Strength training for general fitness?

Ryan Watts wrote: It's weightlifting -- you pick up heavy shit then you put it back down. No need to overcomplicate things.

yeah why do we have this training subforum anyway? i mean it's climbing, you just pull up stuff and don't let go

slim wrote: so, you're a hiker. that's nice.

Yeah....some walls are a long way away. I only hike to get to a wall. What's your point? I'd have kept my mouth shut, but morons start throwing homophobic rhetoric around when someone mentions a legit form of training....then I get called a troll? Figures.....

Ryan Watts wrote: I really did almost include a bodyweight factor in there but I figured no one would be ridiculous enough to internet nitpick like that. To clarify for the internet pink dumbell warriors: For an adult male of average proportions and bf%, a deadlift of approximately 1.5x bodyweight. Or, in the case of the OP, who I believe is somewhere north of 200lbs but currently dieting, approximately 3 plates or 315lbs. Go back to trolling school. It has failed you. Looool. Now THAT is a quality troll post. My first thought was that you should have upped the spray to include something actually impressive, but upon reflection I think that "50-60lb pack on the approach to some alpine wall at *gasp* 11k" adds a whole new dimension. Well done sir.

"gasp"? Lol.....I never said 11K was high.....you're reaching at best here.

Dan Austin wrote: yeah why do we have this training subforum anyway? i mean it's climbing, you just pull up stuff and don't let go

So we're not allowed to have the opinion that some people overcomplicate training?

If you disagree, that's cool, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe bosu ball dumbbell workouts ARE the best way to get strong.

As I said in my original post it's "just my opinion".

WyomingSummits wrote:"gasp"? Lol.....I never said 11K was high.....you're reaching at best here.

Honestly, I had never considered the possibility that your post calling me a "yuppie boulderer" and the explaining the training regimen needed to be able to carry a 50lb pack at 11k was intended to be anything other than a troll post.

Wait...

...well played, sir, well played.

Ryan Watts wrote: So we're not allowed to have the opinion that some people overcomplicate training? If you disagree, that's cool, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe bosu ball dumbbell workouts ARE the best way to get strong. As I said in my original post it's "just my opinion". Honestly, I had never considered the possibility that your post calling me a "yuppie boulderer" and the explaining the training regimen needed to be able to carry a 50lb pack at 11k was intended to be anything other than a troll post. Wait... ...well played, sir, well played.

Huh? The yuppie boulderer wasn't directed at you at all dude.....you need to relax. I have no idea what you climb, nor do I care.

Aerili wrote: It is not uncommon to have strong primary movers but weak stabilizers. In which case you can still pull a lot of weight and your stabilizers will not "limit" this. But they do have an effect on your movement quality and ability at some point if this is not corrected, often in the form of problematic biomechanical patterns which can cause pain/injury, or range of motion issues (either too little or too much), or decreases/plateaus in performance, and so forth. There are lots of reasons to employ a wide variety of training techniques which challenge stability and movement coordination vs simply always pure strength and recruitment. Neither is really "superior" as a stand-alone but rather create a more holistic training program when combined. But there is no point for me to waste my time writing anymore about this here, clearly. I hope some posters here have made sure to spread their undoubtedly wide-ranging scientific expertise to other mediums on the Internet and not just limited themselves to our small reading audience.

Meh, ignore the trolls.

I appreciate your advice and understand what you're getting at.

Thank you for your well thought out and researched replies. You've been a great help.

Dan Austin wrote: yeah why do we have this training subforum anyway? i mean it's climbing, you just pull up stuff and don't let go

Well fuck, dat's what I've been doing wrong all these years! Pulling!

I'll be leading .14's in no time now!

5.samadhi wrote:Tldr every muscle in your body will be stronger than any of those bosu ball lifters will if you can rep out four plates per side

TDDR.

