read about them before purchasing if you do) but they 'feel' more secure than others and can be used in a few different, creative fashions.

Also, get good at placing passive pro. It's less expensive if you mess up and lighter to haul around, among thousands of other benefits.

I'd definitely recommend at least the #1-3 in BD cams though. They are the jam (pun intended).

C3's...yeah I didn't ever have or care for them till I used my buddy's in Eldo. When they work they fricken work, but I wouldn't run to put them on my first rack.

gearexpress.com has all their cams 25% off till tomorrow at midnight which is a good deal. But as many have stated before C4s from .5 - 3 are great! For my personal rack i've got .75 - 5 C4's and then 1 -4 of the Metolius TCU's (finger size).