Aerili wrote: It is not uncommon to have strong primary movers but weak stabilizers. In which case you can still pull a lot of weight and your stabilizers will not "limit" this. But they do have an effect on your movement quality and ability at some point if this is not corrected, often in the form of problematic biomechanical patterns which can cause pain/injury, or range of motion issues (either too little or too much), or decreases/plateaus in performance, and so forth. There are lots of reasons to employ a wide variety of training techniques which challenge stability and movement coordination vs simply always pure strength and recruitment. Neither is really "superior" as a stand-alone but rather create a more holistic training program when combined. But there is no point for me to waste my time writing anymore about this here, clearly. I hope some posters here have made sure to spread their undoubtedly wide-ranging scientific expertise to other mediums on the Internet and not just limited themselves to our small reading audience.

Thank you for your insight. Some people are purely negative and don't care about genuine contribution......just ignore them. Good natured sarcasm is one thing, but the bitter vitriol on these forums gets old. :)

Yes, this whole forum went to a bad place, but the discussion of whether a bosu ball adds value. It is not hard to find at least some research suggesting otherwise:
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/194…

CONCLUSIONS:

The current study did not demonstrate any advantage in utilizing the BOSU Balance Trainer. Therefore, fitness trainers should be advised that each of the aforementioned lifts can be performed while standing on stable ground without losing the potential core muscle training benefits.

You want to get strong, don't use a Bosu ball and lift heavy (with proper form) which was recommended by 5s and Ryan.
You have movement/stability issues and/or pain- get some training to address the weaknesses and fix them and use proper form (Aerili).

SMR wrote: You want to get strong, don't use a Bosu ball and lift heavy (with proper form) which was recommended by 5s and Ryan. You have movement/stability issues and/or pain- get some training to address the weaknesses and fix them and use proper form (Aerili).

For the record, I advocate doing all of it...in case anyone missed that. :)

Also, I never listed any exercise using a Bosu Ball. They are different from Swiss balls. I have never thought doing things like deadlifts, squats, etc. on top of balls or other stability devices was a good idea. More like just circus tricks.

P.S. That study did not mention how they assessed activity (maybe if I get the full article it will). If it was EMG (surface or wire?), I know for a fact that such analysis on many muscles is difficult to obtain cleanly and consistently, particularly across multiple individuals, and the results are often far from ideal or easy to interpret. I know because I've done this type of research. So, I now question muscle activity studies a bit sometimes. That said, I agree with the study's conclusion to perform the lifts they mentioned via standard methods.

I use a bosu, wobbly boards and the other balance disk thingy when doing exercises. I snowboard quite a bit so I try to build up those stabalizer muscles, which seems to work quite well for the olympic riders. In fact to the point most of their workouts are core/balance ball based. Most are either body weight or w/ light weights, but I certainly wouldn't call them "circus tricks".

^ what muscles are you hitting as stabilizer muscles?

5.samadhi wrote:^ what muscles are you hitting as stabilizer muscles?

These ones...

Stabilizer muscles

Scott McMahon wrote: These ones...

I honestly do not believe you know what a "stabilizer muscle" is.

5.samadhi wrote: I honestly do not believe you know what a "stabilizer muscle" is.

Have to do at least a thousand reps.

5.samadhi wrote: I honestly do not believe you know what a "stabilizer muscle" is.

Ok my muscles that ACT as stabilizers for my joints. Is that better doctor???

Scott McMahon wrote: Ok my muscles that ACT as stabilizers for my joints. Is that better doctor???

I'm not trying to be a dick, but no that is not better honestly. You just rephrased the phrase "stabilizer muscle" to "muscle that acts as stabilizer for my joints"

I still contend that you have no idea what "muscle that acts as stabilizer for my joints" is.*

Training on a balance ball or any kind of ball (bosu, etc) is for hot chicks in those tight black shorts in the gym so they can look hot. Its not actually for getting stronger or "stabilizing your joints".

If you want to actually get stronger then you have to progressively overload a barbell with weight.

• HINT: its a meaningless phrase

Well I'm glad to see that this thread has turned into a dick waving contest.

Chad Miller wrote:Well I'm glad to see that this thread has turned into a dick waving contest.

Welcome to the internet.